Making My Own 45 Caliber Jacketed Swaging Dies

[Traffer]

Yeah we have thought that too. We are going to see how one goes and then decide. I tried calling hornady and asking what type of steel they use but no one would tell me. All I was told it is a proprietary tool steel that is hardened. The guy who runs the custom shop is out for the week at a show. I emailed him and I'm hoping he will get back to me soon. I could possibly be worth while seeing what they have to say buy I have feeling it will be no.

Another thing we have considered is cutting the die shorter ( the 308 die is the shortest of all three ) and setting up a fixture to use diamond bits to grind the ojive into the die body instead of machining them.

This is where the idea came up of making one die body and then different nose form punches to use in the press ram. It would be much easier to make forms that way instead of trying to get all the way into the die body.

In my experience they are all made from slightly differing steels. Some can be machined and certain operations can be done while others are out of the question. I don't know about annealing...perhaps that could be done but from what I have been able to ascertain they have to be heated for a long time to anneal...like all day.

[Iron45acp]

Here is my new design for my swaging punches. Just made the punch smaller and to stay in the neck.

[Iron45acp]

Well I messed around today and finished a die using a 308 Winchester. First I lapped the inside to get the diameter to .453". I just used a 7/16" oak dowel and valve lapping compound. It didn't take long but with some patience and some measuring tools it came out perfect. Then I made the two bottom punches using 1/2-20 grade 8 bolts. One punch to swage the cores into the jackets and another to swage the entire bullet. Then I made a internal punch for inside the die. I took a 3/8" bolt and made a step from .330 to .250 to fit inside the adjustable stem. It only is a flat point but I think it turned out pretty good.

I used speer 4678 lead bullets that I found a great deal on at a local gun show. I bought a couple thousand of them ha. They weigh 200 grains. I just use Lee sizing dies to bring it down to .430" then .410". They fit perfect inside the jackets.

The bullets came out to 225 grains using a .45x.500 copper jacket.

Next I'll be messing around with different nose punches and then moving on to the 243 Winchester die. That too is already lapped out to .453" and ready to figure out how to do a nose punch for it.

As well a these turned out I'd really like to figure out how to do a nice rounded ojive, but I'll eventually get to that point I guess.

[Traffer]

Very nice indeed. Are you using half jacket cups?

[Iron45acp]

I'm not sure what you mean. The place I bought them from sells them in .500, .580, and .680 lengths. I just bought .500 and .580 and I haven't messed with the .580 yet.

[clodhopper]

Good looking bullets. The way you used your lee size dies to make your cores fit is commendable.

With your .243 die, you could make the nose punch cone shaped, and extend into the bullet to form a hollow point.

My current project is to make some .452 bullets, with annealed and down sized 45 auto cases for jackets. The plan is to use Lee .40-180 TC TL cast bullets for cores.

Yesterday I took a RCBS 7X57 size die and cut the cartridge body interior to about .448. left the neck and shoulder.
Then started polishing. The cut starts about 1/3 of the distance from the base of the die to the shoulder.

Unfortunately I did not think ahead enough about the square lip formed at the shoulder.

From my measuring, the die is about .002 smaller that cartridge specs. I suppose that is to allow for brass spring back. The diameter at the shoulder was about .427. After opening the diameter to .448 the square face inside was about .0105"
It's going to take a lot of polishing.

An old CH-4D steel .357 mag die body might become a core seat die for the project.

Gun show coming up near here in a couple weeks, if the roads are good I will go troll around for old dies to cut on.

Really starting to like my 3/16 carbide indexable boring bar.

[Traffer]

Good looking bullets. The way you used your lee size dies to make your cores fit is commendable.

With your .243 die, you could make the nose punch cone shaped, and extend into the bullet to form a hollow point.

My current project is to make some .452 bullets, with annealed and down sized 45 auto cases for jackets. The plan is to use Lee .40-180 TC TL cast bullets for cores.

Yesterday I took a RCBS 7X57 size die and cut the cartridge body interior to about .448. left the neck and shoulder.
Then started polishing. The cut starts about 1/3 of the distance from the base of the die to the shoulder.

Unfortunately I did not think ahead enough about the square lip formed at the shoulder.

From my measuring, the die is about .002 smaller that cartridge specs. I suppose that is to allow for brass spring back. The diameter at the shoulder was about .427. After opening the diameter to .448 the square face inside was about .0105"
It's going to take a lot of polishing.

An old CH-4D steel .357 mag die body might become a core seat die for the project.

Gun show coming up near here in a couple weeks, if the roads are good I will go troll around for old dies to cut on.

Really starting to like my 3/16 carbide indexable boring bar.

I have started using carbide concrete drill bits for drilling steel on the lathe. I sharpen them with a dremel type diamond wheel ...when sharpened correctly they cut hard steel like butter, and very precisely to boot. It is nice to get good carbide tools for a couple bucks per tool.

[Iron45acp]

I'm actually looking into buying a harbor freight mini lathe for at home. It is pretty hard to do this stuff at my buddy's place and have all my reloading stuff at home. To be honest all the stuff I posted yesterday I did at home on a drill press because my buddy is out of town for the week. Seems like a hack job but the way it turned out you probably never would have guessed it. It was very time consuming making the nose punch for the 308 die using files and grinders and sandpaper lol.

