RotoMetals2ADvertise hereRepackboxInline Fabrication
Lee PrecisionMidSouth Shooters SupplyWidenersTitan Reloading

Page 3 of 20 FirstFirst 12345678910111213 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 396

Thread: 7.62x51 NATO (.308 WCF) in the Springfield M1A

  1. #41
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537
    The first-round flyers were nagging at me, so I did a quick test with dacron fill to see what might happen.

    I loaded ten rounds each of 36, 37, 38, 39, and 40 grains of IMR4350, still using the 311466 bullet as before, and each round had a small dacron tuft added. There's not much room in a .308 case when forty grains of bulky powder is installed, but I wanted to try dacron just in case there was enough powder movement to make a difference. These same charges WITHOUT dacron were among those which gave the first-round-flyer results in the previous shooting.

    Another possible factor (I thought) might just be all the crud, sludge and corruption which had built up in the action over the previous hundreds of rounds, and which just possibly could be making the bolt lockup slightly different when closing from the hold-open catch instead of rebounding off the back of the receiver. These latest loads were fired from the CLEAN rifle, as described in my last post. Functioning was flawless, if I have to say it.

    Nope!

    The groups stayed just about the same as they were without dacron, and the first-round flyers are still evident. In a way, this is a bit of a relief, since I really wasn't looking forward to using dacron in each of the hundreds of rounds I expect to be loading when a final load is determined.

    Back to the drawing board. I'll try another bullet design in the next attempt, I do believe.
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  2. #42
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    8,099
    Bruce,

    Try this and let me know what it does. Single shoot the rounds. That is single load them, not fire a magazine full. I suspect that when an action is hand operated on the first round that something is different then when the rifle functions itself.

    Joe

  3. #43
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    862
    Bruce, since you are not cleaning the rifle between groups, just what is different about those first rounds that is causing flyers? If you always get them, it has to be something that happens every time, but it obviously isn't the difference in powder charge or it would apply to every round fired with the new charge. Are you pausing for cool-down between groups, but not within groups? If so, this could be a barrel-temperature thing perhaps.

    Your description just doesn't say what is different when you start a new group, compared with all of the other shots you are firing - but if there is a distinctive difference in the results then something clearly is different, you just haven't yet stated what it is.

    Geoff

  4. #44
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    862
    Quote Originally Posted by StarMetal
    Bruce,

    Try this and let me know what it does. Single shoot the rounds. That is single load them, not fire a magazine full. I suspect that when an action is hand operated on the first round that something is different then when the rifle functions itself.

    Joe
    Sorry Joe, I guess the replication time to Australia caught me out here - I didn't need to post, since you had already said pretty much the same thing.


    Geoff

  5. #45
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537

    Change of emphasis

    Reviewing where I've been with this rifle and its ammunition, it occurred to me that perhaps the quicker-burning end of the chart needed some more attention. 4198, for instance, was giving a few positive hints along the way.

    Going back in my records with other calibers of roughly-similar volume, I found some indicators that XMP5744 might be worth a trial. I KNOW it works very well with cast boolits in such as the .30-40 and .303, but....would it function in a gas-operated autoloader???

    Using both 311466 (150 grains) and 311467 (170 grains) I loaded a series of test recipes with 22, 23, 24, 25, and 26 grains of 5744. That is, ten rounds of each charge weight were loaded under BOTH bullets, for a total of 100 rounds. What really made this simple was that the boolits are the same shape and seated to the same overall length, meaning no die adjustments were needed during the process.

    Bullets are straight WW, sized .311", water-dropped from the mould and lubed with Felix stuff. Brass is LC88 military, primers CCI #34.

    311466 (150 grains):

    22.0 5744: 1821 average, 56 extreme spread, 16 std deviation, 2.4"/10 rds/50 yards. The rifle worked s-l-o-w-l-y.....but it did work, going "schlunk...schlunk" as it functioned. It even locked open after the last round. Recoil was comically light. Note that the velocity is fairly high for a starting load, while port pressure was obviously quite low due to the quick burning-rate of the 5744.

    23.0 5744: 1933 av, 38 es, 14 sd. 2.6"/10/50...but 8 in 1.0"!

    24.0 5744: 1996 av, 38 es, 12 sd. 1.2"/10/50

    25.0 5744: 2070 av, 45 es, 12 sd. 1.4"/10/50, but nine rounds in 0.9"!!

    26.0 5744: 2126 av, 41 es, 13 sd. This is where the 466 got unhappy, and the group was fully 3" for 10 rounds, with all shots called "good".


    311467 (170 grains):

    22.0 5744: 1796 av, 41 es, 11 sd. 2.4"/10/50

    23.0 5744: 1899 av, 46 es, 14 sd. 2.4"/10/50

    24.0 5744: 1945 av, 27 es, 8 sd. 1.8"/10/50

    25.0 5744: 2011 av, 66 es, 19 sd. 2.2"/10/50

    26.0 5744: 2062 av, 30 es, 9 sd. 2.0"/9/50, and a first-round flyer an inch further out.

