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Thread: What to do with dross?

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
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    What to do with dross?

    Casting newbie here. This summer I was gifted several buckets-worth of range lead, mixed with MUCH wood fiber from the backstop. It was a long, hot process getting it melted down in a dutch oven on a turkey fryer and once it was done there I ended up with close to 200 lbs of ingots and a large turkey-fryer pot mostly full of dross. My concern is that there is a LOT of wasted lead in the dross because it is very heavy, but I'm not sure how to salvage it at this point. If these results are normal, fine, but if a lot of lead was wasted while skimming the top what is the solution for recovering it?

  2. #2
    Boolit Master

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    I put it in metal coffee cans and when I get 30-40 lbs. I sell it to the local scrap yard!
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    If you fluxed the melt properly, The Dross should be as lightweight as ash...unless there was soil/rocks mixed in your range scrap.
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  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    I’ve never melted range scrap, but it seems like there would be quite a lot of copper jackets in the skimming. Along with dirt, rocks etc. copper is quite heavy, especially that much. I don’t think you could get much more lead out of that bucket.

  5. #5
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    Did you flux before you removed the dross?

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    I am cheap. I re-melt my dross. Not that I get a huge amount back but it is the principle to me.

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  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe View Post
    If you fluxed the melt properly, The Dross should be as lightweight as ash...unless there was soil/rocks mixed in your range scrap.
    That's sort of what I was afraid of, JonB. Indoor range, so no soil/rocks. Some copper jackets but not much. The range is used for a lot of rimfire shooting as well as centerfire.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flailguy View Post
    Did you flux before you removed the dross?
    Yes, with hardwood sawdust, usually at least 3 times per pour. There was a LOT of fiber-board in the mix. My guess is that I didn't flux well enough, but this is my first time doing this, and it was not a quick simple job. Because of the sheer volume of stuff to process I probably rushed it some.

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    I'm not sure how much other stuff is in your mix?
    But if it's mostly fiberboard wood, I'd try to separate that out before melting. you could float it off, if that is conducive? as in, is it possible to easily dry the remaining range scrap? If not, you could try a vibratory board, like is used to separate soil and range scrap.

    You wouldn't need the sifter part if no soil in the mix.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4Vo45UEMVA
    and you wouldn't really need a motor? ...you could just use a board with small sides and vibrate it by hand.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe View Post
    I'm not sure how much other stuff is in your mix?
    But if it's mostly fiberboard wood, I'd try to separate that out before melting. you could float it off, if that is conducive? as in, is it possible to easily dry the remaining range scrap? If not, you could try a vibratory board, like is used to separate soil and range scrap.

    You wouldn't need the sifter part if no soil in the mix.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4Vo45UEMVA
    and you wouldn't really need a motor? ...you could just use a board with small sides and vibrate it by hand.
    Well, part-way into the job I realized SOMETHING had to be done concerning the copious amounts of fiber-board, so working outside I took a squirrel-cage fan I had salvaged from a discarded furnace and aimed it away from myself while pouring cup-fulls of the range lead from one bucket to another in front of the airflow--basically "winnowing" it as they would winnow wheat on a windy day in old times. Yes, some lead dust and particles were lost, but it helped tremendously in regard to reduced time and propane expense.
    There were still times that I noticed while dumping the dross into the pot with my slotted stainless steel spoon that some lead would be apparent in the mix. It just got to the point that there was only so much I could do with the volume of dross that was being produced. On the other hand, perhaps I simply didn't wait long enough for the dross to burn up in my eagerness to get done.

  10. #10
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    Now I know why I gave up processing
    scrap.
    I've had three 3lb coffee cans of lead scrap sitting under my bench for 25yrs. Just don't want to spend the time or propane winnowing down to 25lbs of unknown lead.
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  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy dimaprok's Avatar
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    I believe you can recover a lot of this lead if you flux it with candle wax. Today i had bunch of this dross in the melting pot and I scooped it up and noticed lead was there so I put it back to pot add candle and after it ignited and burned off that caked frothy lead disappeared and I was able to skim up mostly ash.

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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimaprok View Post
    I believe you can recover a lot of this lead if you flux it with candle wax. Today i had bunch of this dross in the melting pot and I scooped it up and noticed lead was there so I put it back to pot add candle and after it ignited and burned off that caked frothy lead disappeared and I was able to skim up mostly ash.
    ^^^ This ^^^

    I noticed one day that the quality of my melt was much better after i threw in some of my lubed reject bullets.
    Then I read other's suggestion to use candle wax and i have been using it as well. A lot of the dross just seems to disappear.

    Another thing i noticed (and i may be wrong on this one) is that i get less dross if i don't stir the melt until it is at full temp (750 deg). My guess is that stiring the melt when it's above the melting point of lead but below other substances like antimony encourages separation.
    So now i leave it alone until it's up to 750, throw in a about 1/2" to 3/4" of a table candle and stir it through.
    Last edited by CamoWhamo; 09-06-2018 at 08:12 AM.

  13. #13
    Boolit Grand Master

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    I save what little dross that comes off of my melting pot and add it to the next smelt. The dross produced from smelting gets sealed up in plastic jugs and added to the trash. This includes bullet jackets and wheel weight clips. I smelted one large score and sold 628# of clips but usually I don't have enough bullet jackets or clips to bother with and they get thrown out too.

    As for fluxing, it seems like pine shavings or pine sawdust work better than hardwood or other woods. Maybe its the rosin in the pine? When smelting, I flux with pine chips a few times and once with wax. Beeswax, candles, ect ect.

