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Thread: Illegal Shot Placement

  1. #41
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crankycalico View Post
    They have given illegal baiting tickets to elderly people who have bird feeders in their yard and a set of deer tracks by it.
    This makes NO sense to me unless the deer are/were fired upon. Surely there are some details missing . . . . ?
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  2. #42
    Boolit Master

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    There is precedent:

    http://snowmancam.com/DNR.htm

    Nothing on DNR's page that I can find lists bird feeding as a violation:

    http://www.michigandnr.com/publicati...r_Wildlife.htm

    Tips on bird feeding from Michigan.gov:

    https://www.michigan.gov/documents/d...s_264152_7.pdf

    The idea of making "head shooting" a ticket able offense just doesn't stand up under logical scrutiny.
    Last edited by Hamish; 01-08-2019 at 11:15 PM.
    More "This is what happened when I,,,,," and less "What would happen if I,,,,"

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  3. #43
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
    This makes NO sense to me unless the deer are/were fired upon. Surely there are some details missing . . . . ?
    its exactly like that. snowmancam might have had changes created for a short time but if you live in the core CWD or Bovine TB area, you don't want a bird feeder out, especially if you hunt on that property.

    It sucks but the DNR have very lenient powers of search and seizure. They have more power and rights to search someones property then the state police do.

  4. #44
    Boolit Man
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    I have even haerd that the DNR are the only officials that can arrest the US President, but I have never been able to prove or disprove it.

  5. #45
    Boolit Bub
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    Oh deer god (see what I did there?)

  6. #46
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by crankycalico View Post
    They have given illegal baiting tickets to elderly people who have bird feeders in their yard and a set of deer tracks by it.

    I KNOW the trespassing law because it happened to me when I tried to retrieve a deer from an adjacent property.
    I'm glad to hear that you were charged with trespassing. Being charged with a crime doesn't mean the police made up the law.


    If you had a trial then I guess the COURT and the LEGISLATURE had something to do with that law.

    If you didn't have a trial then you acquiesced to your guilt.

    Which was it?

  7. #47
    Boolit Master
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    By the way crankycalico, when you find yourself in a hole, the first thing you should do is STOP DIGGING.

  8. #48
    Boolit Master



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    For LE write a ticket or citation they need to site what code you allegedly violated. Without that it's not a valid citation.
    Last edited by M-Tecs; 01-09-2019 at 01:59 AM.

  9. #49
    Boolit Master
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    crankycalico, lets start with your assertion that it is illegal in Michigan to shoot a deer in the head.

    Show all of us the code section for that law you're referring to. The actual law, not what you heard or what some DNR officer told you.

    I'll deal with the rest of your baseless assertions after we address that first one.
    Last edited by Petrol & Powder; 01-09-2019 at 07:53 AM.

  10. #50
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    Has anyone been convicted? Found guilty in court?
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  11. #51
    Boolit Master

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    This is law in Okie-land.

    If you shoot game, and it crosses onto land for which you have no permission, it's gone. If you go on that land to retrieve the game, you are not only trespassing, but poaching.
    "Varium et mutabile semper femina." - Virgil
    Man, ain't it the truth....

  12. #52
    Boolit Master bikerbeans's Avatar
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    Click image for larger version. 

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  13. #53
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookworm View Post
    This is law in Okie-land.

    If you shoot game, and it crosses onto land for which you have no permission, it's gone. If you go on that land to retrieve the game, you are not only trespassing, but poaching.
    Send your buddy up to the owners house to get permission.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  14. #54
    Boolit Master

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    I don't know of any laws concerning head or neck shots. Arkansas does have restrictions on caliber, pistol barrel length and against FMJ ammo. I've taken many a deer with both head or neck shots. The advantages are an instant kill with minimum to no meat damage. The disadvantages are a miss or even worse a wounded animal. I did shoot one old Doe in the head that went into a series of acrobatics and back flips and it was rather sickening. I think this was described in Carlos Hatcheck's book once.

  15. #55
    Boolit Buddy pilot's Avatar
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    In Missouri, testing for CWD is done on pituitary glands in the neck. Not the brain. Are you sure the brain is tested?

  16. #56
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by pilot View Post
    In Missouri, testing for CWD is done on pituitary glands in the neck. Not the brain. Are you sure the brain is tested?
    Just for Info purposes:

    The samples needed for CWD testing are located near the base of the deer's skull and first several inches of neck.
    Source:https://dnr.wi.gov/topic/wildlifehab...tersample.html

    There are more sources... That one was convenient & at the top of the list in the search query.
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  17. #57
    Boolit Man
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    I think it would be beneficial to note that an officers job is to enforce the law, not interpret it. That being said, an officer can not accurately enforce a law that he does not personally interprete correctly.
    Thus we get to the point that (I believe) crankycalico is trying to make and that is guilty until proven innocent. IE: officer writes [expletive deleted] citation and unless the charged fights it and the judge decides the officer was incorrect, the officer has effectively created/interpreted/ whatever you want to call it.
    Next we have to take into consideration if the person charged will fight it. Hypothetically: If a non hunter is charged with 'xyz', and the fine is let's say, $150 and removal of hunting rights. The fine is the only thing the non hunter will care about. The non hunter will also know that its gonna cost a lot more than $150 to prove in court that the officer was wrong. Especially if the individual values his time.
    The real punishment these officers can wield is hunting rights, which is why I find the story about the elderly people with the bird feeder plausible. All you have to do is add in a bit of corruption and a bet that the people won't take the case to court/press and bingo!

    I believe anyone that has gone through the court system as an innocent against bogus charges can understand the case I am making.

    TL;DR: both viewpoints are correct, it's not an officers job to interprete or create laws but ignorance/bias/whatever other unknown forces at play can give the officer some grey area to play in.

    *I should also point out I don't know much about the specific topic at hand, and am making some semi-educated guesses about the punishments associated with the laws.
    Last edited by BrutalAB; 01-12-2019 at 03:49 PM. Reason: Wanted to correct spelling and add a *disclaimer
    Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition.

  18. #58
    Boolit Buddy
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    the issue is that, the interpretation of each officer that responds to a situation is legally binding until a judge says other wise. And if you call up the state DNR telephone numbers and ask a question, that answer they give you is legally binding until you get a ticket from a DNR officer in the field because you didn't do something correctly.

    Its why I don't go fishing anymore.

  19. #59
    Frosted Boolits

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    You don't go fishing anymore because you called the DNR?
    Looking for an RCBS A2 with the removable bushing. I need it to complete my A series collection. Please let me know if you have one you want to get rid of. Thanks!

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  20. #60
    Someone needs to put down the crack pipe and the shovel....quit digging man. The lymph nodes are what is used for CWD testing, not the brain. The lymph nodes are between the bottom jaw next to the esophagus on either side. It takes a pair of tweezers to remove them is all on a severed head. My taxidermist showed me exactly how it is done. It takes a minute or two on an already severed head.

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