the low lifes are stealing gas from me!

[fiberoptik]

In 70’s our neighbors cut the line to our gas tank spilling 100’s of gallons on grass and drive after stealing a tankful. Back in high school in 1980’s we had a few thieves from school breaking into garages. My friends dad put a metal grate under the metal door. Wires both wires from an old extension cord to each and made sure the grass was wet. Heard some really nice screams that night. I used a .410 with rock salt for Target practice at 3:00 am on a well known rear end. He was rubbing it a lot while waiting for the school bus. Informed him next time would be lead. No more break ins.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[oldred]

In 70’s our neighbors cut the line to our gas tank spilling 100’s of gallons on grass and drive after stealing a tankful. Back in high school in 1980’s we had a few thieves from school breaking into garages. My friends dad put a metal grate under the metal door. Wires both wires from an old extension cord to each and made sure the grass was wet. Heard some really nice screams that night. I used a .410 with rock salt for Target practice at 3:00 am on a well known rear end. He was rubbing it a lot while waiting for the school bus. Informed him next time would be lead. No more break ins.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is exactly the kind of dumb, and both suggestions are REALLY dumb, advice we have been talking about, both suggestions you just made could easily cost you everything you own and quite likely land you in jail! Both the booby trap and the shotgun/salt would be felonies in any state in this country and you most certainly would be liable for any injuries the perp sustained! Did it occur to you how much trouble you could have been in had the perp died from electrocution? Doing either of those tricks is just plain stupid!

Ok I see you say it was a friends dad who rigged the booby trap but the point remains the same!

[bob208]

ed you whatg to do. but all you come up with is what we can't do.

[oldred]

ed you whatg to do. but all you come up with is what we can't do.

"ed you whatg to do" ??????? I'm going to assume you are using a phone?

If that's aimed at me then no it's not a case of "all I can come up with is what we can't do"! I have been addressing problems likely encountered from "feel good" reactions that are likely to backfire with results ranging from retaliatory damages caused by pranking a perp when no one is around to stop him him from revenge to jail time for setting highly illegal traps!

I have repeatedly suggested, the same as several other posters, to avoid doing anything that is likely to cause even more harm and use some common sense in dealing with these kinds of situations! Common sense such as obtaining photos, videos and working with the police!

THINK about some of the things suggested here! Why would I be against that dye trap some seem to like so much? Well think OBJECTIVELY about it! Take a look at what might be a highly likely example of how that might go down,

The perp opens the gas cap door and gets sprayed with the dye, AHA, got'em didn't we! Well did you? Maybe so up to that point but is he just going to sheepishly walk away spending the next few days embarrassingly making it plain to everyone because of the dye stains that he was the thief? Well in the feel good version that some would like to believe and laugh about that's what would happen and it very well could BUT, it's much more likely the perp/victim would not be so co-operative! Picture this low-life getting hit with that dye, is he going to be embarrassed like the fantasy version suggests or highly (and likely violently) po'ed? He knows who did this to him and that person's car or truck is right in front of him, it's likely dark with the owner who set the trap nowhere around nor is there anyone else except for a couple of his buddies who by this time are laughing their butts off at him making him even more angry! THINK about this, is he just going to walk away or is he going to take a parting shot before he leaves? The owner discovers the next morning that his trap worked but what else does he see? Who got the last laugh?

Both versions of the results of that silly feel good prank are of course just made up fantasy but REALLY which one is more likely? All I am saying is that these kinds of things are likely to backfire in ways the owner never expected and are not likely to have the funny ending as depicted in the "feel good" version. All I am saying is to use common sense and OBEY THE LAW first then don't do silly pranks that are going to infuriate the perp when you are not going to be there to stop him from getting even which is very likely the first thought that will go through his head, consider the kind of people you are dealing with here! These "feel good" pranks may seem like a good idea here just talking about them but they won't seem so funny when it backfires, as it's likely to do, and the perp gets the last laugh!

[sureYnot]

Sometimes it's worth standing up for what's right.... Even when you know your government will unjustly punish you. This is how injustice is brought to light.

