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Thread: Slowest Twist For Fifty Molds

  1. #1
    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Slowest Twist For Fifty Molds

    For shooting paper patched the commonly available Lee, Lyman and RCBS off the shelf fifty caliber rifle molds...
    What's the slowest twist you would go with?
    At what shooting distances?

  2. #2
    Boolit Master

    Hickory's Avatar
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    One in 48 is about as slow as you want to go with on a 50 caliber muzzleloader using conical bullets.
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    Boolit Master
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    As far as I know the only off the shelf molds for PP are for the S&W 500. They require a bit of sizing to work (see sticky above). Most molds advertised for .50cal are around .510 to .515 dia, far too large for the typical muzzleloader.

    The bullets at 400gn and larger require a fast twist. The Lyman GPH is just adequate at 1:32 twist and it starts to fail when the bullets get to 500gn or longer. You really want a faster twist if you can find one.

    A 1:48 would be ok for something like the Lee REAL or maybe the Lyman bullets made for muzzleloaders.

    PS be sure to use pure lead or at least very soft lead (a little tin to make casting easier). Harder lead (like CWW) will usually not upset into the rifling properly.

    Range is limited by how good you and the rifle are. 300yd is not too bad and some have shot .50 out to much longer ranges accurately. It becomes more of a windage issue as the trajectories are quite high. If you want to go to the 600yd and further then get a .45 instead. The bullets have much better ballistics.

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    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    .52 Renegade with a 28" twist.

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    I think 28" is faster than it needs to be. Hence asking.

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    Boolit Master roverboy's Avatar
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    I've shot Hornady Great Plains 385 gr., T/C Maxi-Balls, T/C Maxi-Hunters out of my CVA with 1-32" and it shot them all great. I don't know about something heavier and longer. Might have problems.
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    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Duh, I should look up the twists that makers of .50 caliber black powder cartridge rifles put in their breech loaders.
    It's the same boolits. The same propellant. The same velocities.

    I'm gonna go look. Now where's my musty ol' copy of Cartridges Of The World...

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    https://www.riflemagazine.com/magazi...d=18&tocid=220

    Rifling twist rates for .50-70s are also interesting. Trapdoor Springfields used a 42-inch twist, but the Sharps Rifle Company started out with a 48-inch twist that was later tightened to one turn in 36 inches. Remington also used the 42-inch twist but made some .50-70s with very tight 24-inch twist rates.

  8. #8
    Boolit Man
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    I have a T/C NewEnglander barrel that I had Bobby Hoyt re bore to 52 cal.I went with the 1-36 twist to shoot the 50-70 govt bullet, 450 grn Lee mold. I size the .515 as cast down to .512 wrap 2x's onion skin paper then load. Was showing great promise, However I did not care for the stock on the New Englander so it was sold off. I still have the barrel...it may become an under hammer or I may sell it.

  9. #9
    Boolit Buddy arcticap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Good Cheer View Post
    .52 Renegade with a 28" twist.

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    I think 28" is faster than it needs to be. Hence asking.
    The Pedersoli .45 Gibbs world championship quality long range target rifles use a 540 grain .451 paper patched bullet.
    They're fired at distances as far as 600 - 900 yards and are made with a 1:18" twist.

    Their Gibbs short to medium range .45 target version has a 1 in 21" twist (shorter barrel 32" vs. 36")

    When put into perspective & compared to a .50 caliber, then 1:28" seems about right.
    It's probably better to have a twist that's too fast than too slow for shooting PP conicals.
    Last edited by arcticap; 09-12-2018 at 03:14 AM.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    What's the slowest twist you would go with?__At what shooting distances?
    1 & 70 w/ PRB. 75 yards would be a ideal shooting distance.
    100 & plus yards would be a Hail-Mary shot at best with such projectile and 70_twist.
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  11. #11
    Boolit Master



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    rcbs makes are did make a 50 cal. smooth sided mold for a fifty it was adjustable

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    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Once drew up a smooth sided SWC that could have an adjustable length plug.
    That would be a simple design, nice to patch, would cut nice holes and could be tuned for best shooting.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hickory View Post
    One in 48 is about as slow as you want to go with on a 50 caliber muzzleloader using conical bullets.
    I know my GM(45) is 1-30 and think the GM (50) is 1-28 and the 50 shoots the S+W 501 /sized .499 with 2 wraps of 9LB onion skin very well/Ed

  14. #14
    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    This reminds me, i've got an unused 518145 Ideal for 50-70 and the box it rode in on that I'm gonna put up for sale.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcticap View Post
    The Pedersoli .45 Gibbs world championship quality long range target rifles use a 540 grain .451 paper patched bullet.
    They're fired at distances as far as 600 - 900 yards and are made with a 1:18" twist.

    Their Gibbs short to medium range .45 target version has a 1 in 21" twist (shorter barrel 32" vs. 36")

    When put into perspective & compared to a .50 caliber, then 1:28" seems about right.
    It's probably better to have a twist that's too fast than too slow for shooting PP conicals.
    And perhaps the faster twist gives you more leeway in load development, lesser and greater powder charges.
    That's a factor I'd not been thinking about.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check