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Thread: AA7 and Hodgen Universal in reduce loads for 308/30-06?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

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    AA7 and Hodgen Universal in reduce loads for 308/30-06?

    Anyone have any experience with any of these powders in these calibers?

  2. #2
    Boolit Master rsrocket1's Avatar
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    I used a lot of Unique (essentially the same as Universal for this purpose) in .308 and 7.62x54R. Almost any medium speed powder will behave closely in a long barreled big cartridge rifle application. Read up on "the load" which is 13g Red Dot. My starting point is typically 10g Unique/Red Dot/Titegroup/"20/28"/AA#5 or 7/800-X/Bullseye. I've also used Clays, Titewad, Power Pistol but now reserve those for shotgun loads or big pistol shooting for the PP.

    A big volume case like a .308/30-06 and a long barrel means that virtually all medium speed or faster shotshell or pistol powder will burn 100% before the bullet reaches the end of the barrel. The chemical energy of the powder which is mostly determined by the weight is transferred to the kinetic energy of the bullet (1/2*m*V^2). So a 10g charge of just about any powder will produce roughly the same muzzle velocity at the end of a rifle barrel (yes there are subtle differences and each powder is a little different than another).

    You should start with about 10g and work up or down a grain or two to look for the best accuracy at 50-100 yards. It won't be tack driver accurate, but it can be good enough for soda can hunting or even small game hunting.



    Here is a pretty good 100 yard group with 13g Titegroup with the Lee 309-170-F bullet seated to 0.3" with no gas check.


    Shooting these loads can be addictive, you can shoot for hours without getting a sore shoulder and if you cast your own bullets, the shots can be almost as inexpensive as shooting 22LR (6-7 cents/shot).

  3. #3
    Boolit Master

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    Thanks for the reply and all the photos. I have generally getting more accurate reduce loads with Universal than Unique because it meters better.

    I have some AA7 on hand and cannot find much in the way of published data for reloads in the 1,000 to 1,300 fps range.

    So far my most accurate load in .308 is 9.3 gr. Universal under a Lee C312-185 sized to .311, gas checked and lubed in 3 coats of Bens Liquid Lube. 8 or 9 grs. of Universal under an Xtreme 150 copper plated bullet is almost as accurate but more expensive.

    Thanks again.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
    winelover's Avatar
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    AA#7 was designed for the 9 mm Luger cartridge, according to Accurate's description in their Number One Manual. Current product description off their site:

    Accurate No. 7 is an intermediate burning, double-base, spherical powder suitable for a wide range of handgun calibers. No. 7 is an excellent choice for high performance semi-auto handguns such as the 357 Sig, 38 Super, and 40 S&W. No. 7 is also a cost effective solution in larger magnum handgun calibers. Made in the USA.

    I keep 8# jugs around for use in 9 mm, 357 and 44 Special. Never seen data for centerfire rifle.

    Winelover

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
    sargenv's Avatar
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    Odd, I've found Universal to be inconsistent in pistol calibers with large case volume.. I can't imaging using it in a Rifle sized cartridge.. I'd be more apt to use Titegroup than about anything else save the traditional Bullseye/Unique/2400 loads since Titegroup is designed to be temp and case volume insensitive. I've used it with good luck in small cases (9mm) medium cases (40 S&W, 45 acp), and large cases (41 magnum) and it stays pretty consistent.. Universal and other similar powders are a lot more erratic depending on where in the case the powder lies (tip barrel up so powder is close to primer, tip barrel down so powder is away from primer, laying on the bottom of the case settled, or whether the case volume is over 90% (small & medium cases).

    These are my experiences.. ymmv.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

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    Here is a group from Universal and a cast bullet in my .308.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    there are posted load data of AA7 with 170 cast bullets in the 6-8 gr. range. Just curious if anyone had personal experience with AA7?

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy doctorxring's Avatar
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    For 308 or 30-06 reduced loads I would recommend
    Blue Dot powder. 22 grain modest max for 308 and
    24 grains modest max for 30-06. Bullet weight your
    choice. 15 grains on the low end. I've never seen
    a 308 or 30-06 that wouldn't shoot Blue Dot accurately
    if they were a generally accurate rifle all around.
    Usually around 20 grains is the sweet spot for both
    of these calibers.

    Blue Dot is not position sensitive and no filler needed
    or desired. However, as with all fast powders in
    rifles cases -- no distractions while reloading.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master

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    My experience with Blue Dot is positive, but I ran out and now am looking at a jug of AA7 sitting on my bench with 5-6 pounds left in it. The price was right and I am looking for someone with practical experience with it.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check