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Thread: Rifled Pump Shotgun... Advice?

  1. #261
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Range report!

    I got the new to me Slugster out for a test drive today and all went well. The gun function well except for one round that stuck in the chamber for a bit and of course I forgot my cleaning rod! I took the barrel off and tried to get at the rim but couldn't easily and didn't want to do any damage so decided to end my day there. Put the barrel back on and slammed the action shut then opened it and the hull ejected!

    Not sure why the double extractors couldn't seem to get a grip then suddenly did but that's the facts. I thought at first the hull might have been dirty of brass (coated steel head) rusted or rough but there was no sign of any issue with the hull. Loads were not hot so not likely over pressure. All I can think of is this was range pick up hulls and a few had very tight primers when I ran them through my Sizemaster so maybe when the primer was pushed out the head bulged a bit? I'm thinking thicker rim or less edge for the extractors?

    Other than that the gun worked well and no further problems. I shot around 40+ slug loads off the bench. Nothing shot particularly well except 0.678" RB's in shotcups.

    First target was at 25 yards to check sight settings and low hold on my 4" square diamond targets got me pretty much center of target so sights are good. Hard to see but lined up well for the slugs I shot.

    I took with me:

    - 35 Lee 1 oz. slugs. with glue skirts in Winchester yellow 1 1/4 oz. wads. These were sized down to remove taper then skirt added and paper patched to snug fit in bore.
    - 5 Lee 7/8 oz. slugs as cast with glue skirt added. In Claybuster 1 oz. wads which are thin I had to use one wrap of paper to make snug fit.
    - 5 Lee 7/8 oz. slugs as cast in the same wad
    - 10 Russian Paradox slugs and wads KrackenFan69 sent me some time ago ~ these seem to be perfect fir for this Mossberg bore though they mic'd a bit small, they are a snug push into the muzzle.
    - I also had some 0.678" round ball loads from last outing and some Lee 1 oz. slug loads

    I shot all but 5 of the 1 oz. slugs with glue skirts, all 10 of the 7/8 oz. slugs, the 10 Paradox slugs about 10 of the previously loaded Lee slugs and about 10 of the previously loaded 0.678" RB's so lots of shooting off the bench!

    Accuracy at 25 yards seemed pretty decent but groups were larger than I would have expected. I think partly new gun, partly sights a bit hard to see and partly heavy trigger pull, very heavy trigger pull!

    Winchester wads all looked good but the Claybusters not so much. I'll look then over closer but it seems the gas seals failed again. There were other people at the range so I didn't get to look much for wads and slugs, got a few but not a lot.

    First thing I noticed is less recoil than my single shot but not unexpected since this gun seems heavier. Second thing was the enormous fireball muzzle flash I got from both Blue Dot, SR4756 and Unique but not Green Dot. I have not noticed muzzle flash so much in my single shot but the barrel is a few inches longer. It makes a big difference! Third thing was that the sights are pretty much right on. Somewhere in the midst of that I noticed the heavy trigger pull.

    So, after sorting things out and being confident sights were reasonably close I tried 50 yard shooting. Not very good! Again, new gun, sights very difficult to see depending on light, and very heavy trigger pull. Between the sights and trigger pull I think those were the main reasons for poor accuracy.

    No complaints about the gun though, I like it. I do want to lighten up the trigger so if anyone has tips please pass them on.

    Sights will be getting the nail polish treatment so I can see them better. The rear sight may need to be filed a little wider too but I'll try some bright pink nail polish on the front sight then see how that looks.

    Since the intended use if primarily for bear protection these things are not critical because at 25 yards it was accurate enough to dispatch a bear if need be. However, I do want to get a better sight picture and lighter trigger pull. The gun seems quite tight (barrel to receiver) but I'll look at whether shimming would help.

    On the rifled barrel front, the same place I bought the gun now has a rifled barrel for $150.00 CDN which seems like a good deal to me. Not sure if I will buy it or finish my rifled choke tube first to see how that works but for $150.00 I'm thinking I may just buy the barrel.

    As for slugs, I was a bit disappointed. The 0.678" RB's shot as well as the Lee 1 oz. and 7/8 oz. with or without glue skirt and the Russian Paradox slugs. I'm sure some of my accuracy woes are due to sight picture and trigger pull so may be easily fixable. We'll see. For now I will focus on Lee slugs with and without glue skirts and round balls.

