RotoMetals2WidenersInline FabricationADvertise here
RepackboxTitan ReloadingLee Precision

Page 3 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 142

Thread: Lets discuss the topic of Roll Crimping lots to here need to get it all in one place.

  1. #41
    Boolit Master


    Ranch Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cuero, TX
    Posts
    2,018
    Quote Originally Posted by tomme boy View Post
    Since no one has answered the ? I asked earlier I will attempt to ask it another way.

    How does the roll crimp effect the load pressures after the hull has been loaded a couple times? Have you seen the pressures stay the same or have they dropped or raised? Or did accuracy suffer from loading the hulls more than say 2 times?
    Kind of in the same boat, before any more money is spent on roll crimp tools, I want to see hulls that have been shot along with the tools that rolled them. I've asked for the same in several topics; heck, please include your targets as well as it is all connected. Lot's of guys taking pictures of pretty ammo, but I've learned that doesn't mean a thing. I good reflection on performance down range is the spent hull that shot it; star folded or rolled. In the picture, the Lightfield delivered a 1.5 MOA group at 100-yards, the BPI could not leave them all on the target backboard. Show us what you shot.



    Quote Originally Posted by Cap'n Morgan View Post
    I make my own roll crimpers as some slugs needs more room in the crimp tool for the slug nose, but they are all more or less based on this design:

    And can be found here:
    http://www.siarm.com/product_info.ph...oducts_id=1389
    Unfortunately, that roller is out of stock.

    Same as above, out of stock.
    Michael

  2. #42
    Boolit Master


    Ranch Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cuero, TX
    Posts
    2,018
    This roller is in stock. Don't know how many pins it uses on the groove design. I would ask for a drawing something before I bought another.

    Precision Reloading's 12 Gauge Roll Crimper



    It does say that 300 rpm is what is needed.

    https://www.precisionreloading.com/d...ts/MM~RC12.pdf

    I see that Precision Reloading sells they STI Sabot Roller. In the description they state "200-400 rpm", that sounds like 300 rpm to me.

    Hmmm. I do like the looks of the Precision Reloading Roll Crimp and Jaws better than the BPI tool I have.



    I've found that the BPI tool puts too much pressure on the hull, even fully adjusted out, that causing the mouth of an empty hull to go from round to oval. Sure, you have a stack of components that make it round again but, over torque bugs the heck out of me and its got to be still translated up through the hull. I will get a picture of this. I like the adjustable tension the PR Holder.
    Michael

  3. #43
    Boolit Master


    Ranch Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cuero, TX
    Posts
    2,018
    Quote Originally Posted by Ranch Dog View Post
    This roller is in stock. Don't know how many pins it uses on the groove design. I would ask for a drawing something before I bought another.

    Precision Reloading's 12 Gauge Roll Crimper

    Really zooming in on the image, it appears this tool uses two "split rings" that slowly increases the pressure on the roll as heat builds and pressure applied. That makes good sense.
    Michael

  4. #44
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    39.7594 N, 84.1917 W
    Posts
    617
    Quote Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
    Already did. Thanks.

    I also want to know how well the Crank Type Roll Crimpers work. Has anyone got one that can talk about it. Seems like they should work as they were the normal way of crimping shot shells for along time.
    Randy

    I'll post up a couple of pictures of the Ideal hand roll crimper and what the crimps look like.

    The large roll crimping head I sent you a picture of is from an Ideal "STAR" hand roll crimper. All of the late model Lyman / Ideal roll crimping heads look like the pictures I sent you, the early models used to roll crimp paper shells had actual pins in them like the BPI roll crimp head. I believe I have one of the early model roll crimp head in 10 gauge, I'll snap a picture of that as well.

    I roll crimped a couple of empty hulls, this hand crank roll cripmer works well doing round ball and slugs, obviously if you were to try this with a shot shell you would need a tight fitting overshot card. I've mentioned before, any RPM over 100-150 IMHO is way to fast, the hulls shown were done a ~ 60 rpm with moderate force.