  14. #14
    Boolit Buddy pete501's Avatar
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    When processing range scrap I end up sifting the dross separating jackets and gravel from the dirt and ash. For sifting I use a deep fry basket. The fine stuff is heavy and obviously contains some lead. I ended up filling a nylon sack with the heavy dross for a shooting rest. The copper jackets will get sorted from the rocks and will be sold to the scrap yard. Getting the jackets out takes time and I am saving this task for winter. I have accumulated 2 feed sacks full of the jacket mix.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimaprok View Post
    I believe you can recover a lot of this lead if you flux it with candle wax. Today i had bunch of this dross in the melting pot and I scooped it up and noticed lead was there so I put it back to pot add candle and after it ignited and burned off that caked frothy lead disappeared and I was able to skim up mostly ash.
    Being a newb, I had thought that using sawdust alone was good enough but have since read that it's not necessarily a one-size-fits-all fluxing solution. I'll have to hit a thrift store or two and see if they have any cheap candles available.


    Quote Originally Posted by CamoWhamo View Post

    I noticed one day that the quality of my melt was much better after i threw in some of my lubed reject bullets.
    Then I read other's suggestion to use candle wax and i have been using it as well. A lot of the dross just seems to disappear.

    Another thing i noticed (and i may be wrong on this one) is that i get less dross if i don't stir the melt until it is at full temp (750 deg). My guess is that stiring the melt when it's above the melting point of lead but below other substances like antimony encourages separation.
    So now i leave it alone until it's up to 750, throw in a about 1/2" to 3/4" of a table candle and stir it through.
    I have some ugly, lubed bullets from an unknown source that were going to get melted down anyway, so that might be a good use for them. Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by lightman View Post
    I save what little dross that comes off of my melting pot and add it to the next smelt. The dross produced from smelting gets sealed up in plastic jugs and added to the trash. This includes bullet jackets and wheel weight clips. I smelted one large score and sold 628# of clips but usually I don't have enough bullet jackets or clips to bother with and they get thrown out too.
    As for fluxing, it seems like pine shavings or pine sawdust work better than hardwood or other woods. Maybe its the rosin in the pine? When smelting, I flux with pine chips a few times and once with wax. Beeswax, candles, ect ect.
    After fluxing with pecan hardwood sawdust 2 or 3 times (and you might be right about the rosin in pine sawdust) I would skim dross then dip lead out of the pot into an ingot mould while never emptying the pot completely, then add more range mix to melt down. As mentioned in a previous post, I was doing this in hot weather and probably rushed things a bit while not letting the dross burn down completely. The dross that's still sitting in the old turkey fryer pot where it was discarded is quite heavy and is more or less a semi-solid chunk, so the lead content has to be high. After finding some candle wax I'll try breaking chunks from that mass and see how much it'll melt down. It'll probably be at least a few days before there's a chance to try it, though.

  16. #16
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    First, be real careful with Lead dust when winnowing, you don't want anyone in the area to be breathing that in, especially children.

    With I smelt WW or other scrap, I start with sawdust and finish with candle wax.
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  17. #17
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe View Post
    First, be real careful with Lead dust when winnowing, you don't want anyone in the area to be breathing that in, especially children.
    With I smelt WW or other scrap, I start with sawdust and finish with candle wax.
    Point well taken. We live in the boonies and I was outside with the fan blowing it away from me; nobody else was around.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master
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    Any grease will work, but bees wax or paraffin seen to be best. They cause a reaction allowing the lighter elements to go back into solution.
    QUIS CUSTODIET IPSOS CUSTODES?

  19. #19
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    Wax candles from thrift store or garage sales are good source for the bulk smelting. More expensive bees wax or paraffin I reserve for actual casting pot or making a finished alloy, just a pea sized chip does a lot of good in a smaller pot. Sort of neat you can see the oxide "skin" go back into the melt as the wax flows across it.

    I use a wood 2x2 to crush the dross against the bottom of the pot as it is re-melted. Start with around 1/4 full dutch oven worth of dross, use the lid to get the whole thing hot. Essentially I press the lead out of the hot ash. Then skim the ash that remains, add more dross, repeat. When skimming ash I don't go all the way to the molten lead, I leave an inch of ash behind. Until the very last skimming where I skim to the lead surface, then I flux with some wax, maybe a pinch of sawdust. Pour into bread pan "mold".

    From 3 or 4 bread loaf pans of dross I typically get around 8 - 10# of lead back (1 - 1.5 inch slab in bread loaf pan). Tends to be good alloy, and I also throw in my splatters, drips, scraping and skimming collection and that tends to be even better alloy. Under the bench I have 25 - 30 lbs. of "dross ingots". One of these days I'll figure I have enough to melt into one big batch and have it tested to see what alloy it is so I can use it. I really like to do larger batches of alloy for consistency. I want 100# of all the same, not to attempt to make the same alloy 4 times in 25# batches.

    WW clips go to the scrap yard, don't do range scrap so no jackets but have seen a bucket or two of those at the yard so the jackets must have some value.
    Scrap.... because all the really pithy and emphatic four letter words were taken and we had to describe this source of casting material somehow so we added an "S" to what non casters and wives call what we collect.

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  20. #20
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    When I want to get the last ingot of lead out of dross this is what I do. Put it in a cast iron casting pot and put it in the fire place (or turkey fryer) until red hot. Then pour it out, not dip.
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