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Thread: CLOSED - MIHEC 300 Blackout 311-230 GRN hollow point 4C HP and 6C Solid

  1. #501
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  2. #502
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    CLOSED - MIHEC 300 Blackout 311-230 GRN hollow point 4C HP and 6C Solid

    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Butcher View Post
    I have a no lube groove gas check mold. The bullets are hourglass shaped. They measure.295 between the drive end and the nose that measures .301 after powder coat. They were cast from some of the captains range scrap. It’s a light coat of Smokes translucent copper if that matters.

    The bullets will Not chamber. Its disappointing to say the least.

    I have not planned on “nose sizing” or leaving the front end bare. Is this a hybrid bore rider design? I’m just confused on the shape, and concerned that I’ve spent a hundred bucks on a mold that does not drop useable projectiles.
    Attachment 255753
    Mark
    IT should chamber. Beside flawlessly functioning in my bolt action 300 BLK Ruger Ranch, it also function in .308 Win Sako A7, crimped into crimp groove. It even fit and feeds from its magazine!
    My chrome PC is the thickest PC, it works too.

    BUT when I tried PC bullet without sizing (0.3134) it did not chamber either. Sized to 0.3106” they function normally. Are yours sized?

    If it is not that, did you properly remove the flare on case mouths? I believe you did, seeing your photo.


    308 Win cartridges with 0.3106” sized bullet.
    Last edited by Gamsek; 01-31-2020 at 05:36 AM.

  3. #503
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    2 more groups fired this morning out of the Noveski 300 blkout AR
    Same details as post above
    6.6 grns of Lil gun .. Full function nice rd holes
    6.8 grns of Lil gun .. Full function nice rd holes

    Both gave approx 1-1/4 " groups
    I see great potential just going to require some load development
    Recovered 2 more fired projectiles. Will post those in a little while
    I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!

    http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH

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  4. #504
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    MiHec. Pm sent
    I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!

    http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH

    Selling Hi Quality Powdercoating Powder

    PULSAR night vision and thermal dealer !!!
    PM me for a good deal

    I am not crazy my mom had me tested

    Theres a fine line between genius and crazy .. I'm that line
    and depending on the day I might just step over that line !!!

  5. #505
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    In this photo you can see the base was struck by another bullet and removed the gas check Click image for larger version. 

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    Remember both these were shot at approx 1000 to 1025 fps
    Velocities around 1400-1500 should produce some impressive expansion which i plan to test next week
    I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!

    http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH

    Selling Hi Quality Powdercoating Powder

    PULSAR night vision and thermal dealer !!!
    PM me for a good deal

    I am not crazy my mom had me tested

    Theres a fine line between genius and crazy .. I'm that line
    and depending on the day I might just step over that line !!!

  6. #506
    Miha,

    Yes I have tried this bullet sized to .309, un coated with same results. This is a picture of the marks the lands are engraving in the nose.Click image for larger version. 

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  7. #507
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    Buck Butcher
    Have you tryed any other bullets this long in that rifle ? IE possible short throat
    just out of curiosity have you measured the nose of bullets from all 3 cavities? wondering it possible 1 may have had the cherry wobble a little creating a larger nose
    Just some thoughts to maybe help with finding the issue
    I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!

    http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH

    Selling Hi Quality Powdercoating Powder

    PULSAR night vision and thermal dealer !!!
    PM me for a good deal

    I am not crazy my mom had me tested

    Theres a fine line between genius and crazy .. I'm that line
    and depending on the day I might just step over that line !!!

  8. #508
    This is a bore rider, correct?

    If so, that’s the issue. A nose of .301 is not readily accepted by my barrel. My best pound cast is yielding a little under.300, like .2995. I do not see a dimensional drawing on this thread or mp mold site of the bullet. Although I’m not exactly an expert on these types of projectiles and the interference fit tolerance for them, I would imagine .0005 would be more than enough. (Before pressure problems??)

