Colt® LE6920 Semiautomatic Tactical Rifle comments?

[dragon813gt]

Some of the worse quality control ive ever seen in rifles and handguns has come from ruger.

Quality control? You mean they have a QC department. The end user is their QC department. I stopped buying Ruger products sight unseen. I lost count but I think I had to send the last six Rutgers I bought back to factory to be finished. They should have never been allowed out the door.

Just recently I had a person want to trade me a premium grade PSA AR-15 for a gun I have listed for sale. Told him nope! If it was a Colt, I would have traded.

I can’t say I blame you. I won’t buy a pieced together AR regardless of brand. I won’t buy any AR at this point because I have to many as it is.

[jmort]

I will defer to anyone on this, but even the Freedom budget PSA ARs run real good. The Colt LE 6920 always makes sense to me.

[Lloyd Smale]

have to agree. My "pieced together PSA guns" run every bit as good as my colt, stag, bushmaster and shoot just as well too. as a matter of fact ive yet to have a psa gun ive put together not run perfectly and shoot exceptionaly. I cant say that about all the bushmaster, dmps, and Olympics ive owned. Now if that colt stamp on the receiver is worth 600 bucks to you then have at it. To be totally honest I have one colt right now and have owned one other. both were very reliable. the one I go rid of was the worse shooting ar ive owned and the one I have now is mediocure when compared to the others I own. Oh I do have one other "COLT" ar. Kind of anyway. I bought a complete colt lower off a guy once. Put a stainless model one (reliatively cheap upper) and its the best shooting ar ive ever owned. Probably have 500 bucks into it about one in a 100 guys at the range know its not a true colt. Sorry guys but a lower is a lower is a lower. Name stamp means nothing. Colt has been know for years to be pretty proud of the stuff and the fact they own the military contract. I can put together a gun just as good or better with every feature a colt has and more for about 500 dollars less. Everybody sells millspec parts if that floats your boat. You can find chrome barrels and chambers if that floats your boat. that right there is a colt. Nothing more and in my experience a chrome barrel buys you little to nothing and most of them don't shoot as well as a non chromed barrel. I guess to me its like comparing equal priced 1911s.. For a grand I can get a great springfield, Kimber ect or I can get an average colt with a picture of a horsey on it. If you detest cheap ars and want to spend your 1000 plus bucks buy yourself a top end stag or rock river arms gun. Guaranteed you will get more gun for your money. Heck stag has a no questions asked life time warrantee on anything that breaks or wears. even your barrel if you shoot it out.

I will defer to anyone on this, but even the Freedom budget PSA ARs run real good. The Colt LE 6920 always makes sense to me.

[birch]

The Colt. It is **** near perfect.

[lotech]

I bought a new 6920 and a couple of other new Colt ARs several years ago. All are accurate and without problems or malfunctions. Other than putting scopes on a couple of the guns and adding a rear sight to another, these Colts are straight out-of-the-box unmodified like most of my other guns.

A Colt copy may shoot as well as the real thing, but won't be as easy to sell nor will it retain value like the Colt.

[Gtek]

Today is Thanksgiving and I truly feel blessed and thankful that I own a VERY nice four digit SP1 and that I am not a Kool-Aid kid!

[PB234]

Lloyd,

My recent Colt purchase was $849.99. If you can put together as good a rifle for $500 less (a total of $349.99) great.

The Rock River probably has a better trigger and may be more accurate if that is important for your application. I suspect when all is said and done the Rock River would cost well over a thousand dollars to gain perhaps an inch at one hundred yards off a bench or the enjoyment of a better trigger. That said, a Rock River looks enjoyable.

My guess is I could sell the Colts for $700 easily as a preowned NIB rifle meaning it only cost me $150 to be stupid enough to buy a Colts. If I were trying to sell a unfired unbranded mix-master assembly of inexpensively sourced parts (which might even be a better platform) my loss would exceed the $150 lost on the Colts. If I could build a mix-master (can't) for the $349.99 you suggest you can and end up with a better rifle (doubt it) and be young enough to use it enough to wear it out then a mix-master might make sense.

