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Thread: First deer(s) with cast boolits! Used my devastators!!!

  1. #61
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramjet-SS View Post
    My Ruger Bushmasters love the 310 grain GC RFN and WFN driven hard top velocity. Shot a smallish doe this season it was bang flop hit her behind the shoulder in the boiler room.
    What velocities are you running them? I’ve tested my rifle all the way to max loads recommendations for the 460 S&W with no pressure signs. Here are my groupings:

    http://450bushmaster.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=15355


    I ran out of AC boolits and have a good 1,000 plus made up that we’re WQ when I made them a year and a half ago. Hopefully they softened up a tittle when aging. They tested around 16 BH a month after I casted them if I remember. They were the first boolits I casted and didn’t realize I would never need a WQ boolit for anything accept dinosaurs at the time.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-13-2019 at 09:01 PM.

  2. #62
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    Not likely. I've got some water quenched bullets cast over a year ago, and they are a couple points harder than when I tested them before.

  3. #63
    In Remembrance bikerbeans's Avatar
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    The case capacity of the 450BM is about 10% less than the 460 s&w, so i would be careful at using max 460 data in the RARR. The good news is the RARR will handle a COAL of 2.86" so you can seat a bullet long and an increase the useable powder capacity.

    BB

  4. #64
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerbeans View Post
    The case capacity of the 450BM is about 10% less than the 460 s&w, so i would be careful at using max 460 data in the RARR. The good news is the RARR will handle a COAL of 2.86" so you can seat a bullet long and an increase the useable powder capacity.

    BB

    It was a once thing I tried. All the way to 40 grains of h110 with the lee 300 grain FN, no casing pressure signs but the gun started to rattle apart. One of the factory mounted picatinny rail screws came loose, the scope slid back in the rings and wrecked it, and the magazine feel out every couple of rounds probably from the loose optic vibrating. The action held up since its the same one Ruger uses in their 300 WSM cartridge up to 60,000psi but the rest of the rifle wouldn’t hold up. It was like putting nitrous in a Model T. I sent it back to Ruger today because I noticed the trigger housing rattles loose from left to right inside the lower receiver as well. It’s like the holes in the trigger group are hogged out and the housing is too narrow vs the action it mates to.

    I would assume if I acraglassed the picatinny rail to the action and used three or four scope rings I’d be OK. Also acraglassing around the V lugs to hold the action in place and some adhesive inside the scope rings would probably help as well.


    If I seat the lee 300 grain FN longer than 2.055” it will jam every time.

    You should see the fireball that comes out of the brake with my 35.5 grain H110 load. It’s all the more you want to run through that little gun.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-16-2019 at 12:15 AM.

  5. #65
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Here’s a link to some of the predators that fed on the carcass. At least the deer didn’t go to waste. I caught the neighbors dog trespassing and ate on it three times as well. It ran up to me years ago on my property and tried to bite me while turkey hunting and I caught it on camera four times chasing turkeys and deer that fall...and I still haven’t shot it. I called the sheriff the other day AGAIN and emailed the pics who gave them a warning again. He said to much time lapsed between the complaints. I was told if he comes on my property again they’ll fine him. The neighbor admitted to kenneling the dog every time he sees my truck on the property so you know that dog has been running freely on my land for years after all the complaints. I’ll have to check my trail cam in the next couple days so they get their fine that’s long deserved. I can guarantee if I stepped one foot on someone’s property just once I’d get a trespassing ticket. I have that dog on camera three times with no collar or tags on it in the last week. I would say the red fox has visited the most. He eats on it every night till about 4 a.m.











    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-16-2019 at 06:02 PM.

  6. #66
    Boolit Master pls1911's Avatar
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    Your bullet performance was fine...Your shot placement needs some improvement if instant drops are your intent.

    Place you bullet 3" below the horizon , in line with the shoulder/ spine junction. Thinking 3-d, I imagine a tennis ball sized bull's eye onin my deer at that location.
    Considering the seemingly infinite penetration of hardened lead slugs, that's my point of aim, from any angle. full frontal, bunghole, or broadside, I've never has a deer fail to drop in it's tracks if I put the bullet THERE.
    I prefer the hitting as much bone and nervous disruption area as I can, so of course broad side shoulder shots are preferred.
    Moderate 30-30 loads certainly do the trick with finesse, but 45-70's are a truly forceful smack down.
    Salvaging old Marlins is not a pasttime...it's a passion

  7. #67
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    I knew from the first comments you made about the high pressures you where running.

    Just a question, why push so hard? The 450 is a decent and efficient killer.

