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Thread: Indications of more powder needed.....

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

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    Indications of more powder needed.....

    Got to the 150 yard range today shooting a Shiloh 38-55 and the groups became non-existant. Really opened up more than one would expect. Time to bump up the powder charge?
    45gr/weight Old "E" FFG under a Lyman #378674 335 gr.round nose. .030 veg wad.
    Last edited by Knarley; 05-13-2018 at 07:50 PM.
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  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    45 grains of 2F or 3F or?

  3. #3
    Boolit Master

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    The charge is of 2F
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  4. #4
    Boolit Master MyFlatline's Avatar
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    Hey Bob, Funny to see you here..

    I have found that the powder needs to be bumped up,,,or a different powder used. Some powders are only good for a certain range, after that , well after that all bets are off. It's a trial an error. I started getting good results with IMR 4227 but got side tracked with a 4 letter word that starts with W. Will follow along to see where it goes.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master MyFlatline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MyFlatline View Post
    Hey Bob, Funny to see you here..

    I have found that the powder needs to be bumped up,,,or a different powder used. Some powders are only good for a certain range, after that , well after that all bets are off. It's a trial an error. I started getting good results with IMR 4227 but got side tracked with a 4 letter word that starts with W. Will follow along to see where it goes.
    Sorry, forgot you are a BP guy. disregard..

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    Time to bump up the powder charge?
    45gr/weight Old "E" FFG under a Lyman #378674 335 gr.round nose. .030 veg wad.
    It's my opinion, the reload is not the issue and an increased powder charge is not necessary:
    My pet 38-55 reload is the Ideal 375166, 330gr bullet with 42gr of KIK FFg. It is accurate at 100 - 300yds and 200 - 500 meters

    Try 42gr of Ole E and question ... does your rifle have a vernier sight on it? Also, when you say 'really opened up' ... what were the groups in inches?
    Regards
    John

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Boy View Post
    It's my opinion, the reload is not the issue and an increased powder charge is not necessary:
    My pet 38-55 reload is the Ideal 375166, 330gr bullet with 42gr of KIK FFg. It is accurate at 100 - 300yds and 200 - 500 meters

    Try 42gr of Ole E and question ... does your rifle have a vernier sight on it? Also, when you say 'really opened up' ... what were the groups in inches?
    Yes to the sight. Kelly front & Rear. From connecting holes @ 50yards to either side of a paper plate @ 150 yards. Bullet .002 over bore 20:1 alloy, SPG lube, case sized to .376 Bullet sized to .377 . Bore @ .3755, .030 veg wad. Just enough crimp to smooth out the bell mouth, which it's self is just big enough to help start the projectile. Starline brass that has been annealed, deburred & champfered.
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  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    never underestimate or over look fouling

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    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by ascast View Post
    never underestimate or over look fouling
    Now that you mention it, yes, I was blow tubing. Cleaning every 5th shot. I also tried wiping between shots, showed no difference.
    If a stouter kick in the pants doesn't work, I guess I'll go the other way.
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  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    You have plenty of powder. More could work too.
    But, what you are describing sounds a lot more like yaw. In simple terms, somehow you are not getting the bullet a good start and the nose is circling the base as it go down range.

    There could be no shortage of reasons. If we were in the same loading room when you loaded we could have more to talk about.

    Think about what you can do to get everything lined up better when you load.

    The blow-tubing is not the cause of accuracy at 50 and falling apart at 150.
    Good luck
    Chill Wills

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

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    if the bore is .3775" what is the groove?

    for starters - how 'bout the same powder charge/compression/wad, a greased bullet to groove diameter, 1:30 alloy, push-in seated for an OAL that barely touches the rifling? and wipe wet/dry between shots.

  12. #12
    Boolit Bub
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    With that same bullet, I found that 30-1 shoots better than 20-1.
    40-43 gr of Swiss 1-1/2Fg. Depending on lot of powder.
    Rem 2-1/2 primers
    0.030 Veg wad
    Starline brass

  13. #13
    Boolit Master

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    After reading your posts I think I know what is going on. I went to the smaller expander which is .376, to gain a little neck tension. In doing so, the nose of the bullet deformed a bit. There fore the "off center" wobble that caused the yaw. I will be going back to the .379 expander, and double checking the compression depth. I will also be trying some loads @ 42 gr. Just to check it out.
    You guys have been a great help, thank you.......
    Knarley
    A gun in hand is worth two cops on the phone.
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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check