    This roll crimp head has four "pins" the newer style has six "pins"
    The sample hulls I roll crimped are federals and are ~.023/.024 wall thickness, I did try some Remington "Gun Club" hulls but they are about .033/.034 wall thickness and need a little more speed and force than I could do with hand crank.

    You'll notice in the 2nd to the last pic, there is a center plug in the crimp head, this was the old "pin" style for the paper hulls, this center plug is actually spring loaded to push against an overshot card to hold it in place. This spring is heavy duty, somewhere is the range of 120-150 # load.

    Not sure why the pictures are rotated

    BTW - Your package is on its way.

    Scott
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083442.jpg 
Views:	25 
Size:	48.3 KB 
ID:	231916   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083458.jpg 
Views:	16 
Size:	48.2 KB 
ID:	231917   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083510.jpg 
Views:	17 
Size:	46.2 KB 
ID:	231918   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083627.jpg 
Views:	17 
Size:	36.6 KB 
ID:	231919   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083714.jpg 
Views:	17 
Size:	35.4 KB 
ID:	231920  

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083747.jpg 
Views:	17 
Size:	27.2 KB 
ID:	231921   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083817.jpg 
Views:	19 
Size:	55.4 KB 
ID:	231922   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083938.jpg 
Views:	16 
Size:	41.2 KB 
ID:	231923   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20181211_083958.jpg 
Views:	19 
Size:	52.3 KB 
ID:	231924  
    Last edited by dsh1106; 12-11-2018 at 02:15 PM.
    Scott

    You can easily judge the character of others by how they treat those who they think can do nothing for them.

  5. #45
    Boolit Master


    Ranch Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cuero, TX
    Posts
    2,018
    Wow, Scot and now Randy, that is a nice roller. I like the support that it is giving the hull!
    Michael

  6. #46
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    376
    A question-Why go to all the trouble of purchasing/building roll crimpers? I realize that a roll crimp can allow slightly more usable hull space but I cannot think of anything Iwant to load in 12 gauge that I have been unable to fit under a fold crimp......which is so much quicker and easier to form. The only advantage I can see to a roll crimp would be load identification. Enlighten me.
    Cast is an adjective, a noun and a verb. Cast works as both imperative and past tense without any additional letters or helping verbs.

  7. #47
    Boolit Master bikerbeans's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,864
    Quote Originally Posted by Treeman View Post
    .... The only advantage I can see to a roll crimp would be load identification. Enlighten me.
    I think you answered your question.

    BB

  8. #48
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    2,600
    Quote Originally Posted by Treeman View Post
    A question-Why go to all the trouble of purchasing/building roll crimpers? I realize that a roll crimp can allow slightly more usable hull space but I cannot think of anything Iwant to load in 12 gauge that I have been unable to fit under a fold crimp......which is so much quicker and easier to form. The only advantage I can see to a roll crimp would be load identification. Enlighten me.
    A roll crimp adjusts to the load, not the other way around. No setup, no fussing, just crimp. I find it so much easier than a fold crimp, and only slower if I'm loading more than a box at a time. I think Tom Armbrust has done more pressure testing with roll crimps than anyone, he would be the one to ask how multiple firings effects them. Another good attribute of a roll crimp is that it is not all that important the depth. While the difference between a fold crimp .050" deep and .075" deep can change the chamber pressures thousands of PSI. You don't get that with a roll crimp.

  9. #49
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    87
    Some simple but effective crimp bases:
    http://www.siarm.com/index.php?cPath=2_105_103_156
    Some manual roll crimping tools:
    http://www.siarm.com/index.php?cPath=2_105_19

  10. #50
    Vendor Sponsor

    W.R.Buchanan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ojai CA
    Posts
    7,840
    Yes I just bet I can make one of those hull vises, maybe a few more. Hate to steal the idea but it is just too easy and is real close to what I was thinking of anyway. Mine will "Look" better. Maybe a new product for BPM?