    MP 300 AAC NLG GC
    Sized .309
    Light translucent copper
    2.24

    Mark

  9. #509
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Butcher View Post
    This is a bore rider, correct?

    If so, that’s the issue. A nose of .301 is not readily accepted by my barrel. My best pound cast is yielding a little under.300, like .2995. I do not see a dimensional drawing on this thread or mp mold site of the bullet. Although I’m not exactly an expert on these types of projectiles and the interference fit tolerance for them, I would imagine .0005 would be more than enough. (Before pressure problems??)

    MP 300 AAC NLG GC
    Sized .309
    Light translucent copper
    2.24

    Mark
    Yes, it's a bore rider and yes, the fat part of the nose will be well into the bore in any properly chambered rifle. Your rifle does not have to have a short throat to run into problems. If your bore is less than .300 and the bullet casts larger than that, you really have no option other than to nose size. NOE makes a good setup, with the caveat that you have to taper the opening on the sizer to avoid shaving lead.

  10. #510
    So frustrating! Yes it casts larger than.300 and is per design according to Miha.

    Anyone interested in this mold?

    NOE is currently out of his sizer kits.

    Anyone have a .300 or .299 nose sizer they are willing to part with?

    Mark Baker

  11. #511
    Boolit Bub JimP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Butcher View Post
    So frustrating! Yes it casts larger than.300 and is per design according to Miha.

    Anyone interested in this mold?

    NOE is currently out of his sizer kits.

    Anyone have a .300 or .299 nose sizer they are willing to part with?

    Mark Baker
    Well, that's a bummer. Can't imagine you'll be the only one with problems. The other issue is that even if you get a nose sizer, you really need a top punch that matches the nose profile. The top punch that came with the molds is flat.

  12. #512
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    Might try casting some more bullets with a very low tin alloy. Also could try casting very hot. These both should cause the dimensions of the bullet to be a little smaller.
    Try to get the mold hot enough that you are dropping frosty bullets.
    Ill keep my guns money and freedom you keep the CHANGE!!!

  13. #513
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elkins45 View Post
    I will be interested to see if the HP makes any real difference in expansion and/or killing power. That’s a mighty skinny pin.
    It is.

    I finally got a chance to test it out. Here is the HP NLG version shot into Clear Ballistics gel at ~980 FPS from a 1:7 twist barrel. It penetrated 24" in a nearly straight line without tumbling. The maximum diameter is just under 1/2". The bullet alloy is 2.1% Sb, 3.3% Sn, and 0.6% Cu.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    For comparison, here's the NOE 247, same alloy, same gel, at ~950 fps. The hollow point of this one is about twice the diameter and 50% longer, which obviously makes a difference.
    Attachment 228532

    Have to say I'm a bit disappointed. I had hoped to retire the NOE mold.
    Last edited by JimP; 03-07-2020 at 01:12 PM.

  14. #514
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimP View Post
    It is.

    I finally got a chance to test it out. Here is the HP NLG version shot into Clear Ballistics gel at ~980 FPS from a 1:7 twist barrel. It penetrated 24" in a nearly straight line without tumbling. The maximum diameter is just under 1/2". The bullet alloy is 2.1% Sb, 3.3% Sn, and 0.6% Cu.
    Attachment 255899

    For comparison, here's the NOE 247, same alloy, same gel, at ~950 fps. The cavity of this one is about twice the diameter and 50% longer.
    Attachment 228532

    Have to say I'm a bit disappointed. I had hoped to retire the NOE mold.
    This first link is not working for me. Do you mind trying to upload it again? Really curious to see the expansion.

    Also, curious why you wanted to retire the noe mold? Looks like it's expansion is excellent. I bought this mold hoping I wouldn't need the noe one...
    Last edited by drfroglegs; 02-01-2020 at 06:06 PM.

  15. #515
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    Mark; may be a feed ramp issue

    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Butcher View Post
    Miha,

    Yes I have tried this bullet sized to .309, un coated with same results. This is a picture of the marks the lands are engraving in the nose.Click image for larger version. 

