Lee PrecisionWidenersTitan ReloadingLoad Data
RotoMetals2RepackboxPBcastcoReloading Everything
Inline Fabrication MidSouth Shooters Supply
Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 82

Thread: 54cal Lee REAL kicks like a mule!

  1. #41
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,583
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    I would use them, I only have 1 rifle that shoots them well enough for me to be confident with them. If you can hit what your aiming at they'll do the job.
    Indeed. Many people on a traditional muzzleloader forum use a ball for elk and such out to 100 yds with a .54 and a couple even with a .50 but limit their shots to a bit closer.

  2. #42
    In Remembrance
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    fairbanks
    Posts
    9,015
    I have the 54 investarms and encountered the same thing with hollow base boolits, it actually seemed liked it kicks TWICE. I figured I was leaveing an air spsce between the powder and the actual base of boolit, but didn't mess with it much trying to correct the problem, because it shot the 435 grain great plain boolits so good, there was not much room there for improvement.
    I do not blame the gun or caliber, I think the whole problem was on me.

  3. #43
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by rodwha View Post
    I was thinking about this a little more and realized that my saying that upping the powder charge wouldn’t change things much and this is true of the downrange velocity/energy figures but I hadn’t really concerned myself much with the trajectory and wind drift so I ran the ball using 100 grns which gives a velocity of 1988 fps.

    0.8”, 1.7”, 1.5”, 0.0”, and -3.2” and zeroed further it is 2.2”, 4.5”, 5.7”, 5.6”, 3.9”, 0.0”, and -6.2”

    And the wind drift is:
    0.6”, 2.2”, 5.1”, 9.5”, 15.1”, 21.8”, and 29.5”

    So we see that another 20 grns of 2F got the shorter distance figures a little more slimmed as far as bullet rise but the drop was a hair more. And out there further it still has a more pronounced rainbow. And the wind drift didn’t change significantly.
    Thanks for putting this together. Extremely helpful information. I'm heading to the range Wednesday night and will report back with results.

  4. #44
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by rodwha View Post
    Indeed. Many people on a traditional muzzleloader forum use a ball for elk and such out to 100 yds with a .54 and a couple even with a .50 but limit their shots to a bit closer.
    I honestly can't remember the last time I shot at an animal that was more than 100 yards away. Probably at least 10 years...

  5. #45
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by starmac View Post
    I have the 54 investarms and encountered the same thing with hollow base boolits, it actually seemed liked it kicks TWICE. I figured I was leaveing an air spsce between the powder and the actual base of boolit, but didn't mess with it much trying to correct the problem, because it shot the 435 grain great plain boolits so good, there was not much room there for improvement.
    I do not blame the gun or caliber, I think the whole problem was on me.
    I'm becoming more and more certain that I was flinching or letting up a little with the slight hang fires I was getting, which caused the butt to come off my shoulder a little. Didn't affect my accuracy much though. The REALs shot pretty well and I think I'll like them with a little more range time and tinkering with the load.

  6. #46
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    1,423
    Quote Originally Posted by dsayer View Post
    Seriously?! This place is incredible. Thanks to everyone for the helpful info.
    PM on the way.
    In todays mail have fun /Ed

  7. #47
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward View Post
    In todays mail have fun /Ed
    Thanks Ed! Will report back...

  8. #48
    Boolit Grand Master

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Bloomfield, Nebraska
    Posts
    6,073
    Lets see you are shooting a load that approximates a 50-95 Winchester in a 7 1/2 pound rifle and it KICKS. No LIE! In a 9 pound musket 65 grains of FFG and 500 grain Minnie was a normal load and soldiers complained that that kicked. That is the penalty for doubling the projectile weight in a gun with a poorly designed stock. The solution is either to add weight and reshape the cheekpiece or drop the powder charge. The T/C while a well made rifle was not meant to compete with a Sharps in power. I have a buddy we all call B and B, for black and blue, he insists that his load of 100 grains of FFG and a maxi ball in his 50 is the load for a real man. Not for me anyway.

  9. #49
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by KCSO View Post
    Lets see you are shooting a load that approximates a 50-95 Winchester in a 7 1/2 pound rifle and it KICKS. No LIE! In a 9 pound musket 65 grains of FFG and 500 grain Minnie was a normal load and soldiers complained that that kicked. That is the penalty for doubling the projectile weight in a gun with a poorly designed stock. The solution is either to add weight and reshape the cheekpiece or drop the powder charge. The T/C while a well made rifle was not meant to compete with a Sharps in power. I have a buddy we all call B and B, for black and blue, he insists that his load of 100 grains of FFG and a maxi ball in his 50 is the load for a real man. Not for me anyway.
    Maybe I wasn't clear in my OP because a number of folks have made comments like this. I've owned this gun for 15+ years and have shot T/C Maxi Balls (430gr), Hornady GCs (425gr), and round balls with the same 85gr powder charge of T7 and not experienced recoil like I did the other night with the 380gr REALs. That's why I posted about the recoil; why is my felt recoil higher compared to larger bullets with the same powder charge?

    I also noted that I was having ignition issues and getting slight hang fires on most shots. After some good conversations on here and with the guys at Track, I think the recoil problem is simply that I was letting up a bit after pulling the trigger and getting a bigger slap when the full charge ignited. To address my ignition issue, I'm going to experiment with wads (thanks Ed!!) and with real black powder (recommendation from Track).

  10. #50
    Boolit Master taco650's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    OR->LaGrange GA
    Posts
    1,543
    I have to agree that the recoil from real black is different than the subs. Seems to be more of a shove than a kick. If I could get real BP in my area at the store I would use it exclusively but I recently bought a can of Pyrodex RS because my old can of 3f Goex is getting low. Good luck in figuring out your situation!

