Inline FabricationRepackboxStainLess Steel MediaRotoMetals2
WidenersGraf & Sons

Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: Henry 45-70 Color Case Hardened Lever or New Single Shot?

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    475

    Henry 45-70 Color Case Hardened Lever or New Single Shot?

    Got the itch to get another 45-70 rifle and was trying to get some info on how they may perform with black powder. Henry's customer service was of little help. I am looking for something for hunting and shooting out to 300yds with a degree of accuracy. I plan on scoping what ever I get. I have a 74 Sharp's with mid-range Soule sight for target. I just want something good for hunting and fun
    Perhaps my learning skills have diminished in my senior years.. 50 years ago I could read something once and then "have it"... Now I read it about three times, do it a couple of times and then... "have it" only about half the time.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Tom, VA
    Posts
    4,534
    Either rifle will be an excellent choice. The lever gun uses Marlin scope bases, and the Single Shot Rifle uses bases made for the H&R Handi-Rifle. I'm planning to buy a Single Shot Rifle this spring, but haven't decided on the chambering. Let us know what you decide, and later, how you like it.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master

    rfd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    NJ via TX
    Posts
    2,687
    the henry h015 s/s will be cheaper and easier to care for than a lever gun, particular with bp cartridges. as to the rifle itself, i have two, but not in .45-70, and they're top notch (but with a new trigger/hammer spring ).



    NRA PATRIOT LIFE ~ NRA RSO ~ Black Powder Gang ~ Traditional Muzzleloading Association ~ Buffalo Rifles ~ Trad Gang
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ ~ liberos vivere, mori libero ~ The .45-70 is the only government I trust.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    WNY
    Posts
    1,406
    I kind of get the black powder thing. Shooting a Sharps, High Wall, or any period correct (at least mostly correct) firearm adds to the attraction of the black powder. But, if you're going out with an obviously modern rifle with a scope on top why bother with the mess and fuss of using black powder? There are just so many great smokeless powders for this cartridge it seems like an exercise in unnecessary cleaning to me. If you want to use black, get the gun for it....Sharps, etc. If I were to add another 45-70 to what I've already owned, and it were either Henry (both nice guns), I'd be starting off with RL7, 4198, 5744, 2400, or maybe Unique for lighter cast loads. Oh well, I think the ss will be the more accurate long range gun. My 1886 shot well, very well, but it wasn't as good as any ss I had/have. Good luck with what ever you do, it's a fantastic cartridge. One of my two favorites.

  5. #5
    Boolit Grand Master

    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northwest Ohio
    Posts
    9,496
    My 45-70s are all reproductions of period firearms, Pedersoli Sharps 74 long range, A Remington rolling block, and a AL Story Sharps Brochardt. None have seen smokeless powder yet. Accuracy with Black Powder (BP) is very good. Cleaning isn't a big problem, I find it easier than some smokeless or substitutes.

    I shoot BPCR Silhouette locally our rams are at 500 yds. 9 out of 10 is common for me. I have cleaned pigs at 300 several times (10 for 10). Like any rifle testing and finding the load it wants is the trick. If possible get a rifle with 1-18 twist ( some are using 1-16 now) as this allows the heavier bullets to be used. Bullets in the 500-550 grn range. these carry velocity and energy better than the lighter bullets.

    As to rifle type the lever action is fun accurate light and handy. Scoped the sight radius isn't an option with shorter barrels. Rifle is lighter so recoil will be heavier. Action length will regulate what bullets you can shoot to an extent. Some lever actions are just to short for a 500 grn+ bullet with out loading it deep into the case.
    The single shot allows for longer loading of the heavier bullets. can be shorter with the same length barrel or a longer barrel at the same length. They can be very accurate,
    I would opt for the single shot ( H&R style, Falling block, roller)

    Working up your load is straight forward. Buy some bullets in the desired weight range size and style. Once you find what is best then the mould can be purchased.
    BP s a little different than smokeless you don't want airspace between it and the bullet. so find a charge in your brass that fills the case to the base of the bullet,-.030 - -.060, this is the starting point of load development. charge 5-10 primed cases with this charge. add a .060 wad ( this gives .040 compression to zero compression) set bullet on to wad. On single shots a crimp isn't needed. Just iron out the bell. Work up from this in 2 grn increments, this adds powder and compression. When the best spot is found ie 62grns and 64 grns test at 63 grns. Shoot for 1150-1250 fps with the heavy bullets. In the single shots load .005-.010 off the rifling. It is better to compress powder with a die as these soft bullets can be deformed compressing when seating

    Swiss in 1F,1 1/2F, and 2F is very good and normally likes about .060 compression. Fouling is soft with proper lubes. Olde Ensforde 1 1/2F and 2F does very well likes a little more compression at around .100-.187.Again fouling is soft and good with proper lubes and compression. Goex 2F is okay requires more compression still. Fouling is harder and heavier.

    As to cleaning at the range for quick cleaning wiping windex with vinegar is very good. At home simple dish soap and hot tap water is greatMop out bore with soap water and brush clean then a wet patch. dry patches to clean and a oiled patch. I also use a patch impregnated with bullet lube SPG or emmerts to preserve the bore. Here a patch with the bullet lube and a dry clean patch to spread even thin coating. Wipe outside metal down with the impregnated patch.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    3,436
    The other single shots are more suitable for BP with their longer and heavier barrels for more vel., more stability, and less recoil.

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    475
    Well, I made a trek of about 2 1/2 hours each way to lay my hands on a Henry Case Hardened Lever Action 45-70, had money in the rat-hole to cover it and was able to fondle a Ruger #1 in 45-70 as well...I walked away from each... the shop was not willing to budge a dime on pricing. Before making the trip I asked if they took guns in on trade and they told me they certainly did... I pulled out a Pedersoli Rocky Mtn Hawken(90+%) and they quickly told me that they would not take it at any price...so I thanked them and left... on the way home, I saw a couple of billboards for another gun shop and it proudly claimed to give cash for guns... I walked in and found staring me in the face another Henry Color Case Hardened 45-70 $30.00 cheaper than the first shop I visited.. they also had the Henry SS in 45-70 in brass... I fondled it and tried the trigger and fit to me.. when I started to talk with them about dealing on the Pedersoli the told me that they didn't take used muzzleloaders... I said your billboard doesn't say that and I was told that muzzleloaders aren't considered firearms... I didn't argue, but I was standing next to a whole rack of smokepoles... then they said there was too much risk of liability with them... I thanked them for their time and went down the road and back over a couple of mountains... the itch has subsided.. of the three rifles I handled, I would have gone with the Ruger #1 although it would be over $1000 with tax...I had the gunsmith check to see if it would chamber a dummy round with a postell seated to cover the last grease groove and it did... the lever Henry would chamber if hand fed, but the OAL was too long to eject and he had to strip it to get the round out...(it would run around $960 with tax) I didn't try the SS as I don't think it would be the rifle for me, even with a better trigger.(out the door price right @ $500).. Thanks to those who responded to the post.
    Perhaps my learning skills have diminished in my senior years.. 50 years ago I could read something once and then "have it"... Now I read it about three times, do it a couple of times and then... "have it" only about half the time.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check