Lyman 452460 and H&G 68 clone accuracy in my pistols.

[tazman]

I have 4 1911 45acp pistols in my stable. 1-Springfield, 1-RIA, and 2- Sig-Sauer. They are all throated for SWC style boolits. Two of them are match grade weapons, although the other 2 shoot equally well for me for the most part.
Today I did some serious testing on feeding and accuracy(within my limits) of these two boolits. I have been working up to this point for several weeks in an attempt to find a single boolit in SWC style that would function well and shoot accurately in all my 45acp 1911 pistols.
Both were cast from the same alloy(range scrap), sized and lubed with 50-50 in my 4500 sizer, and loaded in mixed brass with 4.0 grains of Bullseye.
I didn't use a rest for any of this as I figured I should test them as I would be using them.

I was expecting to have some possible feeding issues. None materialized. All four pistols fed and fired both boolits without fail.
I didn't really know what to expect as far as which boolit might prove more accurate. Both have a long earned reputation for accuracy in 45acp.
During the course of shooting, I did find a winner but only by a small margin.
In three of the guns, the accuracy was as close to identical as makes no difference. In the last one the Lyman 452460 was a clear winner. The groups were about 1/2 inch smaller at 10 yards for me.
I tested by shooting two 8 round magazines into a target at 10 yards, then pulling the target and measuring. Then switching to the other boolit and repeating the process with each pistol.
I went through all 4 pistols in this manner twice.
That is a lot of brass on the floor and a bunch of targets to compare. It finally boiled down to what worked better in one of the match guns.
Three of the pistols shot nice round groups with no stringing(other than my called mistakes) with both boolits.
The last gun is an RIA put together by a "local" gunsmith(about 55 miles away) who is very good at what he does. He took the time to fit the slide, barrel, and bushing as well as the trigger for his own personal use then decided to sell it after he finished it. It has a Kart national match barrel in it.
In this pistol, the 452460 shot noticeably better than the H&G clone.
For this reason I am going to go with the 452460. I may keep the other mold around for the occasional experiment but the majority of my loads will be the 452460.
I am not a great shot, so I won't post targets. Suffice it to say, I was impressed by what I got in the way of results from both of these boolits.

Prior to the last few weeks, the majority of my shooting had been with 230 grain boolits in various configurations. Most worked pretty well. One stood out above the others and wouldn't you know it was the Lyman 452374. The old classic and still one of the best.

[Low Budget Shooter]

Tazman, that's a good experiment, and provides some very useful basic info. I was given a 452460, and used it for many hundreds of rounds through my ATI commander-length 1911. The results were very good, in my limited experience, but I always wondered if the 68 or 130-style bullets would be better. Apparently not!

[Ia.redneck]

Tazman, that 452460 is accurate! We did similar testing in my sons Kimber Gold Match several years ago,tried H&G 68, Saeco 130, Lee 200 tl swc and the 452460. It shot the Lyman slightly better than the others. Feeds fine too. Try 4 grains of Winchester Super Target. It works well.

[marlin39a]

I found a nice DC 452460, in the gray Lyman box recently. I was impressed with the fill out, and easy drop. Sized .452 with Carnauba Blue, loaded over 5 grains of HP-38. I haven't chronographed it yet, but runs great in a Colt and S&W. And it is accurate for the plinking I do.

[Walks]

I use a 1cav #452460 to cast test bullets when making up lead alloys in my big 60lb cast iron pot. For use in a SAECO Lead Hardness Tester. I cast 10 bullets from every batch. The soft stuff gets thrown into the 20lb electric when casting light plinking loads for revolvers.
The Hard BULLETS (#2 or Lino) are saved until there's 50, then loaded in my std light target load.

I load 3 different .45ACP loads.
Hardball Load, LYMAN #452374 ( 222grs) over 5.0grs of TITEGROUP.
Combat Load, RCBS #45-201-KT/SWC (199grs) over 5.4grs of TITEGROUP.
Target Load, LYMAN #452488(192grs) over 3.5grs of BULLSEYE.
The last load must be shot using a light spring in my Old GOLD CUP. It also moves so slow (680fps) that it won't stabilize until 50ft. I use a std factory spring and cut 3 coils off.

