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Thread: Slow powders for 35 whelen

  1. #1
    Boolit Man Geppetto's Avatar
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    Slow powders for 35 whelen

    I've been doing some load development for the 35 whelen. Gun is a ruger hawkeye I rebarreled with a green mountain blank. Currently using the saeco 352, GC, powder coated.

    I started some load work up aiming for the 1800-2100 FPS range using many different powders, including BLC2, 3031, 4198, 4320, and 4350. Best result were with 4350, had a 0.7" at 50 yards, worst was BLC2, which was 1.75" at 50. That load was probably too hot and had some thump when shooting.

    Anyway, with the encouraging result of the 4350, I was thinking about trying slower powders, slowest I have are 4955 and 7977. Anyone have any experience using these or similar powders when heavies in the 35 whelen?

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    Go to GIBRASS, and try some WC 860 or WC 872.
    The solid soft lead bullet is undoubtably the best and most satisfactory expanding bullet that has ever been designed. It invariably mushrooms perfectly, and never breaks up. With the metal base that is essential for velocities of 2000 f.s. and upwards to protect the naked base, these metal-based soft lead bullets are splendid.
    John Taylor - "African Rifles and Cartridges"

    Forget everything you know about loading jacketed bullets. This is a whole new ball game!


  3. #3
    Boolit Man Geppetto's Avatar
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    Thanks, I'll check it out.

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    Boolit Master RU shooter's Avatar
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    Not the whelen but inthe 06 I used some Accurate 8700with 220 gr bullets Accurate has loading data for it with cast bullets and jacketed . Their 3100 powder 57 grs and the Lyman 358009 makes 2073 fps , 60 gr of 8700 makes a not so zippy 1663 fps( only 28.7K psi ) Those both are their maxlisted loads in the manual I have
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    Boolit Man dakota's Avatar
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    I like H4895

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    One of the things Ken Waters mentioned in Pet Loads is the preference of medium speed powders in the 35 W. He was using jacketed bullets but as casters we do well with slow powders and heavy bullets, especially for target use. You can decide what you want to do.
    [The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    When testing the NOE 360-310 FN (310gr 35 Thumper), I started loads with 48.0gr using IMR4064, IMR4350 and IMR4831. I worked these up to when I started to see any pressure signs like flattened primers or brass scraping on the base. Without looking, I believe that I could not fill the case with IMR4064, The IMR4350 just filled the case and the IMR4831 could fill and heavily compress the powder. Please, do your own testing to prevent disaster. Your bullet is only 250gr to compare with my 310gr.

    I have a 35 Whelen Green Mountain 1-14 barrel for my next build so, will be following.
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  8. #8
    Boolit Master

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    Imr 4064
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  9. #9
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    The heavy 250gr and 275 jacketed as well as cast 280 Lyman and LBT all responded well to Reloader R-15. In both accuracy and topping out near max velocity R-15 was the one powder that did it well in my Remington 700 classic.
    your millage my vary.
    Chill Wills

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    Paco Kelly has some good info here
    http://www.35cal.com/35whelen.htm

    I've tried many of his loads. Some are pretty warm. Work up.
    On slow powders of the OP. A case full of WC860 and a fed 215 primer under a 280 Gr cast is a good load. I duplexed with a little 4198 accuracy improved a little and burned very clean.
    Best accuracy for me with the 280gr cast GC was obtained with a medium charge of AA2230.

  11. #11
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    if you spend enough time in reloading manuals, you'll find Alliant Reloader 15 is worth a try. A former neighbor swore by it in the Whelen. Rx 15 gives you a choice between higher velocity or lower pressures. But he was shooting mainly jacketed bullets.

  12. #12
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    IMR 4064.....works great for any range of bullet weight
    shooting in my 98 mauser action with a 1:14 green mountain barrel
    Death to every foe and traitor and hurrah, my boys, for freedom !

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norske View Post
    if you spend enough time in reloading manuals, you'll find Alliant Reloader 15 is worth a try. A former neighbor swore by it in the Whelen. Rx 15 gives you a choice between higher velocity or lower pressures. But he was shooting mainly jacketed bullets.
    IMHO RL15 is THE Whelen powder for me! I was using 4320 & 2520. Still have a great 2520 load with a 200 Hornady. Shot near 3000 for from my 27” bbl!! Wow does it poleax a Deer!!! I always thought that same bullet @ 2500 was none better outta my ol BLR 358!!

    I have been using 4198 & 4895 under a 358009 for years @ about 2000. But since I started with PC that bullet is just too fat thru its bore rider portion.
    NRA Life member REMEMBER, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE its being paid for in BLOOD.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master

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    cw, have you thought about nose sizing that 009 either before or after the PC treatment?
    ..

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by cwlongshot View Post
    IMHO RL15 is THE Whelen powder for me! I was using 4320 & 2520. Still have a great 2520 load with a 200 Hornady. Shot near 3000 for from my 27 bbl!! Wow does it poleax a Deer!!! I always thought that same bullet @ 2500 was none better outta my ol BLR 358!!

    I have been using 4198 & 4895 under a 358009 for years @ about 2000. But since I started with PC that bullet is just too fat thru its bore rider portion.
    Place empty pistol cases over the bore riding portion and ESPC.
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    A deplorable that votes!

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beerd View Post
    cw, have you thought about nose sizing that 009 either before or after the PC treatment?
    ..
    Bought a couple dies to try that... Never saw a bullet so stuck.

    Nope didnt work.

    Spoke with Al for a spell. We decided it was not a serious option.

    CW
    NRA Life member REMEMBER, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE its being paid for in BLOOD.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master

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    I have good luck on sizing down the noses on my 358009 FN using the NOE nose sizing bushings..
    Both before PC and after..
    But I had to flair the entrance to the bushing with my dremel otherwise it would just peel the lead off the nose and make it a pita cut the ring of lead off at the nose body junction..
    Odd that the regular NOE push thru dies had the proper flair and the nose size push thru dies didn't..





  18. #18
    Boolit Man Geppetto's Avatar
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    Turned into a great thread, lots to look at here. The 250 saeco bullet really seems to be a nice one, so far I've had good luck shooting it. Will be trying to test terminal performance. Wouldn't mind a little more meplat but if it's accurate, I won't complain. Looking forward to the opportunity to take it out for black bear next year.

  19. #19
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    This is my MOE 360-280

    I cannot size its nose down. The NOE nose sizer won't do it.

    CW
    NRA Life member REMEMBER, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE its being paid for in BLOOD.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by cwlongshot View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    This is my MOE 360-280

    I cannot size its nose down. The NOE nose sizer won't do it.

    CW
    What is the nose dia. when it comes out of your mold?
    What is the bore dia. just ahead of your throat?





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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check