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Thread: Titegroup?

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy engineer401's Avatar
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    I’ve never had lead issues with Tite Group with 38 or 9mm. My lead hardness is closer to 10.

  2. #22
    Boolit Master Half Dog's Avatar
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    Thank you all for the information. I got a chance to cast 100 more boolits and I'm excited to try your suggestions. For me to see which issue is causing the issue, I'll start with sizing the boolits 0.357" and I'll let you know how this works.

    Thanks again.
    The sooner I fall behind...the more time I have to catch up with

  3. #23
    Boolit Bub
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    I’ve had great luck with tote group and properly sized bullets.

  4. #24
    Boolit Buddy hermans's Avatar
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    Cannot comment on the load with Titegroup since we do not get it here, but I agree with the others that you should size your boolits to at least .357 and even bigger if you can get them to chamber properly. Should help to get a better seal.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master
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    I've burned 16 lb of Titegroup in the .45acp using sized and Felix lubed bolts with no leading issues, so I don't know that I'd blame the powder first thing. Leading the full length of the barrel is usually a size/obduration issue so the first thing I'd do is pull a boolit and make sure the FCD isn't reducing the diameter too much or wrecking the coating.

  6. #26
    Boolit Master
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    I too would go to a .357, even .358 if they will chamber. Also the same for the Lee FCD, it may be damaging/resizing your bullets after seating. A light taper crimp, enough to remove the flare and just a touch more for a crimp is all that is needed.

  7. #27
    Boolit Buddy TMenezes's Avatar
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    For those that don't like hotter than average burn temp of TG, I read that True Blue has one of the lowest burn temps. I tried it and found it to work really well for me, just took a coyote a few days ago with a mild 357 mag load.

  8. #28
    Boolit Buddy LaPoint's Avatar
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    I thought that TG was causing my leading problems in my Wolff barreled 9mm G22 but I wasn't belling the case mouth enough. The leading went away after I increased the bell. I didn't like the amount of smoke from TG so I switched to Alliant's Sport Pistol. Noticeably less smoke w/ ASP.

  9. #29
    Boolit Master


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    Quote Originally Posted by oteroman View Post
    TG is the worst powder to use with lead and lead coated bullets by the way.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    A week and no explanation of the comment. I've burned about 50 pounds of Titegroup in 12 years and while I agree that it produces some smoke most of that was the lube and not the powder. It's very popular for .40 S&W in USPSA even though it doesn't show up in many published load recommendations. It's not terribly dirty and it's economical when shooting a lot. I have never failed to make major power using my preferred load of TG so I fail to see why it's so terrible. I don't think I have used it for 9mm and if I have it wasn't much so will end my comments there.
    Sometimes life taps you on the shoulder and reminds you it's a one way street. Jim Morris

  10. #30
    Boolit Master Half Dog's Avatar
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    Update:

    Thank you all for your valuable input.

    I cast 150 more boolits (15 BHN) and sized them to 0.357". I coated, sized, then coated again using the Hi-Tek coating. I'm using a Hornady LnL press and I adjusted the M Die to flare the brass to 0.400" O.D.. That looked like an excessive flare but it didn't compress the boolits. I used 3.5 grains of Titegroup, kept the same seating depth, and I adjusted the FCD so the taper crimp measured 0.3815". I pulled a boolit and I didn't notice any change in the boolit diameter. I'm seating the boolit at one station then using the FCD to crimp at the next station. I loaded 50 rounds and had trouble containing my excitement.

    I fired the 50 rounds and I still had leading in the barrel but not near as bad. It is possible that I might not have cleaned all of the lead from the barrel but it seems clean now. I plan to shoot some J bullets prior to trying again.

    It doesn't seem like the FCD is affecting the boolit but I plan on using a TC die in its place to make sure.

    Any more input would be greatly appreciated.
    The sooner I fall behind...the more time I have to catch up with

  11. #31
    Boolit Master



    Dieselhorses's Avatar
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    Pay attention to "Engineer401 and Hermans" posts. "Lead hardness" and "diameter" are the keys to "bullet obturation". Bullet needs to EXPAND going down bore! I don't care what kind of coating you use! Matter of fact, I found a sweet spot in BHN for my 38/357 where I don't even use gas checks and very little coating and STILL no leading. I size to .358 AFTER coating, never have issues. First I started loading for 500 S&W, boy I thought I had it licked. I used alloy at 23 or 24 BHN and that was a mistake! Bullet bounced all over the inside of barrel! After 2 days of cleaning the 8" barrel I learned rightly.
    The unexamined life is not worth living....Socrates
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  12. #32
    Boolit Master
    Mal Paso's Avatar
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    Copper is sticky. A copper removing bore solvent might be a good idea before switching to lead. Ammonia was the active ingredient I think. Too long ago. LOL When patches stop coming out green you got all of it.
    Mal

    Mal Paso means Bad Pass, just so you know.

