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Thread: CLOSED - MIHEC 300 Blackout 311-230 GRN hollow point 4C HP and 6C Solid

  1. #601
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wansingct View Post
    I used the Lee tapered expander and it worked well. I'm using a 10.5" no-name upper with feed ramps that probably need widened.

    What worked for me was to expand the neck until the seating process didn't dork up the bullet nose and then crimping things back down. From what I'm seeing I think the stepped M die might be a better solution.

    BLD451 - let me know if you'd like to sell some of those pins. I'm already running my pot at 850* to get halfway decent results on pure lead.
    You getting incomplete nose fillout? I have to run them fast, and get 'em out of the mold as soon as possible to keep pins hot and release bullets with minimal tapping. Bummer about the long pins is I can't visually sort them. I have to weigh because the defect is usually way down in the tip of the HP. Got some ballistic gel coming next week. I'll put up some results at some point. I dug some out of the berm the other day and it seems they are getting out the barrel without getting too crooked. Looks like the rifling is starting to engrave evenly. I was a little afraid they would want to "lean" a little with the thin waist under acceleration.
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  2. #602
    Okay guys, I have a few questions. For those of you that are getting decent accuracy what is your OAL? I worked up a set of ladders in both Acurate 1680 and CFE Black. I cast and then sized a bunch up half at 309, and half at 310. With the Accurate I started the ladder at 9 grains and then went up .2/10 of a grain till I hit 10.5 grains. I loaded 10 rounds at each increment. I was shooting of a sled only working the trigger at 50 yards. The purpose was to try to discover which load was going to hit that sweet spot. However, my accuracy was beyond dismal. We are talking 6+ inch groups. I was shooting out of a 10.5 inch barrel with a 1/8 twist, I have shot .70 groups at 100 yards with some of my other loads. I cast them at 760 Degrees, water quenched and coated with Hi-Tek and loaded them to an OAL of 2.220. Any ideas why my accuracy would be so dismal. This is the first Bore Rider I have ever worked with, its also the first heavy sub I have ever attempted to cast and use in a rifle. Thoughts appreciated, I am scratching my head...

  3. #603
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    Weigh your bullets and make sure they are dropping correctly and measure your bullets. Just seating and shooting a bullets should produce better results than that. Slug your barrel as well. I just seated to the crimp groove and had ok accuracy. My melt was way too hot and mine were undersized so I have to go back and cast em again.
    I have danced with the devil, luckily she was stupid and didnít hire a lawyer!

  4. #604
    Boolit Buddy Gamsek's Avatar
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    I seat to crimp groove. We had a target set to 100m and I checked how trajectory of 350 m/s load with no GC fit with Nikon BDC. No load development. Just 12grs of N120 with pistol primer. Not ideal. It was windy and that group of 5 was just after shooting 5 jacketed 190grs Hornady Sub-x. I will repeat that test but I am satisfied for first test.


  5. #605
    I got the no lube groove version, and I slugged my bore and sized accordingly. Just to be sure I sized a bunch down to 0309 and to 0310 and worked up the ladders for each. The 309 was bad, the 310 was about the same.

  6. #606
    Boolit Buddy DAFzipper's Avatar
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    I had to seat mine at 2.217 to get them to chamber reliably in my 10 inch ar. Last trip to range was 100 rounds at steel. Had only one round that failed to feed. I have the solid NLG PB.

    Sent from my LG-H700 using Tapatalk

  7. #607
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    I ordered a different expander from Lee so I can make one that is larger in diameter. I pulled some of mine to check and the brass is sizing them down and I am running some hard boolits. My accuracy could be better but not as bad as you are getting.

  8. #608
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    Quote Originally Posted by portersandstouts View Post
    Okay guys, I have a few questions. For those of you that are getting decent accuracy what is your OAL? I worked up a set of ladders in both Acurate 1680 and CFE Black. I cast and then sized a bunch up half at 309, and half at 310. With the Accurate I started the ladder at 9 grains and then went up .2/10 of a grain till I hit 10.5 grains. I loaded 10 rounds at each increment. I was shooting of a sled only working the trigger at 50 yards. The purpose was to try to discover which load was going to hit that sweet spot. However, my accuracy was beyond dismal. We are talking 6+ inch groups. I was shooting out of a 10.5 inch barrel with a 1/8 twist, I have shot .70 groups at 100 yards with some of my other loads. I cast them at 760 Degrees, water quenched and coated with Hi-Tek and loaded them to an OAL of 2.220. Any ideas why my accuracy would be so dismal. This is the first Bore Rider I have ever worked with, its also the first heavy sub I have ever attempted to cast and use in a rifle. Thoughts appreciated, I am scratching my head...
    What is your alloy? And how are you sizing the neck on your brass? Crimp or no?