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    Mark: I have almost the identical issue as you. Let me paint the picture...

    First, our problem is isolated to AR gas auto style gun, versus bolt action. This is very important distinction.

    My conclusion was and still remains that most 300BLK manufacturers think that they can get away with using M4 mil spec feed ramps for 300. This theory basically concludes that M4 feed ramp (designed for .22 size bullets) does not work optimally for .308, especially for HP (thicker nose) bullets with 2.22"ish COAL. If the feed ramp is not optimized for larger diameter bullet, what happens is that the sheer extreme speed/force of the bolt pushes the bullet through the M4 feed ramp high into the chamber causing the cylindrical mark on the nose of the bullet. Please follow the link, and look at the 2nd last picture from the bottom of the page to visualize what I'm talking about regarding feed ramp. http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=106945

    Smoke mentioned Noveske, and I would bet his feed ramp is optimized by this competent company. I would also bet that your AR has standard M4 feed ramps, just like mine.

    Since having discovered this issue, I used a dremel to make the diameter of the feed ramps larger, and feeding issues seemed to have subsided somewhat. Not yet perfect though. I almost just want to go out and get a properly designed 300BLK upper with optimized feed ramp and chamber, so I don't feel insecure about my franken-ramp. I'm not a gunsmith, but like most of us, am pretty handy.

    Anyone else care to chime in on what type AR style feed ramp they have? Which works, which doesn't? Any suggested 300BLK uppers with 300 optimized feed ramp?

    Lastly, I purchased Miha's NLG PB and GC molds. Both are fantastic at what they were designed for. Boolits drop like magic, GC is perfectly sized, weight drops boringly unison. Couldn't really ask for more from a mold. Compared to my NOE mold, I can load these longer COAL with my current AR (8" barrel, all mil spec). Best group in PB I got was 1 1/4" at 50 yards. GC as not better, but I only tested about 40 each. One important distinction I drew was that I did not have any feed issues with Smoke's Jet Black PC with my current setup. Red jammed constantly. I had 2 out of 20 failure to feed out of my GC'd bronze powder. My unscientific conclusion is that the type of PC used could absolutely matter when it comes to feeding.
    Last edited by galaxy; 02-02-2020 at 02:10 PM.

  16. #516
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    Quote Originally Posted by drfroglegs View Post
    This first link is not working for me. Do you mind trying to upload it again? Really curious to see the expansion.

    Also, curious why you wanted to retire the noe mold? Looks like it's expansion is excellent. I bought this mold hoping I wouldn't need the noe one...
    How about this: Attachment 228532

    I have the NOE bullet performing well. I just don't like pin setup on the mold and usually have flashing around the HP opening. I also have to nose size it for two of my rifles, which is a bit of a PITA. As expected, the Mihec mold is much nicer to cast with.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by JimP; 03-07-2020 at 01:14 PM.

  17. #517
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    Quote Originally Posted by galaxy View Post
    Mark: I have almost the identical issue as you. Let me paint the picture...

    First, our problem is isolated to AR gas auto style gun, versus bolt action. This is very important distinction.

    My conclusion was and still remains that most 300BLK manufacturers think that they can get away with using M4 mil spec feed ramps for 300. This theory basically concludes that M4 feed ramp (designed for .22 size bullets) does not work optimally for .308, especially for HP (thicker nose) bullets with 2.22"ish COAL. If the feed ramp is not optimized for larger diameter bullet, what happens is that the sheer extreme speed/force of the bolt pushes the bullet through the M4 feed ramp high into the chamber causing the cylindrical mark on the nose of the bullet. Please follow the link, and look at the 2nd last picture from the bottom of the page to visualize what I'm talking about regarding feed ramp. http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=106945

    Smoke mentioned Noveske, and I would bet his feed ramp is optimized by this competent company. I would also bet that your AR has standard M4 feed ramps, just like mine.