Sometimes paying for quality or the widely shared perception of quality is the least expensive choice. On the most part I would not shoot a mix master made by some fellow who I was not 100% confident of. It is just short of not being willing to shoot some other fellow's hand loads which is not going to happen.

PB

[PB234]

Lloyd,

Thinking about it even if I could assemble a mix master its resale value approaches zero. Why? If I could build a mix master assembling cheaply sourced parts (or even expensively sourced parts) and eventually sell it off and the next fool has an accident with it odds are I am going to meet his lawyer coming after me for damages. Might not be a valid claim but just defending is going to financially damage me badly. It would also ruin a couple years or more of my life while defending against the claim. If one can't afford to mount a defense ...

PB

[Lloyd Smale]

well I guess I don't worry to much about resale of law suites. That said I put together a psa last winter. I had 450 bucks into the build but the basic gun was a bit under 400. Brought it to the local dealer this spring because they had mint glock 19 there with 5 mags for 500 bucks. I wanted and he traded me even up for the ar. Truth be told it was in a stretch where it was a bit tough for him to buy ars for the shop. I also don't know what he paid for the glock. I do know he put 550 on the tag on that ar and it was gone in two days. There also are many guys out there that want budget ARs and don't know how to build them. I can slap on together in a hour or so and easily slap 50 bucks on what I paid for parts and turn it over in a heartbeat. In my opinion from my experience your going to see a lot more depreciation in a high dollar ar then a budget build. If your getting took by a dealer that says he cant sell parts guns or is trys rakes you over the coals offering you 200 dollars less for a gun that he couldn't even by the parts for himself as cheap and sells is a dealer I wouldn't walk away from its one I would RUN away from.

[Mr_Sheesh]

Same sort of problem has happened where someone built a kit plane and sold it; The usual idea I've heard for those is to sell them partly disassembled, so you don't get sued (If they had to put it back together, then it's pretty hard to prove that YOU did anything to make it dangerous, when they were the last one assembling it - Puts a cup of ice down their lawyers' shorts, sorta like.)

[dragon813gt]

On the most part I would not shoot a mix master made by some fellow who I was not 100% confident of. It is just short of not being willing to shoot some other fellow's hand loads which is not going to happen.

PB

These are two drastically different things. ARs are put together like Legos. Hand loads are controlled explosions where the assembler has control over every aspect. More likely than not if the AR was put together wrong it wouldn’t fire. This isn’t like building a bolt action rifle. You put the pieces together following the instructions are you’re good to go. Unless someone specifically told you they built the rifle you most likely wouldn’t know. People seem to always change out the furniture so they never look OEM.

In regards to ARs that someone built and resale value. They’re worth more in pieces than as a whole. It’s the same for modified vehicles. You will recoup more of your cost if you part it out. People are always looking for AR furniture. Some don’t want to put together a lower so they will buy one already built. Then they buy a built upper and take off running. Resale value isn’t a consideration for me when I modify guns or vehicles. I modify both exactly how I want them.

[Lloyd Smale]

news flash most ars are put together with factory sourced parts by people who make 12 bucks an hour doing it. Sure aren't precision assembled by robots or master gunsmiths. Basicaly milspec means sloppy enough to work reliably a coated bolt and chamber (to 1970s military standards, theres better coatings today) and MAYBE a bit better gas key staking but even that was a problem mostly encountered years ago. Psa bolts are staked just fine. Like what was said unless your buying a 2000 dollar noveske your buying legos and chances are its put together by someone making barely over minimum wage. ME id rather put mine together myself and know what I have. I can upgrade where ive found it desireable and aren't paying double for parts that came out of the same factory because of the name on the bag. take a look. this is where they buy there lowers.
LMT = LMT, Lauer(old), DS Arms, PWA, Eagle, Knights Armament, Barrett, Bushmaster (?)
CMT = Stag, RRA, High Standard, Noveske (old), Century (current), Global Tactical, CLE, S&W, MGI (1st batch), Wilson Tactical, (some?) Colt, Ratworx
LAR = Grizzly, Bushmaster (L Prefix), Ameetech, (?)DPMS, CMMG, Double Star, Fulton, Spike's Tactical, Noveske (new)
MMS = Mega, Gunsmoke, Dalphon, POF (forged), Alexander Arms, Stinger, Spike's Tactical(old)
JVP = Double Star, LRB
Olympic = Olypmic, SGW, Tromix, Palmetto, Dalphon, Frankford, (old) Century
Superior = Superior Arms, Lauer (current)
Grenadier Precision
Sabre Defence (?)