    I have not bought one of the NOE Lyman clone mould yet though I would like to but at around $200.00 CDN by the time I get it. I'm not sure I will be buying one. I think I'd rather get the rifled barrel for $150.00... but then I need a scope so...? Then there's the option of buying a Maverick with rifled barrel and being able to swap barrels then use the Maverick for a beater. Too many decisions! Too little money!

    In the meantime I'll see what I can find on lightening that trigger and rectifying sight picture. Those are high on my to do list after shooting today. I do like that gun though!

    Longbow

  2. #262
    Boolit Master bikerbeans's Avatar
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    LB,

    I think your case of "Slugitis" is worse than mine. I will shoot as many rounds of ammo as you do but now i use a rifled 410 instead of a 10 or 12ga. When i return home i still remember the names of my 4 dogs.

    Glad you had fun with your Slugster.

    IMO, i think you should buy that rifled barrel and switch to solid base FB slugs or RBs.

    BB

  3. #263
    Boolit Master Blood Trail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by longbow View Post
    Range report!

    I got the new to me Slugster out for a test drive today and all went well. The gun function well except for one round that stuck in the chamber for a bit and of course I forgot my cleaning rod! I took the barrel off and tried to get at the rim but couldn't easily and didn't want to do any damage so decided to end my day there. Put the barrel back on and slammed the action shut then opened it and the hull ejected!

    Not sure why the double extractors couldn't seem to get a grip then suddenly did but that's the facts. I thought at first the hull might have been dirty of brass (coated steel head) rusted or rough but there was no sign of any issue with the hull. Loads were not hot so not likely over pressure. All I can think of is this was range pick up hulls and a few had very tight primers when I ran them through my Sizemaster so maybe when the primer was pushed out the head bulged a bit? I'm thinking thicker rim or less edge for the extractors?

    Other than that the gun worked well and no further problems. I shot around 40+ slug loads off the bench. Nothing shot particularly well except 0.678" RB's in shotcups.

    First target was at 25 yards to check sight settings and low hold on my 4" square diamond targets got me pretty much center of target so sights are good. Hard to see but lined up well for the slugs I shot.

    I took with me:

    - 35 Lee 1 oz. slugs. with glue skirts in Winchester yellow 1 1/4 oz. wads. These were sized down to remove taper then skirt added and paper patched to snug fit in bore.
    - 5 Lee 7/8 oz. slugs as cast with glue skirt added. In Claybuster 1 oz. wads which are thin I had to use one wrap of paper to make snug fit.
    - 5 Lee 7/8 oz. slugs as cast in the same wad
    - 10 Russian Paradox slugs and wads KrackenFan69 sent me some time ago ~ these seem to be perfect fir for this Mossberg bore though they mic'd a bit small, they are a snug push into the muzzle.
    - I also had some 0.678" round ball loads from last outing and some Lee 1 oz. slug loads

    I shot all but 5 of the 1 oz. slugs with glue skirts, all 10 of the 7/8 oz. slugs, the 10 Paradox slugs about 10 of the previously loaded Lee slugs and about 10 of the previously loaded 0.678" RB's so lots of shooting off the bench!

    Accuracy at 25 yards seemed pretty decent but groups were larger than I would have expected. I think partly new gun, partly sights a bit hard to see and partly heavy trigger pull, very heavy trigger pull!

    Winchester wads all looked good but the Claybusters not so much. I'll look then over closer but it seems the gas seals failed again. There were other people at the range so I didn't get to look much for wads and slugs, got a few but not a lot.

    First thing I noticed is less recoil than my single shot but not unexpected since this gun seems heavier. Second thing was the enormous fireball muzzle flash I got from both Blue Dot, SR4756 and Unique but not Green Dot. I have not noticed muzzle flash so much in my single shot but the barrel is a few inches longer. It makes a big difference! Third thing was that the sights are pretty much right on. Somewhere in the midst of that I noticed the heavy trigger pull.

    So, after sorting things out and being confident sights were reasonably close I tried 50 yard shooting. Not very good! Again, new gun, sights very difficult to see depending on light, and very heavy trigger pull. Between the sights and trigger pull I think those were the main reasons for poor accuracy.

