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Thread: Decent drill/mill for a rooky

  1. #41
    Boolit Master Moleman-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nekshot View Post
    I was excavating shop and farming and site supervision. I came into the no work side of life 10 years before I ever planned on. I really need to get some aids for putting flats on barrels. I mean the rotary tool ability for a guy on short cash!! I will get there, patience patience patience.
    Similar story for me. Had shop class in high school and got to use lathes and mills, then basically nothing for 20 years when back issues started and I got a 9x20 lathe. 4 surgeries so far and counting and 10 years later I've got lots of spare time on my hands. The shop has grown to 3 lathes, a horizontal mill and the drill mill. Since this thread was started I added a 9x49 jet mill that I still need to move into the shop. The only reason I got the 9x49 mill is that table space and X axis travel limits what you can do on a drill/mill or mini mill. The table on my HF drill/mill is 28 3/4" long edge to edge, 27 1/4" once you get the power feed on it (well worth the cost) and with a knock off Kalamazoo 5c spin indexer along with a 21.5" barrel (with 3/4"-1" of it inside the collet) and a short home made tailstock ends up with a total length slightly over 30". Table travel is about 20-1/2". The round column lets you swing the head L-R to be able to use the entire travel of the table. In order to get a 30" setup on a 27.25" table I had to bolt it to a 3/4"x 4"x 30" flat bar and then bolt the bar to the table. It does make a handy draw filing and sanding/polishing jig when clamped to the work bench once you're done milling. The point of my ramblings is to think about what barrel lengths or projects you want to do and what the setup lengths will be. I've seen where guys have made similar jigs like mine and milled what they could, then moved the jig over to be able to mill something longer than the table travel of their mill. Matching to two cuts up isn't impossible, but generally you'll be able to see where they start/stop which may not be an issue if you're going to draw file and sand/polish the octagon barrel afterwards. Here's a shot of the setup I used on a 1891 Mauser barrel shown close to being done on the mill on the previous page. Google home made indexers. I almost made one that used a gear to index the barrel which would of saved me a few inches of table space. With a mill and a lathe you can make quite a few of the accessories yourself.
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  2. #42
    Boolit Master

    jonp's Avatar
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    I don't know much about this but is there something this does that a drill press and an xy vise wont?
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  3. #43
    Boolit Master Moleman-'s Avatar
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    Yes, If you try any milling with a drill press if you're lucky the MT2 or Jacobs chuck taper will let go before wrecking the bearings or bending the spindle. Drill presses aren't designed for side loads.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonp View Post
    I don't know much about this but is there something this does that a drill press and an xy vise wont?
    You can't mill in a drill press. Drill press quills and spindles are not designed to take side loads and I don't know of any drill presses that have collet type tool holders that will hold an end mill or milling cutter securely. Milling should not be attempted in a drill press.
    A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms *shall not be infringed*.

    "The greatest danger to American freedom is a government that ignores the Constitution."
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    "While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny."
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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokeywolf View Post
    While it hasn't been in use as a center-point lube since I think the early half of the 20th century, I think I still have a small can of "white lead" somewhere in the shop.

    How's that for going back in time?
    I have one too!!!!!!! We ARE antiques~~~~!


  6. #46
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    thanks for the pics. I am planning to only do half the barrel flat for first one. Do I need coolant if I go super slow with feed?
    Look twice, shoot once.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by nekshot View Post
    thanks for the pics. I am planning to only do half the barrel flat for first one. Do I need coolant if I go super slow with feed?
    I do s-l-o-w feed milling with only cutting fluids (NOT gun oil!!!!!! OMG it seem like everyone on here LIVES by gun oil.) applied by hand feed. Get the good stuff!!!!!!!

    If you are doing VERY aggressive feed rates like in productions work, then you need coolant pumped over the cutting area. I have that set-up - but rarely ever use it.

    Most hobbyist milling procedures do NOT require pumped coolant set-ups. Just use a good cutting fluid/lube compatable with the material you are machining. Do NOT use motor oil. 3-in-one, gun oil!!!!!! Get/order a good cuttting fluid engineered for machining/milling of the materials you are cutting. I have 3 of them.