as you can see even colt and full on custom ar makers use legos. Even noveske Biggest difference is a stamp on the lower to impress your buddys with how much money you spent. I cant believe a bunch of handloaders and bullet casters cant see the economic sense and pride in building your own ar.

These are two drastically different things. ARs are put together like Legos. Hand loads are controlled explosions where the assembler has control over every aspect. More likely than not if the AR was put together wrong it wouldn’t fire. This isn’t like building a bolt action rifle. You put the pieces together following the instructions are you’re good to go. Unless someone specifically told you they built the rifle you most likely wouldn’t know. People seem to always change out the furniture so they never look OEM.

In regards to ARs that someone built and resale value. They’re worth more in pieces than as a whole. It’s the same for modified vehicles. You will recoup more of your cost if you part it out. People are always looking for AR furniture. Some don’t want to put together a lower so they will buy one already built. Then they buy a built upper and take off running. Resale value isn’t a consideration for me when I modify guns or vehicles. I modify both exactly how I want them.

[Gtek]

Wow, look what they have done to these kids heads, finding myself somewhere between nauseated and laughing! Thread starts out about which AR to buy and it has turned into LAWYERS. Being in aviation for over thirty years (oh yea, Lawyers have ruined that one also) it is referred to as the 51% build in regard to experimental aircraft. If you sell a FrankenAR gun and are inclined to be so proud to proclaim that you put all the pieces together, good for you! And if it blows up you can go get a lawyer to fight his lawyer who can sue the manufactures lawyer and in the end who wins- THE LAWYERS! I've built 90% of mine because I want this and that and I cannot buy one like it with this and that. So I spend four times extra what the tools would cost for someone else to put the pieces together for me for what I want for ONE? I don't think so, life is too short! And once again, I have held COLT junk right out of the box, pistol and rifle!!!!

[Bigslug]

as you can see even colt and full on custom ar makers use legos. Even noveske Biggest difference is a stamp on the lower to impress your buddys with how much money you spent. I cant believe a bunch of handloaders and bullet casters cant see the economic sense and pride in building your own ar.

Well, there ARE people who just want to take the **** thing out of the box and shoot it.

No, assembling an AR from a pile of parts isn't hard. . .after a lot of study to know how to put which springs in which orientation in the right holes, a bunch of repetitions that probably result in the accidental loss or destruction of some parts or putting scratches where you'd rather not have them, and investment in tools that you may only be using once. It may ultimately be a bit of a false economy - especially from the viewpoint of getting your practice and experimentation in on what might be a tool to be used in defence of your tender heinie.

And then there's those pesky specs. Do you have the right size gas port for the amount of barrel both in front of and in back of it? Do you have the right weight of buffer to go with that combo? Do you have a proper 5.56 NATO chamber with a nice long leade, or something closer to .223 Rem that's too tight and will start popping out primers when using mil-spec ammo? If you actually are SCUBA diving with the thing, was your barrel Parkerized BEFORE the gas block was put on, or after? How well do Manufacturer A's parts kits mesh with Manufacturer B's receivers? You don't necessarily get all that right the first time when you throw darts at random pages in four different catalogs, so the real question here is how much you want a reliable rifle versus having the experience of trying to build a reliable rifle? Both have value. . .depending on what you value.