    No complaints about the gun though, I like it. I do want to lighten up the trigger so if anyone has tips please pass them on.

    Sights will be getting the nail polish treatment so I can see them better. The rear sight may need to be filed a little wider too but I'll try some bright pink nail polish on the front sight then see how that looks.

    Since the intended use if primarily for bear protection these things are not critical because at 25 yards it was accurate enough to dispatch a bear if need be. However, I do want to get a better sight picture and lighter trigger pull. The gun seems quite tight (barrel to receiver) but I'll look at whether shimming would help.

    On the rifled barrel front, the same place I bought the gun now has a rifled barrel for $150.00 CDN which seems like a good deal to me. Not sure if I will buy it or finish my rifled choke tube first to see how that works but for $150.00 I'm thinking I may just buy the barrel.

    As for slugs, I was a bit disappointed. The 0.678" RB's shot as well as the Lee 1 oz. and 7/8 oz. with or without glue skirt and the Russian Paradox slugs. I'm sure some of my accuracy woes are due to sight picture and trigger pull so may be easily fixable. We'll see. For now I will focus on Lee slugs with and without glue skirts and round balls.

    I have not bought one of the NOE Lyman clone mould yet though I would like to but at around $200.00 CDN by the time I get it. I'm not sure I will be buying one. I think I'd rather get the rifled barrel for $150.00... but then I need a scope so...? Then there's the option of buying a Maverick with rifled barrel and being able to swap barrels then use the Maverick for a beater. Too many decisions! Too little money!

    In the meantime I'll see what I can find on lightening that trigger and rectifying sight picture. Those are high on my to do list after shooting today. I do like that gun though!

    Longbow
    I ordered spring kits for all my mossbergs from MCARBO and I have been quite pleased. Dropped the pull down to around 4lbs.

    https://www.mcarbo.com/store/p/36-Mo...pring-Kit.aspx

    Also, Mossberg is running a Black Friday sale on their barrels. Bought a fully rifled cantilever barrel for my sonís 20 ga for $90.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  4. #264
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    LB: the stuck hull was probably a cheap Winchester hull with the aluminum base? What you did to clear it was the standard method of clearing this type of malfunction. Sometimes the hull gets stuck a little harder. In that case you hold the slide release, apply rearward pressure on the fore end, and then hit the butt of the gun on your knee as it is going up. This is called "Butt Stroking." It is the accepted method of clearing this type of malfunction..

    I got one so stuck at FS that butt stroking wouldn't even work and we had to ram a rod own the hole to eject the stuck round. Once again a Winchester hull with the aluminum base which gets expanded a little more than the brass bases or brass plated steel bases.

    On the trigger try removing the group and working some Vaseline into the works. A little here and there works wonders and also it will loosen up with shooting. My gun has pushing 2000 rounds thru it and runs flawlessly. Also if you do wear out the extractors they are cheap parts.

    I'd buy that $150 rifled barrel if I was you.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  5. #265
    Boolit Grand Master

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    BT:

    Yes, I found MCARBO as well so was going to ask if the kit was good. If you say it is I better get one... if the ship to Canada anyway, so I'll have to check on that.

    I didn't find much else which surprised me given the number of Mossbergs in use and the number of complaints about heavy trigger pull. Even for a shotgun it is heavy, or mine is anyway and I read similar on internet posts. I would have figured there would be a good selection of improvement parts especially for a heavy trigger pull.

    I'm going to take the trigger group out after lunch to see what I've got. Probably too much to hope that is the LPA adjustable trigger in this gun though it would make sense to put a good trigger in a slug gun.

    I like the gun but I would definitely like a lighter trigger.

    Can a "trigger job" be done reasonably on a Mossberg trigger? Or is this a gunsmith or machinist task only?

    If MCARBO ships to Canada I better order a kit regardless and if they don't I'll get it sent to a US address then pick it up. I am only about 40 minutes from the border.

    Longbow

  6. #266
    Boolit Grand Master

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    I was just about to PM you Randy to check to see if you had done any trigger work on your Mossbergs.