All bullets to be shot in a semi-auto gun are cast of straight Linotype. My DAD did this on the premise that a harder bullet feeds better, and the OLD 1911's and M1917 Revolvers had shallow rifling and the harder bullets gripped that rifling better.

The Hardball & Combat loads feed/shoot without a hitch in a COLT GOLD CUP, Combat Gov't model, GLOCK 21 (WOLF BBL), 2 SPRINGFIELD 1911'S and an old SIG 220. I also fed them to an HK USP when I still had it. All loads shoot fine in a RUGER BlackHawk .45ACP convertible.

The light target load with the #452488 is VERY stubby with 2 broad during bands. That light load will only feed in 1911's with a full ramp/throat job.

I'd like to get a 4cav N.O.E. Mold someday that drops their version of the LYMAN #452423. A KEITH design for the .45ACP/Auto Rim. Make a light load for my BlackHawk .45ACP CONVERTIBLE Cylinder.

Having 2 RCBS 45-201 2CAV molds & a LYMAN #452488 4CAV mold, I just never felt the need to buy a 4cav #452460.
My DAD gave me the 1cav #452460 to get my own casting reloading setup started when I got out of the Service 45yrs ago. Being on a strict budget, used molds at Gun shows were my usual means of aquiring any kind of mold.

[44MAG#1]

My ex shooting buddy used a 200 grain copy of the H&G 68. He used mostly 4.1 grains of Bullseye. He was a Master Class NRA shooter. Primers to him didnt matter. Nor did cases. He shot the same load on the 25 yard line and the 50 yard line. For the Hardball match he practiced with 5 grains Bullseye and a 230 gr RN cast bullet. He said it nearly duplicated the recoil of the 230 grain FMJRN loads shot in the Hardball Matches.

Again I mean no harm, hurt or anguish by my statement. I am not trolling, baiting or calling out anyone. My statement is based on my knowledge and/or my experience and/or information and/or belief. Please take it that way.

[charlie b]

My experience was thatt he mag meant almost as much as the feed ramp. When I was young and poor I used whatever GI surplus I could find. Some were horrible.

When I settled on one brand (Mccormick) all my feeding and accuracy problems settled down.

Each 1911 is a little different depending on a lot of things. Feed ramps and recoil springs being two big ones. But tightnesss of fit, any full length guide rods, compensators, hammer springs, etc will all affect the timing just a little.

[fecmech]

I did the same test way back when I shot bullseye pistol. I had a Ransom rest at the time and the Lyman 460 beat the H&G68 in my wad gun consistently at 50 yds. The H&G68 was a more reliable feeder in some guns. My gun would feed empty cases so I had no problems with any design.

[Green Frog]

Many years ago I bought a NRA reprint booklet on reloading for the 45 which on the subject of cast bullets said words to the effect of "If you have the Lyman 452460 mould, that's the only one you will need for all 45 shooting." Obviously this was the thinking of one shooter, but it was someone the NRA editorial board thought of as experienced and worth hearing from. This general design is my go-to bullet for what I cast for the 45s I own and load for and while I haven't done the extensive testing or comparisons some of you have done, I see no reason to look elsewhere.

Froggie

[9.3X62AL]

Both Lyman #452460 and the H&G #68 clones shoot really well for me in a whole lot of 45 ACP self-loaders. In the Glock 21, the #68 feeds with a slight ka-chunk as the slide closes--so there is a slight hang-up or hitch somewhere. But they feed fully, whether run at 725 or 950 FPS.

[44MAG#1]

Does anyone know what the most used cast bullet in NRA Bullseye shooting has been? Has there been an actual compiled statistical evaluation of it?
I know the Federal Match, not the Gold Medal. But the preceeding match ammo with the 185 was extremely popular at one time.

Again I mean no harm, hurt or anguish by my statement. I am not trolling, baiting or calling out anyone. My statement is based on my knowledge and/or my experience and/or information and/or belief. Please take it that way.

[johniv]

The #452460 has always worked well for me. It was my first mold. I used in many 1911's , and a few revolvers. Always gave good service, fed well and was accurate enough for me. (I'm no match shooter)