  11. #51
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Update from the range this evening. These are only 25 yard groups (indoor range) from an informal rest. Edward graciously provided me with a handful of wads to test and the felt wads that I saturated with mink oil completely solved the hang fire issue. Recoil was obviously stiff but more like I had expected and experienced with other conicals in the past. I haven't ordered any BP yet so still shooting the FFG T7. Started with 75gr and the 3 shot group is so tight it looks like 2. I bumped up to 80gr, which raised my group a little but it wasn't quite as tight. Might have been me as I didn't feel great about the 3rd shot (left of bullseye) and think I yanked the trigger a bit.

    Overall, I'm pretty happy with the result and feel like I have a good starting point for longer ranges outside. Thanks again to everyone and especially Edward for shipping the wads. Guess I need to buy a punch and few yards of felt now!



    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  12. #52
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Boncarbo,Colorado
    Posts
    706
    It will be interesting to see an actual group at 50- 75 and 100 yards.

  13. #53
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by FrontierMuzzleloading View Post
    It will be interesting to see an actual group at 50- 75 and 100 yards.
    Well sure, obviously that will be the real test. However, I'm pretty stoked that I'm not getting a hang fire on half to two-thirds of my shots now with the felt wad and at least have a starting point.

    The closest public outdoor range is about an hour drive, costs $20, and has the unfortunate limitation of only allowing shooting during daytime. Oh, and it's a complete madhouse... On the other hand, I'm a member of the indoor range 5 minutes from my door, I can help my wife get our 2.5 year old son to bed before I leave, and I only have to leave her with our 2 month daughter for an hour or so.

    Plus, this was only my 3rd time shooting something I cast myself (2nd time with the REALs), so I just wanted to post a couple pics.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  14. #54
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Boncarbo,Colorado
    Posts
    706
    trust me, the felt wad does not fix hang fires. Your nipple and how well it flows, does, affect hang fires.

    i currently use pyrodex p and goex 2fg with the 250gr real and a lubed veg wad.


  15. #55
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by FrontierMuzzleloading View Post
    trust me, the felt wad does not fix hang fires. Your nipple and how well it flows, does, affect hang fires.

    i currently use pyrodex p and goex 2fg with the 250gr real and a lubed veg wad.

    Ok...

    Whether I "trust" a total stranger on a message board site or not, I'm just reporting my observations. Same gun, same batch of REALs, same nipple, same powder, same batch of CCI caps, and same range I had no hang fires last night on 10-12 shots whereas I was having them on every other shot or more last time.

    You can continue to try to rain on my parade, but I'm not losing any sleep over it. In fact, I'm quite pleased with the result and will start shooting with a felt wad on top of my powder charge from now on.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  16. #56
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Boncarbo,Colorado
    Posts
    706
    Juat giving you some advice bud. You dont want to run around saying that a wad fixed all your hang fires because then, you really might pick up a jack wagon along the way that wants to bust your chops lol. Dont be the autozone parts guy that sells you a k&n filter and tells you that you just gained 30 horse power.

  17. #57
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by FrontierMuzzleloading View Post
    Juat giving you some advice bud. You dont want to run around saying that a wad fixed all your hang fires because then, you really might pick up a jack wagon along the way that wants to bust your chops lol. Dont be the autozone parts guy that sells you a k&n filter and tells you that you just gained 30 horse power.
    Well this thread has come off the rails... Thanks for your advice.

    Could it be that some, unaccounted for variable is responsible for the change in my rifle's performance? Sure it could...

    Here's what I know:
    Last time out, REALs with no wad - hang fires
    PRBs - no hang fires
    REALs with no wad - hang fires

    Last night, addition of a wad without changing anything else eliminated the hang fires.

    I've given up on trying to explain why a muzzleloader does or does not behave a certain way. For the cost of a hollow punch set and some felt, I'll happily use a wad from now on when shooting REALs because it worked.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  18. #58
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    1,423
    Quote Originally Posted by dsayer View Post
    Well this thread has come off the rails... Thanks for your advice.

    Could it be that some, unaccounted for variable is responsible for the change in my rifle's performance? Sure it could...

    Here's what I know:
    Last time out, REALs with no wad - hang fires
    PRBs - no hang fires
    REALs with no wad - hang fires

    Last night, addition of a wad without changing anything else eliminated the hang fires.

    I've given up on trying to explain why a muzzleloader does or does not behave a certain way. For the cost of a hollow punch set and some felt, I'll happily use a wad from now on when shooting REALs because it worked.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
    Not to worry he"s not picking on you (per say) he does this to everyone ,oh and do not dare mention TC verses Traditions /or CVA or Investarms/Lyman you will get the 100 yr flood

  19. #59
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward View Post
    Not to worry he"s not picking on you (per say) he does this to everyone ,oh and do not dare mention TC verses Traditions /or CVA or Investarms/Lyman you will get the 100 yr flood
    Haha! Noted.

    Thanks again for the wads that didn't fix my problem but were strongly associated with an improvement in said problem.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  20. #60
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Boncarbo,Colorado
    Posts
    706
    Uhhh this has nothing to do with brand. Just stating that a wad does not help hang fires and anyone with muzzleloader knowledge, knows that lol. WOW!

    I use the wad simply because it helps seal the gasses a lot better and keeps the bullet flying tight.

    Also I wasnt giving you a hard time from the beginning. But now that you've turned your nose into the air. I just might have to educate you.

Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check