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[oldred]

Sometimes it's worth standing up for what's right.... Even when you know your government will unjustly punish you. This is how injustice is brought to light

No one anywhere suggested not standing up to them, if so please point out where? Just use common sense and don't do something dumb that instead let's the perp come out on top, plus possibly subjecting someone to civil liability and/or possible jail time like some of these ill-thought out suggestions and "feel good" stories could easily do! That's all I have been suggesting but apparently some folks want to bash me for that -not that I care in the least.

[fatelk]

Sometimes it just brings more injustice that you can’t do anything about.

A guy I worked with years ago told me what happened to him. Someone was breaking into cars at night and stealing stuff. He just happened to hear something and got the jump on a couple of young punks, caught them red handed in his work van robbing him blind. He snuck up on them and fired a 12ga round into the air.

He called the cops, who arrested him for shooting his gun. He said the thieves got off scot free and he got a big fine. He was furious and not a thing he could do about it.

I suspect that a person might have been able to get away with these kind of things (traps and tricks) more in decades past. I think that in some ways people are more savvy now. For example, I knew a guy who was hassled on the street by some punks one evening. He said they were messing with him and physically threatening, so he pulled his shirt back in case he had to draw his gun. They got a glimpse of his pistol and left.

Later that night cops were at his door to arrest him. Apparently they had got his license plate number or something and called the cops to say he pulled a gun on them for no reason at all. The cops told him since they reported it and he didn’t, they had to assume he was the bad guy. It was he said/she said, so he didn’t get charged, but he did lose his CHL over it.

In both of those cases the bad guys got the last laugh. What the first guy did wrong was firing his gun when there was no imminent threat. What the second guy did wrong was to not report the altercation to the police asap. It stinks, but nowadays you have to not only know how to protect yourself physically, but also CYA legally by knowing exactly what you can and can’t get in trouble for.

[oldred]

Sometimes it just brings more injustice that you can’t do anything about.

A guy I worked with years ago told me what happened to him. Someone was breaking into cars at night and stealing stuff. He just happened to hear something and got the jump on a couple of young punks, caught them red handed in his work van robbing him blind. He snuck up on them and fired a 12ga round into the air.

He called the cops, who arrested him for shooting his gun. He said the thieves got off scot free and he got a big fine. He was furious and not a thing he could do about it.

I suspect that a person might have been able to get away with these kind of things (traps and tricks) more in decades past. I think that in some ways people are more savvy now. For example, I knew a guy who was hassled on the street by some punks one evening. He said they were messing with him and physically threatening, so he pulled his shirt back in case he had to draw his gun. They got a glimpse of his pistol and left.

Later that night cops were at his door to arrest him. Apparently they had got his license plate number or something and called the cops to say he pulled a gun on them for no reason at all. The cops told him since they reported it and he didn’t, they had to assume he was the bad guy. It was he said/she said, so he didn’t get charged, but he did lose his CHL over it.

In both of those cases the bad guys got the last laugh. What the first guy did wrong was firing his gun when there was no imminent threat. What the second guy did wrong was to not report the altercation to the police asap. It stinks, but nowadays you have to not only know how to protect yourself physically, but also CYA legally by knowing exactly what you can and can’t get in trouble for.

That covers it pretty well, as I have been saying all along just use common sense. A person is within their right in most locations to confront even a gas thief while armed (as long as the gun was legally owned) and also to use that gun as a means of self defense if attacked by the thief. HOWEVER it pretty much ends there, we can try and hold the perp at gunpoint until the cops arrive and it might very well work if the low life thinks you just might be mad enough to actually shoot but as said before if they just decide to laugh at us and walk off there's not much we can do legally. Tough talk about having them become a missing person might be fun to discuss here but in the real world it had better be taken very seriously! While it just might work and a person might get away with it we have to consider a few things, first the prisons are full of people who thought they could "get away with it" but every situation is different and it's too easy to overlook something that can get a person caught. Besides shooting someone for stealing gas is a bit extreme and some folks could very well come to serious grief after they have calmed down and realized what they have done even if within their legal rights, I am not saying it should never happen, that would depend on the circumstances, but it is an extremely serious matter that should take extremely serious consideration before doing something like that. Personally I would never shoot someone purely over a tank of gas, I might go to great lengths to stop them and see that they pay for their crime but I know that eventually I have to answer to a much higher authority than any of man's laws. For those who might scoff at such a reason that's Ok but they will still have to deal with what they have done as far as the law is concerned. That has been my whole point all along, do what we can within the law and use common sense, don't play silly games with these idiots because most likely they will win in the end no matter how much we might like to see funny endings to feel good stories here on these forums, in real life it rarely works out that way!