  9. #609
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    Also posing a question, I cast up a batch of these without weighing and found them to come in at 211 grains. I recast a batch again today using range scrap with a touch of Sn added and the weight went up to 213 grains, also the nose measures .299” but fill out is good. Why is the weight so off?
    I have danced with the devil, luckily she was stupid and didnít hire a lawyer!

  10. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by sutherpride59 View Post
    Also posing a question, I cast up a batch of these without weighing and found them to come in at 211 grains. I recast a batch again today using range scrap with a touch of Sn added and the weight went up to 213 grains, also the nose measures .299” but fill out is good. Why is the weight so off?
    What does the bottom of the hollowpoint look like? When I get low weight, I can usually see a big void where the tip of the pin would be. Usually not more than 2 grains or so though... were they consistent? What tyoe of range did the scrap come from? Can't think of a typical bullet alloy that would measure 10% light and not be really hard.
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  11. #611
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    These are solids not hollow points, I cast a small lot today using pure lead with just a touch of tin and I pressure cast them using both a ladle and my bottom pour spout and they aren’t getting any heavier. I used 5 lbs of pure lead and 6 ounces of pewter. I’m sure they would shoot just fine but so does my 206 grain mold. This is suppose to drop at 226 grains.
    I have danced with the devil, luckily she was stupid and didnít hire a lawyer!

  12. #612
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    Quote Originally Posted by sutherpride59 View Post
    These are solids not hollow points, I cast a small lot today using pure lead with just a touch of tin and I pressure cast them using both a ladle and my bottom pour spout and they aren’t getting any heavier. I used 5 lbs of pure lead and 6 ounces of pewter. I’m sure they would shoot just fine but so does my 206 grain mold. This is suppose to drop at 226 grains.
    How long are they as-cast?
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  13. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by sutherpride59 View Post
    These are solids not hollow points, I cast a small lot today using pure lead with just a touch of tin and I pressure cast them using both a ladle and my bottom pour spout and they aren’t getting any heavier. I used 5 lbs of pure lead and 6 ounces of pewter. I’m sure they would shoot just fine but so does my 206 grain mold. This is suppose to drop at 226 grains.

    Suther, how long are they? Sorry, I didn't see my earlier and thought it hadn't posted....
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  14. #614
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    So. Got to do the gel thing today. Proved once again that it is best to learn from direct observation and testing... tried 8 different loads for various guns and less than half did what I was expecting.

    I shot both the as-delivered mold and my deeper pin version. Load was R-P 300 cases, Tula mag primers, 11.7 grs. AA 1680, seated to the crimp groove and crimped with a just more than slight crimp. Shot out of an 8.5" AR with 1-8 twist and 1' red dot. Accuracy is right around 2" at 50 with some signs of promise. (Half or more of the holes touching and flyers scattered about) velocities were 1036 (deep) and 1046 (shallow).

    Both bullets fully penetrated the 16" block. The shallow pin version retained 229 grs and the deep pin version lost its nose and left a 157 gr slug to continue on after 10". All the parts of the shed nose were between 7-10 inches deep, and pretty close to the wound track. (Not more than 1" or so off course) both had a neck of about 2-3" before the permanent cavity formed. That cavity seemed to be maybe 1.5-2 inches at the widest point. The deep version had the bigger cavity as you would expect.

    As cast the shallow pin bullets weigh 229. Deep pin bullets weigh 224-225. Alloy was 50/50 pure lead and early 2000's wheelweights with 2%tin added.

