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Thread: 1885 hi wall Uberti versus Pedersoli

  1. #21
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    RedlegEd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldred View Post
    Actually the original Browning is quite different from the Winchester version, Winchester used Browning's ingenious falling block/floating hammer idea (after buying the patent) and completely redesigned it into the 1885 that we know today. Except for a similar outward appearance and that floating hammer idea almost nothing in the original Browning and the original 1885 by Winchester is the same. As for the Ped/Ubertis they are nearly identical to the original Winchester in almost every way with about the only notable difference being that they use a hybrid main/lever spring system that utilizes both a coil hammer spring and the flat spring, the original Winchesters used either a coil or a flat spring but I don't think they ever built a rifle that used both like the imports do.
    Hi. I've got two of the Uberti 1885s in .45-70, and two Browning (Miroku) B78/1885s (.45-70 & .30-06.) Another notable difference in the Italian model is they return to half cock upon closing the action, whereas the Brownings will remain at full cock (I'm guessing the Winnie 1885 does as well.)

    As to the OPs original question...my Uberti's are both real shooters. I've put an MVA #130 rear tang sight on one, and I'm putting a Shaver Economy Soule on the other (globe front sights w/changeable inserts on both.)

    Ed
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  2. #22
    Boolit Master
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    I don't know who makes either, but would assume a high wall with a Winchester (or Browning) logo would retain at least a slightly higher resale value.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegEd View Post
    Hi. I've got two of the Uberti 1885s in .45-70, and two Browning (Miroku) B78/1885s (.45-70 & .30-06.) Another notable difference in the Italian model is they return to half cock upon closing the action, whereas the Brownings will remain at full cock (I'm guessing the Winnie 1885 does as well.)

    As to the OPs original question...my Uberti's are both real shooters. I've put an MVA #130 rear tang sight on one, and I'm putting a Shaver Economy Soule on the other (globe front sights w/changeable inserts on both.)

    Ed
    The Miroku Browning/Winchester is a whole different animal to the originals as it is a totally different action inside and bears only a passing resemblance on the outside, extremely well built and very fine rifles but very different to the originals, some original 1885s did go to half cock upon closing but the vast majority were made to go to full cock. The original Browning single shot design that Winchester bought from Browning was quite different still but relatively few were built at Browning's Utah shop before Winchester bought the design.

    As a bit of a side note Browning, due to a misunderstanding of the patent sale terms, continued to produce his version of the rifle even after selling the design to Winchester. When Winchester learned of this they quickly had to explain to him that after he sold the design he was no longer allowed to build and sell them! Of course Browning and Winchester continued to remain on good terms and the rest is history.
    Statistics show that criminals commit fewer crimes after they have been shot

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by indian joe View Post
    Was there really such a thing? I have read stuff saying winchester bought Brownings designs but it was winchester engineers that did the legwork to build functional firearms from some of his designs - we dont know - we were not there but the timeline on some of em favours that explanation. I had an original low wall in 44/40 - if Winchester changed the Browning design to arrive at that rifle I say they improved it .
    Yes there certainly was an original Browning SS rifle and in fact that's how the 1885 came to be! When Winchester saw an example of this rifle they were so impressed by it's ingenious operating principle that Thomas G. Bennett, Vice-President and General Manager of Winchester at the time, hopped on a train and sped off to Utah territory (a big deal back in those days!) in search of the builder of these rifles!


    Quote Originally Posted by indian joe View Post
    if Winchester changed the Browning design to arrive at that rifle I say they improved it .

    The original was relatively crude and had several areas in need of improving, most notably the 90 deg. vertical breech block that was prone to headspacing problems. Also the lock system was overly simplistic and actually a bit crude but bear in mind this was the very first design by Browning who was barely out of his teens at that time! Then we must consider that these were to be built mostly by hand using only the very basic tools and crude machinery they had to work with and no electricity, remember this was in Ogden city Utah territory in the late 1870's!

    This is the original Browning design patent drawings that Winchester eventually bought and turned into the 1885 we are familiar with today.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The differences in Browning's design and Winchester's model 1885 version are many and the completely
    redesigned workings are easy to see.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by oldred; 06-10-2018 at 11:38 AM. Reason: Add images
    Statistics show that criminals commit fewer crimes after they have been shot

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegEd View Post
    Hi. I've got two of the Uberti 1885s in .45-70, and two Browning (Miroku) B78/1885s (.45-70 & .30-06.) Another notable difference in the Italian model is they return to half cock upon closing the action, whereas the Brownings will remain at full cock (I'm guessing the Winnie 1885 does as well.)

    As to the OPs original question...my Uberti's are both real shooters. I've put an MVA #130 rear tang sight on one, and I'm putting a Shaver Economy Soule on the other (globe front sights w/changeable inserts on both.)

    Ed
    Thanks ED - yeah lookin for some fedback on how the Uberti shoots compared to Pedersoli - I have a Uberti 1876 that is coming along nice - dunno whose barrel but it looks good.
    The original 85 low wall we had stayed at full cock when you closed the action - had heard there were some 1885's that didnt . That 85 was pretty slick for a single shot - about as quick as a small frame martini.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check