Rough guess of value Winchester 1917

[BrianL]

A fella has offered me a 1917 Winchester. He wants a comparable trade or cash. It has parts from all three makers but seems to be in good 'shooter' condition with a nice stock and metal finish.
Now for the other questionable .The bore has shiny lands but dark grooves. I would want it for using cast exclusively. Is this a viable gun for that?

No alterations, all military

[rmcc]

I just got through rebarreling a Krag with a bore like you describe, it would not shoot cast at all! As far as value, in my opinion, it is a parts gun that will be a shooter. Around here that is $250- $350 depending on condition. Good luck!! I had a P14 and like a dumb ***, I sold it!! Been looking for a good 14 0r 17 since.

[Multigunner]

Rifles that have had many rounds of Cupro nickel jacketed bullets fire through them can end up with a thick deposit of that metal in the grooves. I once owned a Krag carbine I picked up for $50 bucks (that was many years ago) in good condition other than the bore.
When I first tried cleaning it the deposits in the grooves began to curl up into long coiled strips sharp and tough enough to strip the bristles off bronze brushes. Soon the bore was choked with strips of cupro nickel and shredded patch cloths. What little I could see of bore surface was deeply pitted like craters on the moon. I was offered what at the time was a pretty good trade worth 4-5 times what I had in the rifle so I traded it off under the understanding that it was only going to be a wall hanger.

A few years later they began selling repro Krag barrels. Still kicking myself.

If Cupro nickel isn't the problem then hardened carbon fouling might be what you are seeing, in which case just clean the heck out of the bore and lap the grooves if necessary.

The old Armorers manuals of that era suggest a barrel that showed strong rifling was only ruined beyond redemption if pitting left gaps in the lands.

[Battis]

I bought one last year in Kittery for $550. Winchester, good bore, good wood, all original. Great shooter.
I also got an Argentine Mauser with a bore that did not look good. As suggested by someone on this forum. I shot a bunch of jacketed bullets through it. I was amazed at how well it cleaned up. The more I shot, the better it got.

[lefty o]

id never care to guess on value of a milsurp with having it in my hands, but depending on location and actual condition anywhere from $400 on up to too much.

[arlon]

I have several 1917s (good bores) and they are all really good shooters. I have Mosin Nagants with sewer pipe bores that are good cast shooters after some work. For a shooter, I'd give it a try but I wouldn't pay collector price for it either. I'd go after the crud with a stainless brush, they will knock a lot of rust and crud out of a barrel. I've never had a cruddy bore that was worse after the application of a stainless brush but I have saved a few that made perfectly good cast shooters.

[Adam Helmer]

I like the P-17 in all the flavors; Remington, Winchester and Eddystone and have them all. My best cast boolit rifle is an Eddystone with strong rifling and a bit of darkness in the grooves. I suppose you just need to do some work at the bench on the range and see if the Winchester is a cast boolit gun.

I have a "1942" Mosin 91/30 with a dark bore and strong rifling that shoots 2 inch groups at 100 yards with the Lee 312 185RN cast boolit, sized .311" and its favorite powder charge.

Hope this helps.

Adam

[BrianL]

Thank for the input. I got to take it home for the weekend to test fire and found a few problems. I tested the cycling with dummy rounds and was somewhat surprised considering the overall condition that the cartridges would not feed. I couldn't pry them out. Dropped the trigger guard and found that the magazine box was missing. The bolt stop/ejector assembly has issues as well. Both are fixable and parts are available. Didn't get out to my range until this morning. Trying a couple different loads between rain squalls. I started with a light load of unique behind a military pulled 150 fmj, single loaded to check for case issues. It shot these well. Tried a few full loads and they also shot well and surprisingly accurate considering my hurried set-up. I scrounged around and found a few 150 grain Loverin design Lymans and some 115gr RCBS rngc bullets and quickly loaded up some using the same load as the light fmj's which was 12 gr Unique. I shot at 25 yds only to see if there was any inkling of hope. I have posted the targets. I know that with tuning and finding my shooting glasses, it could do better.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Looks like you've found a "keeper", Brian. And, like you said, parts are available.

[BrianL]

Just wish that my eyes were better. Had to give up High Power because of that, back before they let optics into the sport.

We have some military matches locally that I was thinking I 'needed' something like this for,this or a Nagant or Enfield.
I gave my son my DCM Garand a while back and have several scoped Savages that are boring to shoot with cast, predictable like a laser. This one might be a challenge . Just have to wait to see if he accepts my trade after adjustments for the parts needed for this one.

[reivertom]

That gun around here would go for 6 to 7 hundred easy if it is what it looks like in the photos. There are parts for those things everywhere. I have 1 original and 1 sporter. Winchesters are the most sought after in my circles. Most of them have some mixed parts on them.

[BrianL]

That gun around here would go for 6 to 7 hundred easy if it is what it looks like in the photos. There are parts for those things everywhere. I have 1 original and 1 sporter. Winchesters are the most sought after in my circles. Most of them have some mixed parts on them.

This one is an early Winchester action and barrel, Eddystone bolt and stock, Remington front sight. Has both the bomb and the star stampings but no (official) stock markings at all. Just 'HANY' or some such scratched in the side. It looks like it has been refinished but the whole rifle looks well cared for considering.

[fjruple]

Brian-- On the front end of the barrel behind the front sight base is listed the manufacturer, if one of the original manufacturers there will be a month and year. WWII replacement barrels will be RIA, HS or JA (Rock Island Arsenal, High Standard or Johnson Automatics) with no date just the US Ordnance marking. Very large quantities of M1917s were rebuilt during WWII (sometimes several times, I have a M1917 that was rebuilt no less than 3 times) so you will have a mixture of parts from all three manufacturers. On the right side of the stock it looks like a former owner "DAN" scratched his name into the stock. Normally if the Winchester was all original you can add a 20% premium above the other two manufacturers.

[BrianL]

This one is 'W 2-17 with the bomb ordinance stamp out front , serial 48321 so I am thinking it may be the original barrel. The '?ANY' (may be an 'H')mark is the only thing that I can find on the stock other than the 'E' on the front and on the bands. The floor-plate and trigger guard are also Eddystone. The safety has no marking.

[arlon]

My eyes like the aperture sights on the 1917s more than most other milsurps. They just work for me for some reason. Aperture and long sight radius are a help for the old eyes.

[BrianL]

I noticed that as well. The battle sight was right on for the miltary ammo and the flipped sight set at 200 got me close with the light cast loads. The close peep and the thin front blade may just be the ticket.
Just took a look on GB
Why has the price of these gone through the roof?

[472x1B/A]

In my part of the country the ones that look like dozers have ran over them go for 650-900 and 'good' ones run 750-1200. The one in your pics would be close to 800-950. The movie 'Saving Private Ryan' did it. ^^^

[Jack Stanley]

Brian , is the barrel cleaning up any better from the condition you got ? If it's pitting it's a toss up of how well it will shoot cast . If it's cupro-nickel then one of the electric bore cleaners can help . I had an 03 that the bore was silver from the stuff , it took several cycles but it all came out .

Jack

[Hardcast416taylor]

An FYI. This months NRA magazine The Rifleman has a pretty decent article about the 1917 `over there`.Robert

[Texas by God]

Like the M1 Garand, the M17 just feels "right" when you aim it.

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