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Thread: 1891 Argentine Carbine Mauser

  1. #1

    1891 Argentine Carbine Mauser

    Recently acquired an 1891 Argentine Cavalry Carbine Mauser.
    I'd like to reload for it but Ive read the bullet diameter can vary between rifles so now Im not sure which mold to buy for it. Some say the diameter is .311 and others say .314.
    Any and all help is appreciated as I do not want to end up with wrong size molds that I cannot use.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    You need to slug your bore and measure. I have a 1891 collecting dust you want to buy another.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master Grmps's Avatar
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    bpimwheel: welcome to CB. If you decided to start casting to save money, forget it. You won't, you'll just shoot more.

    Here's some information that should help

    Casting boolits (lead bullets) properly is a science, once you know the basics, not a hard science.
    There is a lot of good information on CB. The Google search (top right of every forum page) is a gateway to all the knowledge on this forum. IF you can’t find your answer there ask the question (Please be as detailed as possible, pictures help http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...g-screen-shots I would be very surprised if there wasn’t someone on this forum that could answer ANY (firearm related) question you might have)
    http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm
    1. Boolits need to be cast .0005 to .003 (normally .002) over the slugged diameter of your barrel for accuracy and to avoid leading. If the fit is wrong nothing else will work right.
    a. slugging a barrel (it is safer to use a brass rod or a steel rod with a couple of coats of tape to avoid damaging your barrel http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinSlug.htm
    b. chamber casting https://www.brownells.com/guntech/ce....htm?lid=10614
    or pound casting http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...rifle-chamber)
    2. the right alloy needs to be used for the velocity and purpose of the boolit (don’t fall into the trap of going with too hard an alloy
    Economical way to easily test lead hardness
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...rdness-testing

    Some alloys harden over time
    http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chap...Metallurgy.htm
    different alloy’s different end sizes

    Lead alloy calculator
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/atta...4&d=1341560870
    3. velocity the bullet needs to be pushed hard/fast enough to get the proper spin, have the proper velocity to accurately reach the target but not so hard as to be dangerous or strip the lead off in the grooves instead of spinning the boolit..
    The boolit needs to be the right weight for the riffling/twist rate of your barrel
    Powders range from fast to slow, you need to choose the right powder for your barrel length & application.
    Loading manuals list the best powders for certain calibers and boolit weights.
    NEVER use any posted noncommercial load data without first checking commercial load data to see if falls in the safe parameter for your firearm!! There are several firearms out there that can handle much higher pressures than others!!
    Link to free online load data
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...online-sources

  4. #4
    Boolit Master

    Uncle Grinch's Avatar
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    I use Lyman 314299 mould for my 91 Argentine. Sized and lubed to .314 and coated with BLL ( Ben’s Liquid Lube ) works good for me.
    Shoot Safe,
    Mike

    Retired Telephone Man
    NRA Endowment Member
    Marion Road Gun Club
    ( www.marionroad.com )

  5. #5
    Boolit Buddy jugulater's Avatar
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    Slug the barrel! you need to know what your gun wants!

    Although odds are its probably .312 to .314 or so, but you need to slug it to find out! as for the mold the old Lyman 314299 design is Great but i suggest getting the NOE copy, simply because with a NOE mold you know you are getting a quality product.

    http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.p...rrbr9t8gpsv4d0

    Theres a link to the Website, the standard 2 cavity GC version isnt listed at the moment but they do make it.

    i own two Loewe Manufacture 1891 Argentine Infantry Rifles, one has been arsenal refurbed the other is in original "as it came" condition, both are very accurate and smooth guns. a Calvary or Engineers carbine would be a slick woods gun.

    Be careful though, the 1891 was my first Pre M98 mauser, now i have a couple 1893s, a 1895, and a 1896!

  6. #6
    Thanks everyone for the replies, every little of knowledge helps when you are starting out on a new endevor.