  13. #33
    Boolit Grand Master

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    If everything you try still leaves lead, here's what I did ........purchased a
    NOE mould 358 - 124 - Truncated Cone - Gas Check
    Cast from 50-50 COWW and scrap lead, which is a pretty soft mix, sized .357 or .358 depending on the pistol . Lubed with Lithium - Beeswax lube.
    The gas check does the trick, protects the base when seating the boolit and protects the boolit base while going down the barrel . Bullseye , Titegroup, Red Dot and 700X can all be loaded rather warmly with no leading.
    The NOE store shows they still have one 3 cavity and one 4 cavity and three 5 cavity aluminum moulds still in stock if you want one . Very few GC 9mm moulds are to be found...trust me!
    Sure did solve my problems !
    Gary
    Certified Cajun
    Proud Member of The Basket of Deplorables
    " Let's Go Brandon !"

  14. #34
    Boolit Grand Master fredj338's Avatar
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    I would switch powders but many like TG. Try a bigger bullet. I size 0.357" for all my 9mm. I will load with almost anything but TG. Also ditch the LFCD IMO, solution to a non existent problem.
    EVERY GOOD SHOOTER NEEDS TO BE A HANDLOADER.
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  15. #35
    Boolit Master
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    Next step is to scrub that barrel slick clean. I would probably get a tight fitting jag and wipe some JB bore paste on 10 patches and run each through the barrel. The JB bore paste is used to smooth out tooling marks. Do a little at a time, you cant put metal back. Use a solvent to clean it all out. Then I would try sizing .358. YMMV, but this has worked a couple times for me in the past.

  16. #36
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe View Post
    If your boolits aren't being swaged down from the FCD, there is another thing to consider...
    New 1911 clones tend to have abrupt throats(most need chamfering for boolit use), That is compared to most other 9mm semi-auto's.
    Have you made a few dummy rounds with your PC'd boolits?
    When you cycle them, is the PC scraped off?
    Also, maybe try some lubed boolits.
    Thats the problem with my Kahr CW's.

    BTW: TG is no better or worse with boolits than others. I use it all the time
    I Am Descended From Men Who Would Not Be Ruled

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  17. #37
    Boolit Master rsrocket1's Avatar
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    3.5 seems awefully low. The Hodgdon site says for 115 LRN 3.9-4.3g Titegroup and for 124g plated 3.6 - 4.1g. I use the Lee 356-120-TC at 1.115" COL and found the best load to be 4.2g Titegroup which gives me 1138 fps from a 4.25" barrel and a nice small 5 fps SD. 4.4g gives me 1200fps but I don't need the extra speed so I stick with 4.2g. Titegroup likes to be loaded at near max pressures to burn cleanly. At even slightly lower pressures, it is very smokey and produces sooty cases and larger spreads in MV. The higher pressures also help obturate in the bore to seal off gas blow by in marginally small bullets. If your bullets are more than about 0.5 mils too small or too hard, then you simply won't get the bullet to seal the barrel. The best cure is to use fat enough bullets that don't need expansion to begin with.

  18. #38
    Boolit Master Half Dog's Avatar
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    UPDATE*

    I replaced the FCD with a TC die and found an issue. The rounds wouldn't chamber using the TC die. I reinstalled the FCD, backed it out, and brought it back down until the round would chamber. I pulled the bullet and found the diameter went from 0.357 to 0.355". I feel that a 0.357" boolit will not chamber in my handgun. I'll need to do that several more times to make sure the final diameter is consistent but I feel the 0.357" boolit is too big. I tried to measure the diameter of the chamber near the grooves (please help with the correct term) and measured 0.380", which helped to support my theory.
    It seems that I need to go with a hotter load or a softer boolit to get the proper seal. I feel that my next step should be to load some of the 10 BHN boolits sized to 0.356", use 4.0 grains of the Titegroup, and use the TC die.
    Does anyone know of another use for a FCD? I have one that will be collecting dust.

    Thanks
    The sooner I fall behind...the more time I have to catch up with

  19. #39
    Boolit Master
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    Seat a 357 sized boolit with the TC die. Take a sharpie marker and color in the case and boolit. Chamber it from the magazine, don't be gentle about it, and then eject it. The look for spots of the sharpie missing and determine where it is hanging up. My money is on not closing the belled case enough with the TC die.

  20. #40
    Boolit Master Half Dog's Avatar
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    Great info. I'll give that a try.
    The sooner I fall behind...the more time I have to catch up with

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check