The bottom line is first obey the law, a person should never prod the perp into taking retaliatory action against them when they are not going to be around to prevent it despite the desire one might have to get "even", it usually will just end up being a case of needing to "get even" twice! And of course NEVER do anything as stupid as setting a booby trap that could land a person in jail!

There is a lot of wisdom to the old adage of "don't cut off your nose to spite your face" but that's exactly what some of these pranks and traps can easily become.

[hanleyfan]

I guess its where you live, around here in the hills if you rob people they shoot first and ask question second, in fact my neighbor told me the sheriff told him if he shot someone make sure he is dead because dead men tell no tales.

[oldred]

I guess its where you live, around here in the hills if you rob people they shoot first and ask question second, in fact my neighbor told me the sheriff told him if he shot someone make sure he is dead because dead men tell no tales.

Here we go again with another well worn tale! "The Sheriff told me to shoot" is one of the most common but that too is utter nonsense! In the first place no law officer nor the Sheriff can give you the right to shoot someone and a Sheriff who would say something as dumb as that old worn out line would have to be pretty stupid himself! Every situation is different and killing someone is obviously an extremely serious matter so any lawman, Sheriff or whomever that would say something that stupid could be in serious trouble if it could be proven against them!

This a good example of the old nonsense tales that some people actually believe and is exactly the kind of nonsense that ended up causing that guy I mentioned earlier and two others to go to prison when otherwise they would have been in the clear! Folks we need to be adults here and if discussing something as serious taking someone's life it should be discussed in a serious manner without referencing old tales and total nonsense such as the above!

[danthman114]

so did you find out who was stealing gas?

[Petrol & Powder]

Can we stop beating this dead horse ?

[Riverpigusmc]

Actually the police in Arlington Texas (after my truck was broken into) told me if it's after dark, shoot 'em then call. He showed me the Texas statutes about protecting property after dark. So, no, the above advice is NOT hard and fast

[oldred]

Actually the police in Arlington Texas (after my truck was broken into) told me if it's after dark, shoot 'em then call. He showed me the Texas statutes about protecting property after dark. So, no, the above advice is NOT hard and fast

I bet you can't find any such statute!


:EDIT: Ok I will have to take back water on that one, it actually is a law in Texas! Ya just gotta love them Texans!

[rl69]

In Texas, one can use deadly force not just to protect a person, but also to protect personal property, including to “retrieve stolen property at night,” during “criminal mischief in the nighttime” and even to prevent someone who is fleeing immediately after a theft during the night or a burglary or robbery, so long as ...Jul 24, 2013
Three Self-Defense Laws That Could Be Even Worse Than Stand ...

[rl69]

The acquittal of George Zimmerman has reignited the national conversation about so-called “Stand Your Ground” laws that authorize deadly force in self-defense anywhere a person has a legal right to be, without a duty to mitigate the harm by attempting retreat. The Trayvon Martin killing and many other fatal shootings are raising deeply troubling questions about what sort of civilian vigilantism, discrimination, and arbitrary judgment is authorized by laws that put discretion into the hands of civilians.

But the notorious Stand Your Ground provision is one of several that give broad discretion to civilians to use inordinate force in self-defense. Below are three other force-empowering provisions that are just as, if not even more, expansive:

1. Texas: Deadly Force In Defense Of Personal Property.
Stand Your Ground laws authorize deadly force not just when an individual has reasonable fear of death; but also for fear of great bodily harm or a “forcible felony.” In many states, these provisions are potentially authorizing disproportionate force in response to a fear of crimes as low-level as third-degree assault or robbery. But even these crimes involve injury to a person.