    Yeah, I'm thinking about that barrel. I was debating whether I should wait to try my slow twist rifled choke tube (I am almost ready to start rifling) or just buy the barrel. I go back to work tomorrow so that is a good thing as I haven't had much work over the last month.

    I'd like to get one for $99 US but they can't be shipped to Canada so... no go there but $150 CDN is a good price. They have another that is $99 but in "poor" condition with pitting just ahead of the chamber. If I could look at it I might decide it is minor but since I can't best not to take a chance on that one since the "excellent" barrel is only $50 more.

    The only thing here is that it isn't just a barrel, I need a scope or red dot too so there goes another $100 minimum.

    Hard to justify when I haven't been working much.

    We'll see.

    Longbow

  7. #267
    Boolit Master Blood Trail's Avatar
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    It took me about 20 mins per gun. Took longer on my 88 becuz the trigger group is slightly different


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  8. #268
    Boolit Grand Master

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    I ordered a spring set from MCARBO yesterday. I got notification it shipped today!

    I also ordered an upgrade for my old Lee Challenger press that broke some time ago. Still worked but there was a cast toothed part to hold and set angle for the handle that broke years ago. I decided I should get the upgrade parts so ordered them from Titan Reloading yesterday and they shipped today to!

    I included two Lee slug mould core pins in the Titan order so I can try modifying them. Thinking thicker nose and added stem in the middle for a screw for attached wads.

    Anyway, more stuff for the Slugster!

    I am looking forward to the lighter trigger pull!

    Are there other options or procedures for this? The only outfit I found selling springs or parts was MCARBO and no info on trigger jobs which I'd figure are doable. I'm glad BT recommends the MCARBO kit. I trust his judgment.

    Longbow

  9. #269
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Not a lot to report as I haven't had the gun out again. I wanted to wait until I got the M*CARBO spring set. Well that arrived today! Even with Canada Post strike and mail delays that isn't too bad.

    I will get the spring set installed in a few days and maybe I'll get a chance to shoot this coming weekend.

    I painted the front sight white and I found a nice ghost ring rear site that Williams makes but didn't order yet due to postal service disruptions and Christmas rush. I'll probably order one after Christmas.

    I also got my package from Lee a few days ago so have the parts to upgrade my old Challenger press and I got two core pins for the Lee slug moulds. I plan to drill and taper ream to put a center post with screw starter hole so I can screw on hard felt wads, Brenneke like. The Lee slugs seem to perform better with my attached wad of hot melt glue but adding that is a bit tedious. Putting hard felt wads on with a wood screw should be pretty quick.

    Also working on my rifled choke tube but that is slow going to date. I just remade the cutter from a file edge to a single hook cutter. I'll see how that works. Nothing to lose anyway! If it works on my single shot it will wind up install on my Slugster.

    If it doesn't work then I'll be looking for a rifled barrel!

    Longbow

  10. #270
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Okay then... not as easy as it looked in the video but I got the M*CARBO spring set installed.

    Took me a long time fighting with the trigger return spring. I watched that video and I swear the trigger group he has is different than mine... more space! I could not fit the trigger in with the M*CARBO trigger return spring without removing the hammer. I spent about 1/2 hour diddling about with that and either the trigger return spring would bend over and come out of position or if compressed it would pop out when it passed a hole.

    Once the hammer was removed it was easy to install the trigger with return spring.

    The rest was a snap.

    Oddly though, I struggled with the trigger pull at the range, it was HEAVY! I didn't check weight but hard to pull HEAVY!

    When I cleaned the gun I washed out the trigger group with WD40 (yeah, yeah I know "Don't use WD 40 on guns) then dried the trigger group and oiled everything. I find that WD40 alone is not very good as many say but when combined with good oil I have great success and no problems.

    Before changing springs I used my very unsophisticated fish scale to weigh the trigger pull which came in at about 4 lbs... so not bad and seemingly much lighter than when I was at the range. After installing the M*CARBO spring set I again weighed trigger pull with my unsophisticated set up and got... 4 lbs.! So, seemingly no reduction but if 4 lbs. plenty good. A range day will tell for sure if the trigger pull is lighter but it definitely feels lighter.

    I will say that M*CARBO is very good at follow up. I've received several e-mails checking to make sure I got my parts and asking how they work... which I don't know yet but I'm going to say that I bet the trigger pull is better now.