The crux of this discussion lies in the fact that the AR is different things to different people. To me, it's a framing hammer of a tool for a military-ish use, and I would prefer that the effort and expense of "custom art" be put into something made of steel that cycles manually. I certainly don't see a need to pimp out an intermediate-cartridge rifle with every snake-oil "upgrade" (COUGH!) under the sun for the purpose of taking sub-200 yard shots on 18" targets. Finally, while you do have to take the time to assemble it PROPERLY, I don't feel any chest-beating sense of accomplishment from what isn't all that complex a process in the grand scheme of gun-building. A Colt fits this mindset of "buy rifle, shoot rifle" well in that they DON'T have the right to change specs or assembly process whenever they feel like it to whatever is cheaper or seems like a good idea at the time. It ends up being a little more money to pay for the prior experimentation that results in what Madison Avenue would have you believe is a boring, bling-free rifle. . .but in this context, boring and bling-free is not bad.

[PB234]

Gtek,

The discussion went to values of products impacted by potential product liability claims and an individual assembler being uninsured and naked if their assemblage has a problem down the road impacting the value of a assembled rifle and the risk of selling it

Judging by the apparent demographics of posters on this site my guess is it is a mature if not almost elderly crowd probably overweight folks in their 50s and beyond. Since you have been in aviation my guess is you started between 18 and 24 years of age so adding on 30 years of aviation experience makes you a youngster around here. Being young has a lot of advantages often overshadowed by brashness such as being nauseated by and laughing at others.

Lawyers are just doing the best they can do for themselves which I imagine you too try to do. Our society has turned into one where most people have no chance of making substantial money and look at an injury as an opportunity to profit. Is it the lawyers or society?

Lots of products are not great anymore as costs are cut in their manufacturing. Many are substantially better than previously. Perhaps it has become fashionable to declare new stuff junk. Have you noticed how much better recent TVs are than older ones and how cheap they have gotten?

Having something to lose, even if it is only equity in a home, would stop me cold from selling an assembly of parts I stuck together because of the product liability for which I have no insurance. This impacts the resale value to me of a parts rifle. Others may not care or be ignorant of the risk so it doesn't matter to them unless the very unlikely problematic situation arises. They may also value a $50 profit a lot more than I do.

To each their own. It doesn't matter to me.

Thanks for calling me young. It feels good even if my hair appears gray in the mirror.

PB

[lefty o]

here's my take. the one and only real benefit of a colt, is when you need to sell it, people will pay for that little pony stamped on the side of it. colt is like all the rest, the put some well built rifles into boxes and ship em, and ive seen enough to know they also stick poorly built garbage in boxes and ship it. much like everybody else.

[Love Life]

My take is this:

If you are not an experienced assembler, I highly recommend you buy a factory made gun with a warranty. Colt preferred (obviously), pre sell out Bushmaster, Windham, Ruger, PSA, etc. The factory produced guns will have a high probability of working right out of the box, and time is money. All the time saved over building means you are at the range blasting away. For some of the lower tier offerings, you really aren’t going to beat them on price by much if you build. That’s if you beat the price at all.

Add in to that, if you built the gun, and have issues then you have to troubleshoot and hopefully fix it. A factory gun goes back to warranty repair ( usually on the manufacturer’s dime), and is their problem to fix or replace.

That’s why I don’t build AR’s. It’s not worth my time or effort when it comes to money saved, if I save anything at all. There is no sense of pride for me in building one either. As for building a precision AR, ummm, as long as they hold 3-4 MOA I’ll likely hit a man sized torso target at 700 yards somewhere in the torso. I save precision for he bolt guns.

As for buying a mix master someone built...yeah right. There are to many morons out there with Midway USA catalogs and an action wrench for me to even consider it. Mouth breathing all over the parts while asking how to build it from anyone who’ll respond on the Barf.com forum.

That’s my take.

[jmort]

Concur

[nun2kute]

...... Don't let me stop you, I appreciate the entertainment.

[Gtek]

Mr PB, Wow, just Wow. Shame on you for the overweight remark, that could possibly maybe hurt some of the elderly on here! I would love to respond but that darn chicken little is making all kinds of noise out back and that gets the unicorn all wound up and I just don't have the time right now. Have a great rest of your Thankful weekend, and remember you kids be safe out there!