variance in diameter and weight for a new caster

[weeple2000]

If we could wait a few replies before bashing equipment, I am using Lee molds. I have the following:

Lee HG 68 clone 45 acp mold (6 cavity) & handles
Lee C309-200-R mold

I have only cast with these twice. I have a friend locally that casts but I haven't had a chance to meet up with him to help me yet. For the first batch, I only cast with the 45 mold. I dumped all of those bullets back into the pot as they were wrinkly. The second time I cast, my bullets appear nicer. I visually inspected and culled them. The ones that remained, I suspect, were cast after temperatures were appropriate. At any rate, I did mic some of them. I will add that when I culled them, some of them had fins on them. Well, I mic'd some that I didn't cull. I weighed some as well. I didn't spend a whole lot of time trying to vet this out, but I think my bullets aren't completely round. Weight varied as well. I don't know if the issue is specific to a cavity. I don't know which bullet came from which cavity.

Before I go down a rabbit hole trying to isolate the issue, I want to start out assuming the issue is operator error. I suspect that I am not closing the mold properly. Does that sound suspect? I wanted to find a video on youtube, or a description in a past thread, about this. I came up short. So I apologize in advance as I did try to search.

Appreciate everyone's help.

[Walks]

Close the mold gently, hold closed tightly.
You might consider giving the mold cavities & faces with a good scrub with toothpaste and regular toothbrush. Lube with a mold lube from N.O.E. or I think MIDWAY sells it also.
The guys here can tell you a good substitute mold lube too.
Do you have a lead thermometer? Got to know if your Alloy is hot enough. A hotplate is a big help in warming your molds up to casting temp.
You can also put a ingot mold over the top of your melting pot and rest your mold on that to warm it.
Clean your mold with brake cleaner as the last thing before heating it for casting.

You didn't say if you were using a bottom pour pot or were dipper casting.
If you are dipper casting, you HAVE to use a GOOD Lead Dipper. Sorry to bash LEE, but their Lead "dipper" is ****. Get yourself a LYMAN Lead Dipper.
If you go from a Lee dipper to a LYMAN, you will understand.

Good Luck.

[weeple2000]

Using bottom pour.

[Walks]

Ok, do you have a stable rest when you fill the mold ?

[weeple2000]

Sorry can you elaborate on that? I filled the mold holding underneath the pour and closed it while the mold was elevated.

[dragon813gt]

He’s asking if you’re using a mold guide to support it while filing. This way the mold won’t be shaking as you fill it.

It sounds like you aren’t keeping the mold closed. That explains the fins and out of round bullets. It can also explain the weight variations. But they’re more likely caused by improper fill out. Everything needs to be up to temp. Both the lead and the mold. Once up to temp fill each cavity until there’s a healthy sprue. If the mold is steady and you keep consistent pressure on the handles you should be good to go.

[jsizemore]

I don't use Lee molds but what you describe is a common complaint from beginners. Don't grip the sprue cutting handle while pouring. Pressure on it will cause the mold to open up to varying degrees and cause any number of problems.

I hope this is a simple solution to what you got going on. Good Luck

[bosterr]

Look for specks of lead on the mold faces that could also cause varying diameter and weight.

[Wheelguns 1961]

You don’t say what your alloy is, and you don’t say anything about fluxing or adding tin. An alloy with more lead will make heavier bullets. If you are using (for example) 50/50 wheel weights to pure lead they must be mixed thoroughly or some bullets will be heavier than others.

The wrinkles are usually caused by your mold not being hot enough. Adding tin will help with fill out. It sounds like you are unsure of yourself, and your techniques. This is normal, but if you stick with it and try to figure it out one issue at a time, you will be fine. Most lee molds are good and I haven’t had problems with them. Keep at it. It’ll all come to you with practice. Everybody has some issues when they first start out.

[HATCH]

Besides what is mentioned above

Timing and lead temp.

When casting (hand or machine) having the lead at the same temp plays into the diameter and weight of the boolit when combined with timing.
Timing - if the lead temp is constant, then you need to get into a rhythm.
A good way to explain it is my automated master caster.
1 second at top before lead pour
4 seconds at the top after lead pour
2 seconds at the bottom after mold drop
repeat
You will find that if your temp is the same that you can tweak your timing that you get perfect bullets every time.

The amount of time the hot lead stays in the mold effects how hot the mold gets. The hotter the mold gets the larger the diameter.
The amount of time you pause between dropping boolits and pouring more lead effects how much it cools off.
So when you are casting do something like this
Pour lead - Count to 2
Cut sprue - count to 2
Dump boolits - count to 1
Repeat
Those are just example times.
I found that I could skip the 1 count after dumping boolits because that is factored in the motion of getting the mold back under the pot.

I am not a expert by any means and 95% of my lifetime casting has been with a Master Caster that I automated.

[Kraschenbirn]

Advice: Practice makes perfect: put the 6-cavity H&G clone aside and prep the 308-200...you can find all kinds of methods/info with a quick search...and try casting with the 2-cavity. After a while, you'll begin to get into a rhythm as you learn what 'feels' right for a good pour. Best way I can describe it; it's a motor skill best developed by practice and much easier to develop on a single or double cavity mold.

Bill

[weeple2000]

Ok, do you have a stable rest when you fill the mold ?

See the pic. I thought the part I circled in red was for the power cord. I wasn't using it. Now I realize that it is for stabilizing the mold.

[weeple2000]

You don’t say what your alloy is, and you don’t say anything about fluxing or adding tin. An alloy with more lead will make heavier bullets. If you are using (for example) 50/50 wheel weights to pure lead they must be mixed thoroughly or some bullets will be heavier than others.