Before I started anything I sat down with a micrometer and a set of starrett small hole gauges and mapped out each die. They are all hornady new dimension dies. I plan on using the 243 Winchester and 308 Winchester dies as is except with some lapping to .453". The 257 Robert's I'd like to bore out and hopefully form a nice rounded ojive and then possibly use another 257 Robert's to make a rounded ball nose. Then I picked up a 6.8 Remington die to use as a core swage die. I'm hoping to drill out the vent in the shoulder and then use lead wire to bleed off lead cores to perfect weight and shape to use in my jackets. That die I'm not going to touch the dimensions at all. I'm just going to lap the inside to polish it.



Now you can see in the picture there is a 308 N and a 308 O. One is a new die (N) and one is a old die (O) you can see the difference in dimensions. The new dies nose is straight through .329" but the old die cones and then steps down which isn't a area that is used for sizing.

I did mess around with 40 s&w cases but I didn't like the way they turned out. They looked like little bubbles. So I took one of the many old 308 Winchester cases and forced it through a .452 lee sizer. I really liked how it turned out.... it was quite hard to size it down that fast though. I'm going to pick up a .457" and a .454" sizing die and see what I can do with it. I think if I cut the rim off it will make for a nice boat tail bullet with nice heavy jacket walls. The .410" cores I made fit into the case nicely too.

[clodhopper]

Taffer, that's a great idea. Are you using some kind of angle gage to make the cutting edge?

What angle are you using?

[Iron45acp]

I've seen this done on other forums and YouTube but aren't masonary bits just carbide tipped?

[William Yanda]

"We repair what your husband fixed." flyingmonkey35


My boss used to say; " A nickel for the part and $97.95 for installing it correctly."

[clodhopper]

Iron, I have been looking at that vent hole too with the idea of a core swage die.

I have been making and shooting .357 bullets in .223 dies. The shoulder of a sammi spec .223 case is .357 but the case tapers from .375. The bullets made this way all need sized back down to .357 after point forming leaves them about .367. Not the best practice. Shooting at paper, the groups are not great, around 2 minutes.

Taking my little ruger 77-357 rifle out, walking and shooting, I do not feel handicapped by poor bullets. Can't see the difference in my short barreled revolver.


The little harbor freight lathes need some tightening, patience, and operator intelligence, but a step up from a drill press. Some guys do very good work with them. Other guys can't put up with their shortcomings.
I have one, but recently got a bigger lathe.

[Traffer]

Taffer, that's a great idea. Are you using some kind of angle gage to make the cutting edge?

What angle are you using?

I will have to look more closely at them. Basically I just grind a more radical relief with taking some of the back of the steel from behind the cutting edge of the blade. I don't think it makes much difference what angle you use as long as there is a sharp edge with good relief. Those diamond dremel type wheels do quick work of the carbide for sharpening. I will have to do a video on grinding them.

[Traffer]

I've seen this done on other forums and YouTube but aren't masonary bits just carbide tipped?

Yes masonry bits are just carbide tipped BUT, they have very shallow relief off of the cutting edge and they generally do not have a razor sharp edge. After grinding a sharp edge with more relief they cut very nicely.

[Traffer]

I just started using a lathe. I had used a HF benchtop drill press for three years making dies before getting a lathe. The big problem I had was the chuck. I put a 5/8" chuck on the drill press but that was the limit. So I made all the dies out of 5/8 18 grade 8 bolts. I made adapters out of some old dies so I could screw the 5/8" dies into the 7/8 14 dies and use them in a regular press. I have videos and pictures that I can post for you.

[Traffer]

Here is a video of me using a drill press to make dies:
https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...XHzjcdAlRbpq4b

[Iron45acp]

The biggest problem I have with a drill press is getting stuff perfectly centered. Even the stem I made was just the smallest amount off I had to lap that into the adjusting stem. I know there are better ways so I'm going to save for a mini lathe. Little machine shop seems to overcome most problems with the mini lathes and I've read quite a bit of excellent reviews on them. I'm no dummy so I hope I can make one work and if it does then I know my work can be that much better.

I really need to mess with your drill bit designs. That would the perfect way to make a ojive pointed bullet.

[Iron45acp]

At this point I'm not even $100 into this adventure and already producing decent bullets. I'm extremely happy with the way these turned out. So for a $500 investment into a 7"x12" mini lathe and figure maybe another $150 to $200 in tooling I think I can produce much better pieces and be able to do more gunsmithing at home. I also plan on making up the neccessary parts to be able to mill on the mini lathe as well.

[Huvius]

Very cool project!
I think your current boolits look very good right now.
That nice wide flat tip will do just about everything you could ever want in a homemade pistol boolit.
Add a cannelure if you think it’s needed and you are set.

Also, look around your area for a used bench top lathe.
A very capable machine can be had for less than you would think and anything will be a big step up from using a drill press!

[Iron45acp]

I'm going to try them out in one of my S&W 625 revolvers chambered in 45 acp first. Then I'll slowly work them up to 1200 fps using the same revolver but loaded to 45 Super/460 Rowland. If they perform well there I will continue out loading them in 450 Bushmaster up to 2500 fps. I'd really like to recover a few of them in some water jugs and see what they look like.