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Thread: Hi pressured load?

  1. #1
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Hi pressured load?

    I tested out a GC and PC'd 270gr cast boolit out of my ruger 77/44 using 23.8 gr of W296. I load tested and worked the powder from minimum all the way up to 24 gr. With no signs of pressure.

    The best group using this boolit and alloy combo is 23.8 gr of w296 powder. So I loaded up about 100 or so in two different additional range sessions and in each time out shooting three quarters of the way through both shooting sessions I had a stuck case. This is maybe after 30 rounds fired each time. I had to hit my bolt handle with my hand pretty hard to extract it. No damage was done either time. After I extracted the case in each session I inspected and kept firing an additional 15 to 20 rounds that fed and ejected smooth as silk with no issues or stuck cases after.

    I am using matching cases and trimming after every firing so things should be consistent. I'm guessing maybe my powder scale might be throwing an inaccurate reading every once in a while? It's an RCBS master scale I bought about 17 to 18 years ago. I know it dose jump up and down a lot when the ac or heater is running. I did notice once I had a lead ring that shaved off like I slugged the bore sitting inside of the action. Could a random lead shaving be pinching the boolit or casing casing pressure? I've been shooting on some pretty warm days as well. Probably was in the 90's?


    I did notice once in a while I would see a little round circle in my powder...a piece of trail boss that must have got caught in my trickler that mixed with w296 and I would fish it out. I'm wondering if a few pieces of trail boss were still mixed in and might have caused this?


    Any ideas?
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 08-03-2018 at 10:14 PM.

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    I had the problem with fillers gunking up the throat. All my rifles have tight tollerences. Would get a random case hard to extract. I have leaded a throat before and have inconsistent seating depths play havoc on my pressures.

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    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    I have cleaned my rifle after every range session and scrubbed the barrel thinking I had leading. It's been nice and clean only having powder residue flowing every time.

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    The first thing I would do is not have any air movement while weighing powder.
    The only amendment the Democrats support is the 5th.

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    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by upnorthwis View Post
    The first thing I would do is not have any air movement while weighing powder.
    If the heater or AC kicks on while im weighing a charge i wait till it shuts off before remove it from the scale. That way all the vibrations come to a halt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by upnorthwis View Post
    The first thing I would do is not have any air movement while weighing powder.
    The first thing I'd do is reduce the load one full grain to 22.8 of WW296.
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    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hickory View Post
    The first thing I'd do is reduce the load one full grain to 22.8 of WW296.
    I've tried. Grouping opens up with lower powder charges. I was thinking about seating the boolit out farther but I don't think there is any extra room for over all cartridge length. I'm at 1.640" right now and it feeds and functions.

  8. #8
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    Try a different powder.
    I wouldn't risk damaging my gun for a tighter group!
    Political correctness is a national suicide pact.

    I am a sovereign individual, accountable
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    I tested out a GC and PC'd 270gr cast boolit out of my ruger 77/44 using 23.8 gr of W296.
    How perfect is your PC coating?
    You are near, or at the top of the pressure range for that load.
    If you have an occasional PC'd boolit that's a bit thicker, that extra thickness could increase the measurement at the case mouth, which could increase pressure when fired, especially if your rifle has a tight chamber.
    That's my 2˘
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    John, the PC is a nice thick coating but i size and GC it after PCing through my Lee sizing die so they should all be the same diameter.

    If you look at the multi colored loaded rounds on my home page those are the rounds I used...I bounced them in another color after tumbling trying to remove the excess build up. Even though they were sized after PCing I wonder if the addition of the second uneven applied color caused a little excess build up? Can a thicker PC coating spring back a little after sizing? I plan on just doing single colors with this load on out. Going to use smokes clear so it's going to be smooth and even. I'm using a Lee factory crimp collet die and seating them past the crimp groove. All boolits have the same pressured crimp applied.



    I think the only other powder I have to try is lil gun. Can't find load data for it to use with my devastators. Anyone have any data for this combo? I've read it's more temp sensitive than W296/h110?

    Here's a pic of the boolits I used.



    I can see a finning line from the mold running along the light blue boolit. I would assume sizing would have squished it down where it counts when running it through my Lee sizer?

    If the powder charge is to blame I would think it would have a sticky bolt every firing?...I would think not once after round count number 30 and then it fires the same round smooth as silk for another 15-20? The gun was well warmed up but not hot when it happened on both occasions.

    I think I had some more trail boss granuals mixed in with the W296. I would assume mixed powder would cause this as well?

    I'm starting to lean towards my jumping RCBS scale causing an inaccurate reading. I know I'm close to max and I did test 24 gr with no pressure signs.