The wrinkles are usually caused by your mold not being hot enough. Adding tin will help with fill out. It sounds like you are unsure of yourself, and your techniques. This is normal, but if you stick with it and try to figure it out one issue at a time, you will be fine. Most lee molds are good and I haven’t had problems with them. Keep at it. It’ll all come to you with practice. Everybody has some issues when they first start out.

I was using straight range lead. I checked it using pencils and it was around 9-10 BHN. I did realize the wrinkles were my problem the first time around. So I guess solving one problem and identifying the next, I am making good progress.

[weeple2000]

Besides what is mentioned above

Timing and lead temp.

When casting (hand or machine) having the lead at the same temp plays into the diameter and weight of the boolit when combined with timing.
Timing - if the lead temp is constant, then you need to get into a rhythm.
A good way to explain it is my automated master caster.
1 second at top before lead pour
4 seconds at the top after lead pour
2 seconds at the bottom after mold drop
repeat
You will find that if your temp is the same that you can tweak your timing that you get perfect bullets every time.

The amount of time the hot lead stays in the mold effects how hot the mold gets. The hotter the mold gets the larger the diameter.
The amount of time you pause between dropping boolits and pouring more lead effects how much it cools off.
So when you are casting do something like this
Pour lead - Count to 2
Cut sprue - count to 2
Dump boolits - count to 1
Repeat
Those are just example times.
I found that I could skip the 1 count after dumping boolits because that is factored in the motion of getting the mold back under the pot.

I am not a expert by any means and 95% of my lifetime casting has been with a Master Caster that I automated.

This sounds good. I was trying to get the temp so that my sprue would cool in 4 seconds, per FortuneCookie45LC's video. I will pay attention to the timing of the whole process instead of just the sprue.

[weeple2000]

Thanks for everyone's suggestions. Some good ideas and feedback here. I have always been a fan of forums when I'm learning a new hobby.

[country gent]

Several little tricks that help are if you don't have one pick up lead thermometer to maintain temperature in a consistant range when casting. Set the mould on top of the pot to preheat or use a hot plate. Hold only the mould handles when pouring the cam on the sprue plate can partially open the blocks if included in the grip. Pour a full stream and a heavy sprue to start this helps heat the sprue plate and keeps bases molten longer. A piece of Aluminum or steel angle 3/4 x 3/4 x 8-10 inches long set in front of the pot point up helps also. Set the mould on this lightly when closing it helps to pre alighn them saving wear on the pins and makes easier to seat. Cast at a brisk pace adjusting temp and cadence as needed. Watch the sprue you will see it harden then "frost" over. Cut sprue drop bullets set on angle close and close sprue plate refill.

[Jniedbalski]

My lee bottom pour pot 10 lb dosent have a mold guide. The new lee 20 lb pot I got does have the mold guide under it. It also helps to heat cycle the molds. About the 3rd or 4th cast is usally when I start getting real good bullets. Mold lube works. I had a 9mm mold I didint lube. It scratched the top where the spur cutter slides. I almost ruined a 20$ lee mold. I have used two cycle oil and refrigerant oil from auto zone. Sold in half pints for auto ac systems. It’s cheep and it works good. A half pint will probably last you a life time. I only lube the spur plate, pivot pin And the alignment pins with a Q tip. Use a very very small amount. Heating the mold to proper temp is the best for getting rid of wrinkles . Some times 3 or 4 foot of non lead plumbing solder tin Antony lead free solder to a pot of lead also helps.

[tazman]

One of the things I haven't seen anybody talk about yet is how you close the mold properly.
With the 6 cavity, it is best to rest the bottom of the mold on a flat surface to help the locator pins line up properly so they don't wear prematurely. The second thing is, when you close the sprue plate it is very easy to spread the blocks slightly and you may not even notice it. This happens due to the leverage the sprue plate handle has. Most new Lee 6 cavity mold the sprue plate fits tightly when it goes under the locating bolt. When you force it into place, it also pushes the blocks apart slightly. You must check to be sure this isn't happening. This is probably where the fins you spoke of are coming from. It would also account for the differences in size and weight.
You can loosen the locating bolt slightly to allow the sprue plate to slide under it easily and without undue force. You just need to check periodically that it doesn't get too loose and cause lead flashing between the boolit base and the sprue plate.
Make sure to use a drop of 2 cycle motor oil at the hinge bolt and the locator bolt to help prevent wear and make closing the mold easier.
Sometimes you can get specks of lead on the mold faces while working the mold. These need to be removed or they will hold the mold blocks apart and not let them close fully. Best way to do that is to get the mold hot and then scrape off the specks with a small piece of wood. I use a popsicle stick with one end cut off square.
Others have covered the temperature controls very well so I won't address that.
I have been using Lee molds for decades and really like the 6 cavity molds for high volume production.

[Walks]

Taz,
You obviously didn't read the first line of my post.

"Close the mold gently, hold handles tightly."

Been doing that way with LEE molds for 30yrs. Still using those same 3 LEE 2cav molds, they still produce beautiful bullets.

I know this way works.

[tazman]

Walks----It doesn't matter how tight you hold the mold handles if the sprue plate is very tight. The sprue plate handle has enough leverage to push the mold faces open even with the other handles held tightly if it is binding on the locator bolt.
While you did mention something about closing the mold, I felt more detail was needed. I didn't contradict you. I added information that was missing in your post.
I am sorry if you feel like I stepped on your toes. That was not my intention.