    CW
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  8. #68
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    The 44 mag rifle I harvested these deer were about 2 grains under max book loads. I picked this load because it was the most accurate load I tested and shoots sub MOA at 100 yards...the same with my 450 bushmaster. The most accurate groups I’ve been getting with my 450BS are a 1.1” at a 100 yard, it just happen to be with a load that’s pushed hard. If it shot as tight or tighter with half the velocity I’d shoot it. I’ve been researching factory 300 grain loaded ammo velocities and I’m only about a 170 FPS faster with my cast load, give or take a few FPS and 1.5 grains over AR 300 grain book loads. I own the 16” barreled version...might trade it in for the 22” barreled version when I get it back from Ruger repairs so I can download it and still have a velocity gain. There is a 150FPS gain in velocity from the 16” to 22” barrel Ruger American 450 bushmaster rifle with factory loads and I eventually want to load 200 grain jacketed ammo in it for Iowa deer hunting for some fast, flat, long range shooting.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 02-01-2019 at 07:21 PM.

  9. #69
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    The 450 simply is not a big recoiling caliber. Not when you have notorious recoiling rifles likenthe 378 Weatherby. Scopes, bases rings actions trigger pins live lifetimes under its recoil.
    To have some of the issues you are having, I suspect pressures are a bit more than you think that they are.

    Many folks have the same gun, everyone is different, but the vast majority find great loads. I have same rifle and frankly, had to do dozens of loades to find ones that WHERE NOT accurate.

    Many soeak of the “long range” abilities of this caliber. Many more appropriate calibers are built for real long range. I know many states are new to rifles and have the straight case stipulation to hunt big game. But much like the limitations seen with a shotgun, just because you cannnow use a high powered rifle, dont immediately come with long range ability. With a 450, you can effectively double plus what a shotgun could do. Thats with factory ammo.

    The writing is on the wall conserning some of the loads your shooting.

    In my own 450, I settled for AA9. It dosent produce top velocity, but darned if it wasnt accurate with 200, 225, 250 & 300g jacketed bullets.

    One of the very first loadings I tried in mine was a med load of about 1900 fps using a discontinued Speer 260 HP. This bullet is a favorite from my 45 Colt and 454 rifles.

    I also founf the Barnes old 275 HP shot really well too using 296.

    Granted, none of these are long range propositions but all are walnut shooters out past 100yards.

    I have used a 200FTX a couple times in my 454 @ 2000 fps and find them fragile. I had one turn inside a 50# coyote and blow out his brisket on a 60-75 yard shot. I had another absolutely destroy the heart, Lungs & front of liver when it exploded inside a 150# Doe at about 20 yards. At the drop of the hammer, as if in slow motion she shuddered and dropped in the spot.

    Good luck with the repairs! Ruger has been real good with me, so hope ta get the rifle back quickly

    CW
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  10. #70
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    I’ve sent the rifle to them before for repairs along with a vaquero. Both came back rather quickly. The vaquero went back as soon at it showed up for a second time. Who ever did the polishing job scratched the heck out it. Third time was a charm and they threw in fax ivory grips for the inconvenience. Ruger is quick on repairs and returns but I’ve learned if you don’t tell what needs to be done they won’t address the elephant in the room.

    With my 450 I’ve only tried h110 .5 gr increments with the lee 300 grain FN from 27 gr through 40 grains so far. Went that high since the same action Ruger uses for the bushmaster is the same action they use for the 300 WSM ran up to 60,000PSI...and I wasn’t impressed with 27 through the 34.5 grain load’s Group results. The cases showed no signs of pressure all the way to the top 40 grain charge. I’m sure my optics slid in my rings (beside my high pressure loads)due to the scope base screw loosening up from not having a good fitment and not being bedded. Ruger placed that picatinny rail along with revaluing the rifle before I ever shot it. I believe the replacement rail was never checked for a good fit. It barely contacts the receive...just on the edges as you can see in my other posts. I will guarantee when I get my gun back after I bed the picatinny rail my optic will stay put. I started with lil gun powder and started my ladder test till I realized my optic can’t loose and broke. So only one powder. I did try .2 gr up and down from 35.5gr and then again with ac COWW alloy. So I tried 23 loads with h110 and two alloys before all heck broke loose when I tested with lil gun.


    I forgot I casted up about 10 lbs of 7.5 Bh 44 mag devastor I never PC’d last fall due to old PC not sticking. I PC’d them today. I’m shooting sub MOA with this soft alloy at 1575fps. I might give it a try this fall as well. It’s 200 FPS slower than the load I used on the deer in this post and half the BH so it definitely should expand. I did some water tests with the boolit expanding a lot more with less weight retention and penatration than my 80/20 did in water....and the 80/20 never expanded through any of my deer I shot even after shattering ribs. The 7.5 Bh that consists of 16lbs of pure and a pound of pewter should expand on impact and make a big exit for a good blood trail if needed IMO. BUT my gut is telling me they will be more destructive on deer than the boolits I used in this post.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-22-2019 at 12:12 AM.

