Titan ReloadingWidenersRotoMetals2MidSouth Shooters Supply
Graf & SonsLee PrecisionStainLess Steel MediaInline Fabrication

Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: Any body have info on Siamese Mauser mfg. dates?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,475

    Any body have info on Siamese Mauser mfg. dates?

    I have found a nice document which enabled me to translate the serial#, and other markings, but nothing on year of manufacture.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    frankenfab,

    The nearest that I can come to an answer is that the majority of rifles were completed/delivered about 1896 (plus 3-5 years) & at least some rifles (the number is unknown.) were built until 1923, in 8x50R.
    In 1923, all the rifles are believed to have been rechambered to 8x52R & all new (and somewhat improved) rifles were chambered in that caliber.

    The first Siamese Mausers were evidently built in Japan & during/immediately following WWII at least a few were manufactured or were depot rebuilt in Thailand.
    (The machinery to build/repair rifles & to produce ammo was moved to the mountains of Thailand, to avoid capture by the Japanese.)
    After WWII, the machinery to repair/build rifles & new 8x52R ammo was moved back to the Royal Thai Arsenal in Bangkok.

    I've found NO date of the last manufacture of rifles. I would presume that rifles continued to be repaired/depot rebuilt until they became unserviceable or were replaced with more modern weapons.
    The last ammo for 8x52R was made about 1960-65.

    I'm sorry that I cannot give you a better & more precise answer but many production records seem to have been lost or destroyed during WWII.

    yours, tex
    Last edited by texasnative46; 09-03-2018 at 01:31 PM. Reason: typos

  3. #3
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,475
    Thanks!

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    frankenfab,

    I wish that I had more/better information to add but the occupying Japanese forces destroyed most of the records when they burned much of the government records storage facilities.

    My guess is that IF there is more/better info anywhere that one or more of our many members will have/post it.

    yours, tex
    Last edited by texasnative46; 08-28-2018 at 10:34 AM. Reason: typo

  5. #5
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,475
    I know so far mine is a Type 45, R.S. 121 (1903), serial #36644. It has been rechambered to 8x52mmR

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    frankenfab,

    YOUR rifle is called a Type 45, which is short for the Siamese calendar year 1245 or 1896 AD on our calendar.

    The rifles that were part of the "running improvement program", arsenal rebuilt or new manufactured at the Royal Thai Arsenal & in post-war Japan from 1923-1960+ are collectively called Types 46, 47, 46/66, 47/66 & 72,
    (fwiw 1272 is the Thai calendar date for Model of 1923. - The other "type numbers" are designations for various "running improvements", as those improvements were approved after 1923.)

    After 1960, the Royal Thai Armed Forces used a LARGE number of British, Czech, Chinese, German, Israeli & Singapore-made firearms, in a host of different sorts/calibers.
    The main battle rifle in 2018 is the same MBR as the IWI-TAR 23 Israeli Bullpup in 5.56NATO, though they also field several sorts of German, British & USA rifles, too.
    (COMMENT: The diverse nature of RTAF light weapons, required spare parts & different sorts of ammo needed for those firearms must be a HUGE headache for their logisticians.,)

    In the event that I get other details, I'll post them later.

    yours, tex
    Last edited by texasnative46; 08-28-2018 at 02:48 PM. Reason: addenda

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,475
    http://www.castle-thunder.com/datasheets/siamds.pdf

    I think I got the info about the R.S. 121 (chamber marking) meaning model of 1903 from my Mauser Military Rifles of the World book.

    Mine has a type A chamber marking, type B sight ramp, and a type A butt plate. I can't find a marking in front of the rear sling swivel.
    Last edited by frankenfab; 08-28-2018 at 04:44 PM.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    frankenfab,

    INTERESTING. - Fwiw, the ONLY Siamese rifle that I've ever owned was a Model of 1898 that was rebored/rechambered in .45-70 Govt.
    (Wishing that I'd been smart enough to keep it, as it shot WELL & was A KILLER on hogs/WT out to 150+M, with CB. = I traded it even for a US&S 1911A1, that was rebuilt in the mid-1960s at RRAD, circa 1975.)

    Note: What I'd really like to find is a S&W Model of 1917 that was re-arsenaled at SAA or SAAD, in the 1920-40 era. = I've seen some of those out of SAA/SAAD that actually looked BETTER than new.
    (Our sheriff in the 1980s had one of those & it was just NICE. - He carried it in a holster & River belt that the famous BILL JORDAN gave him for Christmas.)

    yours, tex
    Last edited by texasnative46; 08-28-2018 at 04:54 PM. Reason: addenda

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,475
    "The receiver ring is marked with Siamese "Charkra" over the Siamese markings for the model year, which translates into R.S 121 (Ratanakos 21), the year of adoption of the dynasty, or the Christian year 1903."

    I've had this thing a while. I'm going to get some brass and a mold, and shoot it.

    Looks like I'll never know the year of manufacture.
    Last edited by frankenfab; 08-28-2018 at 04:52 PM.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    frankenfab,

    INTERESTING - Is your rifle in full military "dress"??

    Another thing that I'd like to find is a Thai-made (and slow-rust blued!!!!) "clone" of the Model 1911 pistol,
    (The Thais still use the .45ACP pistols as well as other varied sorts/calibers of handguns, though most seem to have been bought from Israel.)

    yours, tex

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    1,475
    It's all original, dust cover and all. Don't have the bayonet or sling. It's a looong rifle.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    frankenfab,

    NIFTY, imo.

    yours, tex

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,520
    Has anyone rebarreled one of these to .303 British?
    Would the .303 feed properly in this action?

  14. #14
    Boolit Master Texas by God's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    5,397
    I did one in .30-40 Krag and approached 30-06 ballistics in the strong action. Feeding was hinkey occasionally but took a lot of deer with it. Later I rebarreled it to 6.5 Rem Mag and it fed better. If I had another I'd keep it original and shoot the 8x52R. The article I read that made me want mine stated the original load surpassed the 8x57 Mauser.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    san antonio, tx
    Posts
    885
    Quote Originally Posted by Texas by God View Post
    I did one in .30-40 Krag and approached 30-06 ballistics in the strong action. Feeding was hinkey occasionally but took a lot of deer with it. Later I rebarreled it to 6.5 Rem Mag and it fed better. If I had another I'd keep it original and shoot the 8x52R. The article I read that made me want mine stated the original load surpassed the 8x57 Mauser.
    Texas by God,

    Fwiw, the modern (1960s) loading of the 8x52R & out of that LONG, LONG standard barrel, using the standard 180 grain bullet is quite similar to many loadings of the 7.62 NATO ball round.

    I'd like to find a Siamese that hasn't been "messed about with" for the so-called "vintage military rifle matches". = I suspect that it would do VERY well, presuming that the shooter does his/her part.
    Everything that I've heard about the Siamese in 8x52R (or even the 8x50R, using that LONG 255 grain bullet) impresses me for such a 19th century military weapon.

    yours, tex

  16. #16
    Boolit Master Texas by God's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    5,397
    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check