    **** Grmps, your a barrel of knowledge. Thank you very much for the information. Been a member of Cast Boolits now since January. All I seem to be able to do is READ, READ, READ. So much knowledge here

    Uncle Grinch, The Lyman 314299 is the mold that I was looking at. What is "Ben's Liquid Lube"?

    jugulater, Sluging the barrel is next up on the list. I have two of them to do, Loewe and a DWM both the Calvary carbines. Im starting with the Loewe. Yes I know about the disease. It spread to me about 10 years ago. Mine is known as the South American Mauser Disease. Ive seen other people that caught it, they were constantly broke but had a lot of Mausers.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripplebeards View Post
    You need to slug your bore and measure. I have a 1891 collecting dust you want to buy another.
    Thanks for the offer. Is it a Loewe Cavalry Carbine?

  8. #8
    Boolit Master GhostHawk's Avatar
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    There is a HUGE BLL thread, would take a lot of reading to chew through it.

    You might start here.
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...nstead-Of-Xlox

    Essentially BLL (Ben's Liquid Lube) as originally made was a blend of 60% Lee Alox or Xlox, and 40% Johnsons One Step Floor wax (with proprietary polimers). Simply blend the 2 together. If you alox is very old/stiff you could add some mineral spirits.

    Idea being that you put a very very "thin" coat of the thinned down alox, let it dry, and then add another coat, or maybe 2.

    My general rule is over 1400 fps you need Gas Check on bullet and 3 coats. Or something like Ben's Red in the grooves with a top coat of BLL.

    Pistol and low speed rifle 2 light coats works fine.

    I believe the original BLL thread was over 60 pages long. Start chewing.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by GhostHawk View Post
    There is a HUGE BLL thread, would take a lot of reading to chew through it.

    You might start here.
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...nstead-Of-Xlox

    Essentially BLL (Ben's Liquid Lube) as originally made was a blend of 60% Lee Alox or Xlox, and 40% Johnsons One Step Floor wax (with proprietary polimers). Simply blend the 2 together. If you alox is very old/stiff you could add some mineral spirits.

    Idea being that you put a very very "thin" coat of the thinned down alox, let it dry, and then add another coat, or maybe 2.

    My general rule is over 1400 fps you need Gas Check on bullet and 3 coats. Or something like Ben's Red in the grooves with a top coat of BLL.

    Pistol and low speed rifle 2 light coats works fine.

    I believe the original BLL thread was over 60 pages long. Start chewing.
    Thanks for the link and information. I was really looking for something other than commercial lube that I can use in my RCBS Lube Matic. Ive seen many references to other lubes but no specific formulae to allow duplicating it.

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    i also use the lyman 314299, but i powder coat. both my full length argentine mauser and engineer's carbine shoot the same load well. great, accurate rifles, nothing made today is as high quality (IMO).

  11. #11
    Boolit Master Grmps's Avatar
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    I just did a pound cast on mine and it miked out at .313
    I'm going to size @ .314 after GC and PC
    Last edited by Grmps; 08-10-2018 at 04:31 PM.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master

    marlin39a's Avatar
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    Mine came from a member here, with reloading info. I use the Lyman 314299 sized .314 GC, lubed with Carnauba Red. Charged with 2400. Runs great.

  13. #13
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    "Slug the bore" is a myth that won't seem to die. It is a waste of time as it won't give you the information you want. The important dimension is the diameter of the chamber throat. In the 1891 this is long and tapered.

    You can do a throat pound slug or just size your bullets so the loaded round will enter the chamber and throat without shaving lead. In this rifle it will be .313, .314 or even .315 as you have been informed.

    If it were me, I would just size the bullets .313 and see what accuracy you get. Then try a littler larger and see if accuracy improves.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  14. #14
    Boolit Bub Doug Humbarger's Avatar
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    My 1891 is .312

  15. #15
    Boolit Grand Master

    Wayne Smith's Avatar
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    Char Gar I'd do it the other way around. Assuming I have the dies, start large and see if it chambers, then step down until it does.
    Wayne the Shrink

    There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check