    Bangerjim

  8. #48
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by nekshot View Post
    thanks for the pics. I am planning to only do half the barrel flat for first one. Do I need coolant if I go super slow with feed?
    While there are instances where you don't want to use a cutting oil (cast iron is one that comes to mind). For most machining, a cutting oil or fluid will reduce vibration, produce a better finish and extend the life of your cutters. For many ferrous steels, a purified lard oil will do and doesn't require an extensive vapor removal/extraction system. Apply with an acid brush or throw-away paint brush.
    A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms *shall not be infringed*.

    "The greatest danger to American freedom is a government that ignores the Constitution."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    "While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny."
    - Rev. Nicholas Collin, Fayetteville Gazette (N.C.), October 12, 1789

  9. #49
    Boolit Master Moleman-'s Avatar
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    The flood coolant is nice on things like barrels where you're taking a long cut as you don't have to keep brushing chips or applying the cutting oil. As bangerjim said I usually do not use the flood coolant for perhaps 95% of the work that gets done and didn't put one on for perhaps the first 5 years I owned the mill. Most of what I do gets done with a chip brush with a squirt or two of either Ridged brand dark cutting oil (steel) or WD40/with a little ATF (aluminum) or the water based coolant for both. I do think the flood coolant systems do a much better job of keeping the chips clear than I do and requires much less effort on my part which means I can sit down (much better on my back than standing for long periods) and watch the machine work. The surface finish is a little better and tool life seems better. They are not without their issues though. They can be messy, and the coolant can go rancid. My shop isn't heated yet, so I added Sierra brand pet safe antifreeze to the coolant which seems to keep it from getting stinky as well as freezing in the winter time. Pets like the taste of the water based coolant also, so if they're around the equipment and you are going to use it in an unheated area that requires antifreeze I'd keep that in mind. That's why I went with the pet safe type.

    You will likely add equipment/tooling as different projects come up. Being hobby based for the most part there are no time requirements so taking a side track to make a tool/jig or whatever for me at least isn't a big deal and keeps me busy.

  10. #50
    Boolit Master
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    For their safety, keep your pets out of any area where there might be metal chips on the floor. I don't let Timber in the shop.

    If you have a good sized air compressor, consider a spray mister. On the mill, I prefer them to using flood coolant.
    A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms *shall not be infringed*.

    "The greatest danger to American freedom is a government that ignores the Constitution."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    "While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny."
    - Rev. Nicholas Collin, Fayetteville Gazette (N.C.), October 12, 1789

  11. #51
    Boolit Master

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    I have a can of white lead in my box from the first shop I worked in high school.
    We seldom ran flow coolants on most jobs. The cnc centers were different though they ran a flood. Deep drilling, long cuts, and some materials got a light trickle to a full flood.
    I pump black oil thru the barrel to the reamer when I cut a chamber under pressure. this cools and clears chips better for me. The Cool Misters do work and are handy but most require a special fluid.

    A simple dripper can be made from a single serving soup can a small valve and some 1/8" od grease line. Solder the valve into the bottom of the cleaned can then about 8" of the tubing with a 90* bend in the open end of the valve. a "ear can be soldered on the can to mount it with a magnetic base. Thus set up can be set to give a fine drip on the cutter at the desired rate. You can use black oils, water solubales, or most any cutting fluid in it. You can fasten a piece of cotton string to the tube just short of the cutter to spread the lube. this works better in the lathe than the mill.

    For aluminums and coopers try the waterless hand cleaners D+L, Go Jo for cutting fluid. improves finish and stops galling to the cutter and piece.

  12. #52
    Boolit Master
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    If I wanted to put 6 or 8 flats on a barrel,and had to start from scratch,or nearly so,without buying a mill ,I would use a large grinding wheel in a spindle,with a make-do indexing attachment and slide.....Most places now ,big grinding wheels are near giveaways.........in fact I made a path from new 26" white alox wheels.with small grey wheels in the centres,looks good.IMHO.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check