    Here are some photos of the experience:

    These are what I ended up with. Attachment 261368

    And cutaways to see what the hp's look like.
    Attachment 261369

    Here are the wound tracks. Read the channels left to right, bottom to top. Right (top track) is a NOE 153 gr sp supersonic load.
    Attachment 261370

    Here is the nose of the long pin bullet in place in the track.
    Attachment 261371

    Hope this is useful.
    Last edited by bld451; 05-01-2020 at 01:38 AM.
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  15. #615
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    Quote Originally Posted by bld451 View Post
    So. Got to do the gel thing today. Proved once again that it is best to learn from direct observation and testing... tried 8 different loads for various guns and less than half did what I was expecting.

    I shot both the as-delivered mold and my deeper pin version. Load was R-P 300 cases, Tula mag primers, 11.7 grs. AA 1680, seated to the crimp groove and crimped with a just more than slight crimp. Shot out of an 8.5" AR with 1-8 twist and 1' red dot. Accuracy is right around 2" at 50 with some signs of promise. (Half or more of the holes touching and flyers scattered about) velocities were 1036 (deep) and 1046 (shallow).

    Both bullets fully penetrated the 16" block. The shallow pin version retained 229 grs and the deep pin version lost its nose and left a 157 gr slug to continue on after 10". All the parts of the shed nose were between 7-10 inches deep, and pretty close to the wound track. (Not more than 1" or so off course) both had a neck of about 2-3" before the permanent cavity formed. That cavity seemed to be maybe 1.5-2 inches at the widest point. The deep version had the bigger cavity as you would expect.

    As cast the shallow pin bullets weigh 229. Deep pin bullets weigh 224-225. Alloy was 50/50 pure lead and early 2000's wheelweights with 2%tin added.

    Here are some photos of the experience:

    These are what I ended up with. Attachment 261368

    And cutaways to see what the hp's look like.
    Attachment 261369

    Here are the wound tracks. Read the channels left to right, bottom to top. Right (top track) is a NOE 153 gr sp supersonic load.
    Attachment 261370

    Here is the nose of the long pin bullet in place in the track.
    Attachment 261371

    Hope this is useful.
    None of your photos are showing for me.
    NRA Endowment Member

    Armed people don't march into gas chambers.

  16. #616
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Bullets
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    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  17. #617
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Tracks

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Pieces of large hp
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  18. #618
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    Quote Originally Posted by bld451 View Post
    How long are they as-cast?
    sorry i measured and as cast they are 1.190" long from nose to base and unsized the driving bands mic at .3111" not quite sure what is going on. Like i said these were made with 5lbs pure lead and 6 ounces of pewter. Cast at both 750 and 800 degrees(I settled on 800 to reduce wrinkles). Same alloy cast the NOE 311299 206 grain 311 diameter bullet at 205 grains so I know the alloy isn't at fault. I'm ok with some variance but with these dropping at 211 grains that's almost 10% off!
    I have danced with the devil, luckily she was stupid and didnít hire a lawyer!

  19. #619
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    Quote Originally Posted by sutherpride59 View Post
    sorry i measured and as cast they are 1.190" long from nose to base and unsized the driving bands mic at .3111" not quite sure what is going on. Like i said these were made with 5lbs pure lead and 6 ounces of pewter. Cast at both 750 and 800 degrees(I settled on 800 to reduce wrinkles). Same alloy cast the NOE 311299 206 grain 311 diameter bullet at 205 grains so I know the alloy isn't at fault. I'm ok with some
    variance but with these dropping at 211 grains that's almost 10% off!
    Interesting. All i have is mine to check, but my bullets measure 1.260" long. That might account for it. I bought mine from the website as a standard, so may not be the same batch as the group buy.....


    As a side note, I took a look at my recovered bullets with a scope today. Interesting. I had not seen a close up of gas cutting and thought some others may not have either, so Ifigured I'd post. Kinda making me want a checkmaker for plain based bullets.... it looks like it could account for some of the accuracy I seem to have lost.

    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	261549bases of the three in my previous posts.


    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	261550wondering why there is powdercoat where it looks like it was eroded?


    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	261551more like I would have expected. Exposed lead.

    I believe I posted earlier but these were with 11.7 grs. of AA1680. Right about 1250 fps...
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

  20. #620
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    Attachment 261552 not sure a whole post on the supersonic test bullet goes with this thread so I'll post here if interested:

    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...2-300-BO-Molds
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Young kid to old vet: "How do I know when it's time to take up arms?"

    Old vet: "Well, you grab your rifle, load 'er up and go outside........ if you're the only one, it ain't time yet!"

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check