    Since having discovered this issue, I used a dremel to make the diameter of the feed ramps larger, and feeding issues seemed to have subsided somewhat. Not yet perfect though. I almost just want to go out and get a properly designed 300BLK upper with optimized feed ramp and chamber, so I don't feel insecure about my franken-ramp. I'm not a gunsmith, but like most of us, am pretty handy.

    Anyone else care to chime in on what type AR style feed ramp they have? Which works, which doesn't? Any suggested 300BLK uppers with 300 optimized feed ramp?

    Lastly, I purchased Miha's NLG PB and GC molds. Both are fantastic at what they were designed for. Boolits drop like magic, GC is perfectly sized, weight drops boringly unison. Couldn't really ask for more from a mold. Compared to my NOE mold, I can load these longer COAL with my current AR (8" barrel, all mil spec). Best group in PB I got was 1 1/4" at 50 yards. GC as not better, but I only tested about 40 each. One important distinction I drew was that I did not have any feed issues with Smoke's Jet Black PC with my current setup. Red jammed constantly. I had 2 out of 20 failure to feed out of my GC'd bronze powder. My unscientific conclusion is that the type of PC used could absolutely matter when it comes to feeding.

    I have not had a chance to load any up for my 6.5 inch V seven SBR yet, but I just checked the page and it states as follows: BARREL EXTENSION FEATURES TRUE 30 CAL IMPROVED, EXTENDED FEED RAMPS & MELONITE BLACK FINISH

  18. #518
    I appreciate all the help offered on this mihec 311-230-hp mold. To help with anyone else having purchased or plans to purchase this mold, I’ll explain again the issue.

    This is what I would consider a bore aligning/riding hybrid style design. If you can pass an object measuring .301 all the way through your thirty caliber of choice barrel without any restrictions, this might be the mold for you.

    If you can NOT pass a .301 diameter object (round ball, boolit, go no go pin etc) this may make your chambering difficult to impossible. As is my case. My barrel is not .300 but a bit shy at .2995 from the soft lead pound cast I made just directly in front of the lands. There is considerable interference between the boolit and bore.

    There were a total of two drawing/sales threads for this mold. I was unaware of the first until research on google led me to the first run that fell through. There was considerable information in that first thread, first page, that would have been helpful to us 300 BO guys. This information was questioned and answered about a .301 nose positioning front end band not present on most boolits. It’s not as clear in the second group buy thread, and there was no detailed drawing for the projectile.

    I have no problem feeding into, or out of the magazine. I’m having issues of chambering the projectile because my bore is .2995 and the bullet is .301. I’m using range scrap, yes unknown content, but surely softer than wheel weights, but not soft enough to make up for the .0015 +- interference.

    I have requested to return this mold to Miha, without instructions to do so. I have contacted NOE since being unable to reach Miha, to order some nose sizing equipment. I have also requested NOE to re-run the hollow point 240 ish grain mold as well.

    Here is where we come to the crux of this long rant. I appreciate all of the help you guys are giving me on my mold. I’m aware that I may need to adjust my feed ramps on my barrel extension if I choose to use the NOE 247 or 242 HP (not sure of exact weight) Al let me know right up front that some have had trouble feeding that hollow point. Well, after comparing the two end results, I’m willing to take the gamble, as Al said he wouldn’t mind doing a run of those molds again.

    The information above will help me when I decide to contour the feed ramps. My rifle will feed the 230 hollow point without any nose deformation, but I have been told there may be issues with the NOE feeding before he ever sold it to me.

    I’m going to wait on the NOE nose sizers before I make any final opinion of this group buy. But as for now it’s a sticky little bugger that needs a squeezing to get it to behave!

    Mark

  19. #519
    Boolit Master
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    I have found the NOE finicky in my (also noveske) 300 BO, so you may run into some issues there also. It is however a stupendous subsonic bullet in a 308 with a 1:10 twist.

    If I may recommend a different mold, the NOE 225 gr 311 is very easy to work with and chambers in all 300s I have tried. It is, however, not a hollowpoint mold.

  20. #520
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    Mine has arrived, perfect workmanship as usual.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check