    Still keeping an eye out for rifled barrel and have plans for another attempt at rifled choke tube.

    Next is shimming the barrel to tighten things up then off to the range I go! That'll be after Christmas.

    On that note, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all!

    Longbow

  11. #271
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    You need to run 2-400 rounds thru it as fast as you can. Your gun is not broken in yet. It will do wonders for how the gun runs and shoots.

    I have never heard of "shimming the barrel?" What do you shim? Why do you shim it? Look on Ebay for rifled barrels. There's a bunch on there.

    It would be great if you could go to a Tactical Shotgun class and burn up a bunch of ammo learning how to run the gun in an efficient manner. After that the gun would probably be broken in, so after a deep clean you could do some accuracy testing and find what the gun likes and sight it in and then go shoot some bears or some meat of some type!

    Good Luck and Merry Christmas to all.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  12. #272
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Yeah, it might need some break in. It's not new but it really doesn't look like it has seen much use.

    No courses like that around here. I'll have to load slugs and buckshot and just blast to give it some use.

    I've got lots of slugs to test so that's a start.

    EBay can't ship gun parts to Canada as far as I know. I'll most likely have to look for rifled barrel here.

    Yes, Merry Christmas to all!

    Longbow

  13. #273
    Boolit Master
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    Merry Christmas to everyone!

    You can break it in with birdshot loads. Probably a bit cheaper, but maybe not as much fun.
    I passed my last psych eval, how bout you?

  14. #274
    Boolit Master

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    One of the good things with shooting slugs - they are easy to find in the berm .

  15. #275
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by toallmy View Post
    One of the good things with shooting slugs - they are easy to find in the berm .
    Hah! Right you are... a guy almost trips over the big lumps of lead!

  16. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lonegun1894 View Post
    Merry Christmas to everyone!

    You can break it in with birdshot loads. Probably a bit cheaper, but maybe not as much fun.
    Bird shot goes bang too, and it's a lot cheaper than Buck or slugs, it's hard to beat $21.74 /100 at Walmart for Federal or Winchester.

    Get the Federal it runs better in our guns.

    In my last 4 day shotgun class I fired 300 #8's, 150 00's and about 70 slugs. All were factory ammo as that is a requirement at FS.

    I didn't figure there would be a bunch of "Run n Gunners" around where you live, but I bet you could find something in Spokane, and it is definitely something you could benefit from. What they are teaching you is the "gun handling" part of the equation, and after you get some instruction you'll be a better shooter all around.

    One way or another you are going to have to burn some ammo to get that gun where it needs to be, once it's broken in you will see what I'm talking about.

    I haven't steered you wrong yet,,, Have I?

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  17. #277
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Well, still no rifled barrel for it but I filed the rear sight a little larger and with the white paint on the front bead now much more visible. I have installed the M*Carbo spring set and it does seem to have made a big difference to trigger pull. While I was at it I sprayed the trigger group down with WD40... yes I know many don't like it but I do and use it more like a solvent to clean, then I dry and oil after. That also seemed to help with the trigger pull.

    Today I decided to shim the barrel even though sights are mounted on the barrel I have to think that looseness in the barrel mounting will lead to less accuracy. That barrel will be flopping around during the recoil pulse. Regardless, I first cut a cylindrical shim 3/4" wide form a soda can so it would wrap right around the barrel where it fits the receiver. That just fit and snugged things up very well. However, it is pretty fragile stuff so I decided I'd make one to fit the tang and wrap from there so did that. It worked but that fragile thing...! I caught an edge after disassembling and reassembling so it wrinkled a bit and I had to cut a bit off. Then it wasn't as snug so... I decided to cut a "shoe" out of brass shim stock 0.005" thick and it just fits on top of the barrel tang wrapping part way around. That really snugs the barrel up and it fits well plus the brass is much tougher than the pop (soda) can. It can't hurt whether it helps or not.

    Ready to get back out and shoot once weather improves a bit. likely in a week or two. Got some slug and 2 ball loads to put together anyway. So I'll get that done.

    Still looking for a rifled barrel for a good price. Ellwood Epps has a used one for $225.00 CDN which isn't real bad but not much cheaper than new.

    Longbow

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check