    Yes,,, We are figuring this process out, and I think we are really close to a complete understanding. I want to talk to the MEC guys at the SHOT Show next month and learn about their die crimping system.

    The A5 is on it's way back and I can't wait to shoot some of these slugs,,, maybe this coming weekend.

    It is an enjoyable pursuit.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  11. #51
    Boolit Master gpidaho's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Beautiful Idaho
    Posts
    1,966
    Randy: Yes, this whole shotgun pursuit is fun stuff. I've had more fun here in these threads than any of the others here a Boolits. We don't seem to have the Huge egos here to contend with like some of the other subjects. Thanks to all here for keeping these threads helpful and friendly. Gp

  12. #52
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    376
    Thanks for the answers. I never realy considered that the roll crimp allows one to compensate for wad stack variables in the crimp. For my own purposes, since I have wad combos that work in a slug load that is accurate with a fold crimp, I don't need to move on to roll crimping......but a big thank you to all who keep experimenting and increasing the knowledge pool.
    Cast is an adjective, a noun and a verb. Cast works as both imperative and past tense without any additional letters or helping verbs.

  13. #53
    Boolit Buddy TonyfromItaly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Florence- Italy
    Posts
    134
    Hello, there are special spools designed specifically for roll crimping slugs. Here is where i get them from. http://www.omv.it/bobine-orlatrici-incisori-stellari/

    the one you need is called cal 12 BP

  14. #54
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    2,593
    What I found for roll crimp is that when I made up my own short 12ga rounds that it was easyer to roll crimp them then to fold them.I came up with 2" rounds for 12 with 1/2oz load.
    Life Member of NRA,NTA,DAV ,ITA. Also member of FTA,CBA

  15. #55
    Boolit Master gpidaho's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Beautiful Idaho
    Posts
    1,966
    I agree trapper. BPI has a four page pamphlet "Loading Shortened Hulls" All but just a few of the loads are roll crimped. With the data for 2, 2 1/4 and 2 1/2" hulls to get a load or two out of the hulls we might other wise throw in the trash. Gp

  16. #56
    Boolit Master
    Petander's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    1,588
    What do you think,can this be used for roll crimp only?



    Here is a video:


    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cm_VKYXRRNI

  17. #57
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    2,593
    Quote Originally Posted by gpidaho View Post
    I agree trapper. BPI has a four page pamphlet "Loading Shortened Hulls" All but just a few of the loads are roll crimped. With the data for 2, 2 1/4 and 2 1/2" hulls to get a load or two out of the hulls we might other wise throw in the trash. Gp
    You see what I am doing for what I do with the hulls that you might dump in the trash.
    Life Member of NRA,NTA,DAV ,ITA. Also member of FTA,CBA

  18. #58
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    376
    Petander, Wow. I don't know whether it does a roll crimp as set up (it seems highly possible that the powered station will roll crimp if used alone) but that is an impressive bit of loading equipment.
    Cast is an adjective, a noun and a verb. Cast works as both imperative and past tense without any additional letters or helping verbs.

  19. #59
    Boolit Master bikerbeans's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,864
    Quote Originally Posted by Petander View Post
    What do you think,can this be used for roll crimp only?



    Here is a video:


    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cm_VKYXRRNI
    GP,

    Have you ordered one? I know you need another gadget.

    I wonder how many slugs i would need to reload to recover the purchase of that fine looking press?

    BB

  20. #60
    Boolit Grand Master

    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Castlegar, B.C., Canada
    Posts
    6,677
    More than all of us have shot in the last 10 years I suspect... but that's just me. I think it is out of my budget range... on that note a quick internet search reveals that they seem to range for 240 Euros to almost 500 Euros depending on options. Not that outrageous but more than I would pay, so yeah I guess out of my budget range.

    Nonetheless a nice looking and functional machine.

    Longbow

Page 3 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check