Win/Miroku 1873 44-40

[Randy Bohannon]

So I found the exact one I have been wanting ,Shot Show Special,Pistol grip, very nice wood, steel shotgun butt,24" half round barrel,checkering, CCH. I have ordered the Accurate mold # 43-215 @.430" and plan on B/P only and soft 20:1 bullets shot as cast lubed with enhanced SPG lube and Swiss/O/E 1.5Fg-2 Fg,3Fg untilI get I 1250 fps or so,replicating original performance level.
Has the R.O.T for 44-40 barrels been a consistent 1:38" or thereabouts or is there slow and slower ? What would be the optimum bullet weight for accuracy and hunting or the best accuracy with heaviest for caliber that would be reasonable for the 73 action ?

Thank You all for your experience and wisdom.

[HawkCreek]

They are real nice rifles! Though I know nothing about reloading for them yet.

Here's mine:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...ew-Miroku-1873

[CamoWhamo]

I already own a half dozen Win/Miroku's in 1873, 92's and 94's and i am very pleased with all of them.

I just ordered another one. This time it's an 1873 24" Octagonal Barrel with pistol grip in 44-40.

I have a Model 92 in 44-40 already and the barrel on that is .431 so my guess is Miroku use the same barrel as they do for 44 Magnum (SAAMI spec for lever guns is .431).
The .431 bore has been a real bugbear for me trying to find a bullet that works so i'm hoping Miroku make the 1873's closer to tru spec. Then again, if it's not .431 like my 92 then i'll have to buy more molds.

[GARD72977]

I work for Winchester. We make the ammo not the guns. I can order one through the company. I'm wanting a 73. Can't make up my mind between 45LC or 44-40.

[Randy Bohannon]

I have the 92 in 45 Colt and is a good shooter with fat .456 boolits also have a Win/Miroku 1873 SRC .38/357 love the rifle 38/357 a bit underwhelming.
So the new fancy one is 44-40WCF ,what the rifle was designed around. MidWay has 44-40 Cowboy dies on sale for $43.00,get a 44-40. If you already have a lever gun in 45 Colt get a 44-40.

[CamoWhamo]

I work for Winchester. We make the ammo not the guns. I can order one through the company. I'm wanting a 73. Can't make up my mind between 45LC or 44-40.

I like the .45 but if you're going to buy a nostalgic or classic firearm i'd stick to the original calibers so I'd go with 44-40 myself. It's the classic rifle/caliber combination. They never sold the originals in .45LC.

[GARD72977]

I'm aware of the originals. I consider these shooters not collector's.

[indian joe]

I'm aware of the originals. I consider these shooters not collector's.

44/40 shooters proly cause you less grief than a 45

[HawkCreek]

I have a Miroku 92 in .45 Colt as well as the above mentioned Miroku 73 in .44-40, these are the only two Miroku's in pistol calibers I have seen so I can't say if I got top shelf both times or not. The .44-40 seems to be a better shooter. The .45 Colt has a VERY generously cut chamber. It's still within spec as far as I can tell (havent gotten around to casting it yet) but it leaves a hump in the brass with every load I've tried through it to date.

[greenjoytj]

44/40 shooters proly cause you less grief than a 45

A statement like that begs the question why?

[veeman]

45's are not designed for a rifle. Doesn'r mean they don't work, just that the rim is smaller, brass is harder, more blowby on 45, dirtier brass. I'm sure others caan explain better, but that's the basic of it.

[Randy Bohannon]

It has been explained to me that the 45 Colt was never chambered in original designs because it was a difficult cartridge to the get the cartridge load and feed as well as other cartridges did and it was just plain bothersome to entertain.Modern engineering has made it possible with the dreaded '45 Colt Bulge' in leverguns so chambered.Virtually all 45 Colt chambers are big sloppy affairs in leverguns regardless of who made it with few exceptions.This aids in the feeding/chambering issues that had been discovered in the early rifles that were never commercially produced,it's not because the manufacture does'nt know how to chamber a rifle.