  11. #71
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    As I mentioned to you before, I bought this LEE mold just for this rifle... I was disappointed when I needed to seat it so deeply and for that reason side lined the mold for this caliber.

    H110, LilGun are not the friendliest of lead bullet powders... Are you running a GC?

    Personally, I don't even use Lil Gun. I find it far too hot burning and prone to problems. Definitely not a lead bullet powder I would choose.

    CW
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  12. #72
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    AC COWW with 2% pewter added. Powder coated clear, weighed within a one grain variance, sized a thousands over bore, and Hornady gas checked.





    The farthest out I can seat this boolit is 2.055”. Any longer and it won’t cycle. Played with the various lengths making dummy rounds to see what cycled smoothly. I know I’m over AR loading with my load. The case and action show no signs of pressure but the rest of the flimsy, economy rifle was not made to take the abuse...so I agree with you. When the improperly machined factory scope rail is bedded with acraglass and 3M adhesive have been applied to the rings I’m sure the gun will be fine. The odds are the rings won’t need adhesive after the rail is needed but I will still do it just because. When I save up some more funds I’ll look into other molds and powders. Out of every powder I have H110 and lil gun were the only ones I was told would work for this caliber. It’s the first gun and mold I bought a year and a half ago when started cast making and loading. I switched over to my 77/44 after trying the 450 with the big lee. I bought a another lee, 310, a devastor, and the old lee HP 255 grain mold for the 44 mag. Quickly to find out the devastor was the most accurate of the three so I stuck with it till through this post so I could check out how it dose on deer.

    I might go the other end of the spectrum and try some sub sonic loads this summer with the bushmaster and look into a suppressor if I don’t trade it for the 22” barreled version.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 01-22-2019 at 10:53 AM.

  13. #73
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    H110 not a cast bullet friendly powder? Lot's of guys get their most accurate loads with H110. I doubt 450 BM is any different.

  14. #74
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    When I started loading the 450 bushmaster the summer before last it seemed like like load data was non existent. H110 and lil gun were the only powders I saw listed at the time.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 02-01-2019 at 07:23 PM.

  15. #75
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    Yote dogs start eating the "ss first, I lost a doe earlier this year to a bear what a pain.

  16. #76
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Well, back to plan A for now. My 300 grain flat nose isn't feeding and jamming in my 450BM RAR so I loaded up a few devastators for my 77/44 with a lot softer alloy. It's a load I've shot sub MOA with. It's a 21 grain load of H110 with a BH of 7.5. Loaded up about a 150 so I can go plink with my other three 44's besides the 77/44.

    My snapping turtle foot I just dried and varnished is guarding them.



  17. #77
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    Triplebeards... As to the trespassing dog, i would enact the law of the 3 S's. Problem solved.

    Bruce

  18. #78
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Well, I know this is an old thread but I went out yesterday and sighted in my 77/44 with a different optic on it and my softer 7.5 BH alloy I made from a 16:1 mix of pewter and pure lead flooring. Of course it’s the Lyman devastator PC, GC, and weighing in at 265 grains before firing. Three shots to get me dead center at 25 yards and then another three to zero at 100 yards. The last adjustment I hit a spot I drew on my target the diameter of a pencil eraser! Man, that gun shoots after I acraglassed the front tang area and lightened my trigger to approx 1 1/4 lbs... I love that little gun! I let my buddy try my gun and load out. He smacked an empty shotgun shell at 25 yards with it the first try! I dug the boolit out of the ground he shot and took it home and weighed it. I have it loaded at approx 1600FPS. It retained weight a lot better in the dirt backstop VS my waiter testing I did the summer before last. The boolits mushroomed nicely and must have hit a piece of gravel. The boolit weighed 154 grains and the piece laying right next to added up to 180 grains. It expanded to almost twice its original diameter. It didn’t go very deep in the soil like my really hard alloy dose but it expanded a lot better than the harder boolits do by far when shot in dirt.

    My softer alloy reminds me more of how a softer Jword would expand...more like when I find a core loct at close range in my dirt piles. Hoping the more violent, rapid expansion will help put down game quicker. If not at least a bigger exit hole for better blood trails.





    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 11-02-2019 at 11:21 PM. Reason: Velocity correction

  19. #79
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    For me 17-1800 is the magic velocity.

    CW
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  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by cwlongshot View Post
    For me 17-1800 is the magic velocity.

    CW
    I have observed the same thing. If you’re running a WFN at that velocity almost any alloy that us regular guys have will expand some. And it’s hard to keep almost any HP to stay in one piece.
    You never know how you rank amongst men 'til you have seen what will break another man.
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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check