How to crimp .32-20 brass for Nagant revolver

[Deavis]

Greetings:

I worked up a bunch of .32-20 brass for the Nagant and left them long. Seated bullets deep and crimped in front of the bullet ogive to get workable ammo but it’s not really what I’m after as the bullets aren’t crimped enough to keep from falling back in the case.

I’m using .32-20 to Nagant Lee Dies.

This morning I tried to trim some cases back and be able to crimp in the front grease groves of the 78 grain LRN boolits I’m using. And get a nice COAL for my cylinder and decent crimping to eliminate collapsing bullets in the case and uniform resistance/powder burn.

With my set up the now short brass won’t reach the crimping portion of my die.

I tried running it through the sizer (decap rod removed obviously) hoping the die might squish the brass acceptable to hold the boolit. No dice.


I would be pretty happy with a LEE FCD that I could reach the crimping collet on. Would the .32-20 FCD work? Or will I have the same issue in getting the case deep enough in the die?

Should I take my current die to my machinist buddy and shorten the base?

I tried taking some meat off the shell holder to allow additional travel up into the crimp die but that little sucker is HARD. May need machinist for that too.

Thoughts?

[Drm50]

I cut off several dies to be able to reach the crimp. Since they where going to be used for that
purpose I took about 1/2 the die below crimp ring. When I cut off dies I use hack saw while
turning and then face and polish, it's easier on bits. I don't own Lee dies but Lyman & RCBS are
some hard stuff. I've never been able to figure out how to put the 3 point punch crimp that some
of the Nagant and Lebel ammo has.

[blpenn66502]

Think the Lee FCD for the 32-20 is their rifle style that is actuated when the die touches the shell holder so a shorter case wouldn't be touched most likely without removing some of the bottom of the actuating portion. Not sure what the upper dimensions are when using 32-20 brass, but I'd be inclined to use as 32 S&W/32 Long crimp die and save the machining effort. IIRC some individuals have used 30 carbine dies for reloading nagant as well.

[WRideout]

When I started loading the Nagant pistol, I began with a set of 30 carbine dies that I acquired off this forum. The RCBS die set came with a taper crimp die, which works fine on those cases. Lately I have been using Starline cases. I wanted to keep it as original as possible, so I didn't mess with 32-20 cases, cylinder conversions and all that. With the carbine dies, it is not appreciably different from loading any other center fire case. I did have trouble with boolets sliding in the case during recoil when I used my home made lube, which is pretty slippery. Now that I almost exclusively use Ben's Liquid Lube (a variant on Lee Liquid Alox) it is sticky enough that I don't have that trouble any more.

I have used a light charge of 4f black powder with the Nagant, and it works fine; I changed to a more suitable lube for those.

Wayne

[mac60]

I have to admit I'm totally confused. Are you trimming 7.62x38r brass back - or are you shortening .32-20 brass? If you are trimming .32-20 brass back you certainly won't be able to crimp.

[Deavis]

Mac - Shortening .32-20 brass and want to crimp.

[jimb16]

A .30 carbine crimp dies works very well. It reduces the case mouth just enough to slide into the barrel recess easily without over working the brass.

[Deavis]

.30 Carbine FCD or just standard RCBS seat/crimp die from a 3 die set?

I have 2 Carbines but a **** load of ammo so I haven’t started loading for it yet.

Sounds like I now have an excuse to buy new dies.

[mac60]

I'm still confused. I apologize. The Lee die set is meant to alter a .32-20 cartridge case so that it can be used in the nagant gas seal revolver. When using .32-20 cases you seat a bullet in a conventional manner - the bullet is not seated below the mouth of the case. The powder thru expanding die and the bullet seat/crimp die are actually .32-20 dies - so if you are shortening a .32-20 case you are just ensuring that the crimping shoulder of the die can't reach the mouth of the case. Maybe it's just that I don't understand why you want to shorten the .32-20 case. On the right is a .32-20 case (starline) with a cast bullet intended for use in .32-20 ammo seated to an oal of 38mm. On the left is a 7.62x38r case with a 71 fmj bullet intended for .32 acp seated below flush with the case mouth.