    Another idea, could this cause it...I just started tapping on my GC before running them through my Lee sizer recently because in the past I had a few that looked like the GC weren't evenly seated. I had either a little PC build up one side would catch on and smear a little lead up past the GC or have a little dent in the middle of the GC base from a little build up from the Sprue not cutting the lead base smooth and even.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 08-04-2018 at 09:08 PM.

  11. #11
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    PCing will also thicken the nose. So your nose sizes may be affecting seating depth if they varry alot. Sticking one into the lands or leade will spike your pressures.
    "Speak softly and carry a big stick; you will go far."
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  12. #12
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rcmaveric View Post
    PCing will also thicken the nose. So your nose sizes may be affecting seating depth if they varry alot. Sticking one into the lands or leade will spike your pressures.
    I haven't taken a spent case and sat a boolit in it and see how far it pushes in when I cycle it into the action and measure the OAL length like I use to do with J words in the past. I've grown accustom to just loading to max OAL and calling it good. I'll give it a try and check my measurement.

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    I have always found my finest accuracy about 1 to 2 grains below max no matter what powder I am using.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hickory View Post
    The first thing I'd do is reduce the load one full grain to 22.8 of WW296.
    ^^^^^ This, exactly! The Winchester data book lists 24.0 grains of 296 as a MAXIMUM load under a 240 grain bullet! Your bullet is 30 grains heavier; I don't care how good the group is, your load is over pressure!
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  15. #15
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Lyman cast bullet handbook 4 th edition...



    I'm one tenth of a grain over with a different style cast boolit max per this load data.

    I just casted 11 pounds and 11 oz of 80/20 w 12% pewter added to the mix. I had a good casting session because 9 pounds and 6 oz worth of them weighed from 257.0gr to 257.9gr. Adding PC and a GC will add a grain or two set and done and the PC should reduce friction and pressures as well.

    The data below is out of the same book and has my EXACT boolit/mold listed showing I'm at max loading...23.8 gr of w296 and my OAL is at 1.640", 30/1000's longer than published aol so i should be below the listed max pressure.



    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 08-05-2018 at 05:55 PM.

  16. #16
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    So I just clear PC'd my boolits today and annealed the GC's for the first time. I also tapped them on with a hammer before running them through my Lee sizing die. Normally I'll have a little line of smeared lead on top of the GC when running them straight through my Lee sizer directly. The little strip of lead mostly came off when tapping the GC on with a hammer. You can still see some shiny exposed PB above the GC. I'm wondering if this lead strip has come loose in the past inside the action and jamming in between the front of the nose if the boolit and the lands increasing pressure? I the lead rings i would find once in a great while was like I slugged the bore and it cut a ring of lead off the boolit. I found one or two in the action.

    I would assume a little smeared lead is ok around the GC area?

    Here are the boolits where you can see a little shiny lead above where the GC is seated and the lead shavings that came off where tapping on the GC. I've had PB smears on just about every GC seating since ive been casting these. I'm guessing it's common?






    I've been just running the boolits through my Lee sizing die prior w/o annealing the GC. If a GC Seated uneven and a little crooked would that cause the boolit to enter the chamber cock eyed causing higher pressures?

    Lastly, did I overheat my GC? They look off colored and have a Pantene look like their old and oxidized.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 08-05-2018 at 07:15 PM.

  17. #17
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    I noticed in this picture that you over crimp your boolits. This will cause over pressure in a round that is near or at maximum pressure.
    Try using a light crimp. If you are concerned about bullet pull, you can check it easy enough by measuring the OAL of the last cartridge in the gun after firing all others.
    Political correctness is a national suicide pact.

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  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Hickory, I use a Lee factory crimp collet die being I seat the boolit short...past the crimp groove or it won't feed. I can lighten up on the crimp a little and retry. Just did it this way being it looks look a nice even crimp. Works great with 21gr of h110 and a softer alloy devastator (7.5 BH). It will shoot sub MOA. But with the harder alloy in using here(15.4 BH) it won't group tight till running max velocities.
    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 08-06-2018 at 08:56 AM.

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rcmaveric View Post
    PCing will also thicken the nose. So your nose sizes may be affecting seating depth if they varry alot. Sticking one into the lands or leade will spike your pressures.
    This would make sense as well. I have been trimming off finning around the hp area and sanding the hp cavity flat which could vary the length of the boolit so seating depths could vary a hair. I'm going to make a dummy round to try and see what the max OAL is to make sure I'm not to close to the lands.

  20. #20
    Boolit Grand Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    My aol of 1.640" is not the issue. It measured 1.705 twice

    Last edited by Tripplebeards; 08-07-2018 at 01:54 PM.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check