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Texas is different. In Texas, one can use deadly force not just to protect a person, but also to protect personal property, including to “retrieve stolen property at night,” during “criminal mischief in the nighttime” and even to prevent someone who is fleeing immediately after a theft during the night or a burglary or robbery, so long as the individual “reasonably” thinks the property cannot be protected by other means. This law recently garnered attention when lawyers used the provision to defend a man acquitted in the deadly shooting of an escort who refused to have sex with him. In other cases, the law has been the basis for not pressing charges against individuals who shoot and kill suspected car burglars, and an individual suspected of stealing copper wiring from a car. It is worth noting that some other states authorize the use of force to protect personal property, but not deadly force.

2. Indiana: Right To Shoot The Police.
Last year, Indiana became the first and only state to enact an NRA-backed law that specifically allows civilian force against law enforcement officers and other “public servants” when they are engaging in “unlawful activity.” The statute came in response to a court ruling that held the exact opposite — that individuals could not use deadly force to protect against a police intrusion, even if they questioned the legality of the intrusion.

The law authorizes “reasonable force” against any unlawful entry or trespass by police, and even deadly force to prevent serious bodily injury and what the shooter deems unlawful activity. While the allowance for deadly force is narrow, police have expressed serious concern that an occupant of a home confronting a police break-in will not be able to properly assess, in the heat of the moment, whether or not the officer entered the home pursuant to a lawful warrant or other public safety exception authorized by the U.S. Constitution, and whether that officer poses a legitimate danger.

3. Majority Of States: The Expanded Castle Doctrine.
Stand Your Ground laws and other expanded self-defense provisions all derived from the old English common law concept that individuals have a right to defend their homes. The original “Castle Doctrine” gave individuals a right to protect their home against intruders, even if that meant using deadly force. Because they were protecting their home, courts carved out an exception to the general rule that individuals protecting themselves must first attempt to mitigate the harm, or “retreat,” so that an individual would not be forced to retreat from their own home.

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Stand Your Ground laws that expand that “no duty to retreat” concept to anywhere an individual has a right to be have been described as an expansion of the Castle Doctrine. But they are not the only expansion passed in countless states. Many states have also incorporated into their laws similar authority to use deadly force in protection of their “occupied vehicles” or offices, and have expanded the conception of the home to include not just the house but the curtilage — a legal term for the property surrounding the house. While Stand Your Ground laws confer the right to use deadly force to protect against a forcible felony anywhere someone has a right to be, individuals can use deadly force against much less when one is defending their home, vehicle, or office. In a number of states, the law presumes a reasonable fear of imminent peril or death if an individual is unlawfully entering an occupant’s home, car, or office. The expanded Castle Doctrine has been used to justify a shooting against a burglary of a neighbor’s home, and the fatal shooting of a 20-year-old who walked onto a neighbor’s porch to escape a potential police bust of underaged drinking. And just this week, a Virginia woman shot at a car that used her driveway to turn around on the highway — an intrusion she argues is an unlawful entry onto her property.

https://thinkprogress.org/three-self...-b425742ff724/

[rl69]

Diferent sight
https://lawofselfdefense.com/statute...tect-property/

[fatelk]

A little off topic, or at least going in a little different direction: a lot of people seem to think that things like petty theft and vandalism are "kid stuff" that young people will do, and it's relatively harmless stuff that they'll outgrow.

Growing up on the farm we saw it all. Every small farm typically has a fuel tank or two. As least a couple times that we know of, someone was helping themselves to it. Once my dad caught a guy walking up the driveway in the dark with a gas can. He surprised the guy and he took off, leaving the gas can. A couple other times we got our mailbox smashed in the middle of the night. My dad was talking to a neighbor one time and the guy dismissed this kind of stuff as "kid stuff", no big deal. He said, heck, he used to do the same kind of stuff when he was young. Need gas for your car? A farmer won't miss a few gallons.

My dad told me later how he instantly lost some respect for that neighbor, and that if he ever heard of me doing any of that kind of "kid stuff", I would be in major trouble. Not that I ever would have. I was raised better than that.

[bob208]

pa. is a stand your ground state also protect your castle.

[Riverpigusmc]

I hate it when people refer to police as anything other than "civilians". They are neither commissioned or enlisted in the military.