Attachment 221508

Another view.

Attachment 221510

I have 2 of them.

Attachment 221509

I'm at a loss as to why the need to shorten the .32-20 case. If you are intent on utilizing the "gas seal" feature of the gun - this is pretty easily done with 7.62x38r brass and a .30 carbine die set.

[mac60]

One more question. What diameter bullet are you using? I'm using the same die set as you and get a good deal of neck tension and that combined with a light crimp is plenty. I can put the nose of the bullet on the edge of the bench and push it as hard as I can and it doesn't budge .001".

[Deavis]

Mac - .311 78 grain bullets from the 311252 mold.

If I load them in .32-20 cases without trimming the case....or ..... seating deep.... the cylinder won’t turn.

[Deavis]

[mac60]

I understand that. Anything over about 38mm won't let the cylinder rotate. I sized a bullet down to .311" and still get adequate neck tension (combined with a light crimp) to make it work. I'm baffled by the lack of neck tension you are getting on a .311" bullet. blpenn66502 in post #3 has a firm handle on the situation. Do you have a .32-20 FCD? Maybe your machinist buddy could do like blpenn66502 says and have him shorten the part on the die that bears against the shellholder. I find it much simpler to just deep seat the bullet, apply a light crimp and just move on with life. Having ammo that works in the gun and allows me to hit what I'm shootin' at is good enough for me.

[Deavis]

That’s pretty much my goal too

[Schutes]

Hello Mac... If I understand correctly, you are using 32-20 brass and Lee 32-20 dies to make ammo for your Nagant revolver. Did you need to make any modifications to the dies or will them work as purchased?
Thanks!!

[Tackleberry41]

I do not even bother to size my bullets. Same 90gr mold that works in my 32 S&W. Anything smaller than 311 and they are pretty loose in the 32-20 case.

[9.3X62AL]

I already had 30 Carbine, 32 ACP, 32 S&W Long, and 32/20 WCF die sets on hand when I started loading for the 7.62 x 38R Nagant. Something will work from among all of those 18 dies, once adjusted to the cases being used. I have used 32/20 brass and both Starline and Fiocchi full-length brass to create ammo for this little 1916 Tula-made contraption of mine. The best bullet to date has been an obscure 93 grain Lyman casting, #313492 sized @ .311". In 32/20 brass, the button end protruding will chamber and the cylinder will turn and connect fully with the forcing cone--I set a light roll crimp with the 32/20 seating die, and all works well. With the full-length brass, I seat the 492's nose flush with the case mouth edge, and then use a 32 S&W Long sizer die to set a profile crimp over the rebated button nose of the bullet now covered by the case mouth.

[mac60]

Hello Mac... If I understand correctly, you are using 32-20 brass and Lee 32-20 dies to make ammo for your Nagant revolver. Did you need to make any modifications to the dies or will them work as purchased?
Thanks!!

Hello Schutes. The die set is actually marked and sold as 7.62x38r and it's explained that they are intended for use with .32-20 cases. The sizing die is specific to 7.62x38r and it is intended to alter a .32-20 case so it will reliably chamber in an 1895 Nagant revolver. The other two dies included in the set are actually the exact same dies as sold by Lee in their .32-20 die sets (no difference at all). When using .32-20 cases no modification to the dies is needed at all. The bullet is seated in a conventional manner. However, seating to an oal of 38mm (or less) is required in order for the cylinder to rotate.

[JSH]

While everyone is here, is there a die set made for the factory brass? I have came into a good supply. Need to dig mine out. Have not played with it for some time.
Jeff

[mac60]

While everyone is here, is there a die set made for the factory brass? I have came into a good supply. Need to dig mine out. Have not played with it for some time.
Jeff

Yes. RCBS makes a set but, they are kinda pricey. The RCBS dies are special order (I believe) and will run you about $170.00. A CH die set will run you about $153.00 +/-. I load for mine with factory brass (Fiocchi 7.62x38r h/s) with Lee .30 carbine dies.