[indian joe]

A statement like that begs the question why?

Veeman pretty much got it with this
"45's are not designed for a rifle. Doesn't mean they don't work, just that the rim is smaller, brass is harder, more blowby on 45, dirtier brass. I'm sure others can explain better, but that's the basic of it. "
I would add --Winchester knew what they were doing when they built those early lever gun rounds with that little bit of bottle neck - it helps a lot with slick feeding

[Texas by God]

The original rim on .45 Colt ammo was just big enough to headspace in the SAA. Today's rims are bigger thanks to the New Service/ 1909 USMC Colt revolver- as far as I know. The 44 WCF is a better design case for chamber seal.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[bigted]

Knowing now what i did not when i got three japchester 45 Colt's i would never get another lever in the 45 Colt chambering.

The primary problem is not the case rim. The real problem is the complete straight case. Take the 92 for instance ... take a look at the cartridge as it rests on the lifter ramp. It is going at an angle and will have to have a generous hole to glide into as the case has no taper. If it were tapered or necked as with ALL the other cartridges it was chambered in then the hole could be the same size as the cartridge. However, the Colt case is completely straight ... hence the hole it needs to go in MUST be larger then the cartridge so the angle works.

The 73 has a different problem, it chambers good as the straight cartridge is lifted in a complete flat condition hence just slides straight into the chamber and this hole can be the same diameter to chamber EXCEPT ... now after firing ... that complete straight case that had simple folded brass/copper cases which swell upon firing ... have and had extraction trouble. So now to combat the sticky extraction trouble, the chamber needs to be a bit bigger then the case so upon firing, the case swells and returns to a closer then needed factory condition, therefore be able to extract with ease.

The 44 WCF is a way better choice or 38 WCF for that matter as they are thin cases as well as being a necked AND tapered cartridge, they feed AND extract like butter ... seal the chamber ... and keep the fouling ahead of the case mouth.

Simple ... original chambers ... MUCH BETTER!

[CamoWhamo]

I had a Miroku built Winchester 92 in 45LC and have had 2 in 44-40 (and still have one).

I can concur with the blowback and chamber seal in 45LC. My 45LC cases were always covered in carbon about 3/4 of the way from from the case mouth, whereas my 44-40 cases are much cleaner.

[Hootmix]

Hey CamoWhamo , up having coffee ,, other wise i'd get in on the discussion ,, .oh ! I shoot 44/40 ,, Rossi src ,, 90's model ,," life is good ".

coffee's ready ,, Hootmix .

[CamoWhamo]

I picked mine up today.

Model 1873 blued receiver with pistol grip and 24"octagonal barrel.

Next step is the remove that sticker, give it a good clean and do a cerrosafe cast to determine bore diameter.

It won't chamber fired cases or loaded rounds from my Win/Miroku 92 so my guess is bore is less than my 92's .431.

[bigted]

That's a super looking rifle my friend. She looks like an original working rifle. Just rite. I am betting you will love yours as much as i like mine. EXCEPT ... sure wish i had held out for the 44 WCF.

Keep us posted please. Anxious to hear your trail of happiness with your new rifle.

[CamoWhamo]

bigted, it is indeed a beautiful rifle. I have wanted this exact rifle for many years but supply here in Australia is very poor so i had to settle on an 1873 short rifle in .357 and a Model 92 in .44-40.

Winchester Australia recently got a shipment in and i couldn't order one quick enough. I don't need another rifle but here you have to seize the opportunity when it arises or you miss out. They rarely come up on the used gun market too.

Today i gave it a clean and did a cerrosafe cast of the bore. It mikes out at .430 and the chamber is definitely tighter in the 1873 so i'll have to spend some time finding the right combination of bullet size that will chamber and function fine.

My package from Buffalo Arms arrived this afternoon so the rifle now has a Marbles Tang Sight and Lyman Globe front Sight. I will take some pics in better light tomorrow.