    Pressures were my main concern in working-up with this relatively-fast powder. It was easy to see the differences in primer contours as pressure went up, and also the ejection pattern changed along with the increasing charges. The gasport pressure never did get to "factory" level, judging by the fall of the cases. However, chamber pressure was certainly healthy at the top of the series. Even so, the primers NEVER came anywhere close to flattening as much as they do with a match-standard load with 168 Matchkings at 2600 fps. My ease in confidently "reading primers" is an advantage arising from the fact that I have never, ever, used a primer other than the #34 in this rifle, from the day I got it, or brass other than my original batch of unfired LC88.

    Once the charge got into the 24-grain area, the functioning was very positive and clearly the ammo had plenty of oomph for a reserve of functioning "power".

    The rifle shows a definite preference for the 466 over the 467 boolit. I didn't encounter much in the way of tipping or yawing indications, which were quite evident with 467 and H4831 powder in earlier testing.

    I'm glad I tried 5744. It's certainly not an obvious candidate for gas-operated rifles, but it surely works well in this one! Next, I'll try a couple other bullet designs in the same weight range with 5744 and see what jumps out of the bushes. Note that the first-round flyer idiosyncracy was almost non-existent, too.

    I love going to the range with an experimental purpose in mind!
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  6. #46
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537
    Sorry for omitting this, because I really appreciate all consultations.

    The first-round flyer has been bothersome in quite a few loads. Somewhere back in this long thread, I related how I tried just such an experiment as you gents are recommending. I used only a single round in the magazine, and manually chambered that round for firing....repeated ten times, so that each round was equivalent to a first round from a full magazine.

    Nothing earthshaking was evident in the results.

    I REALLY want to have a load that puts the first one (the IMPORTANT one!) right in the middle of where the following boolits will land. A couple of times today, I had the first three or four bullets literally cutting into the same large-ish hole, and that was sure sweet to see. It makes me think that perhaps I do not have a bedding problem or other such woes.

    Man alive, I can hardly wait to get back out with another bunch of test ammo.....not before Sunday, unfortunately, or even Monday if my weary butt is dragging too badly after night shift on Sunday morning.
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  7. #47
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537

    More Combos With 5744

    Having recently achieved some limited success with 5744 in the M1A, I turned to some different boolit designs with the same powder. The ones fired today were 311291 (170 RN) 311413 (170 spirepoint) 311672 (167 semi-pointed, small flat meplat) and SAECO #305 (180 flatpoint...much liike 311041). All were water-dropped WW sized .311, with Felix lube and Hornady gaschecks.

    All the above designs were loaded in batches of ten rounds, with charges of 23, 24, 25 and 26 grains of XMP 5744. Some of these were so bad that I didn't finish shooting all the increments. If I don't report the "group" for any combo, rest assured that you do NOT want to know!

    311413:

    23.0 5744: 1890 av, 48 es, 15 sd

    24.0 5744: 1951 av, 45 es, 14 sd

    25.0 5744: 2018 av, 49 es, 17 sd

    26.0 5744: 2113 av, 79 es, 25 sd


    311291:

    23.0 5744: 1903 av, 48 es, 15 sd

    24.0 5744: 1966 av, 43 es, 18 sd

    DNF 25.0 and 26.0 loads....it was that bad!


    311672:

    23.0 5744: 1910 av, 32 es, 9 sd

    24.0 5744: 1944 av, 20 es, 9 sd

    DNF 25.0 and 26.0 loads....


    SAECO #305

    .... Thank Heaven SOMETHING worked today; I wuz getting bummed-out:

    23.0 5744: 1905 av, 51 es, 14 sd, 1.2"/10rds/50yards, and 8 rounds in 1.0"

    24.0 5744: 1969 av, 45 es, 14 sd, 0.8"/8/50 with two rounds called out (dang it).

    25.0 5744: 2042 av, 36 es, 10 sd, 1.6"/10/50. Not impressive, but good compared to some of the earler "groups" today!

    26.0 5744: 2109 av, 42 es, 13 sd....scattered group of about 2.5".

    The rifle worked perfectly...yeah, I know it's boring but I still enjoy saying it.

    Went out very early to avoid the 100-plus heat forecast for later on. After stopping for gas, drinkables, and ice for rifle barrels and drinks, I fired the first round about 0730.

    Right now it appears that SAECO #305 and 311466 willl get more attention with 5744. The others? They'll keep until I exhaust my present plans for 5744, and then I think maybe I might cautiously try Re-7. We'll see.
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  8. #48
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537
    Went shooting this morning, starting at about 0715 to beat the worst of the heat.

    130 rounds of 7.62 NATO were fired, but I have to confess that I am AMAZED at the make-up of those cartridges, or at least, the fact that they functioned in an autoloading battle rifle.

    If someone had told me, before I started tilting at this particular windmill, that powders I normally consider to be mostly PISTOL powders would work rather well in my M1A, I likely would have laughed at the idea. Not now!

    As mentioned in my last post, I did select some loads for REloder-7 for trials. Then, taking a hard look at several burning-rate charts and some personal back records as well, I decided to try a series with IMR 4227, too.

    With Lyman's latest Handbook (not the CB handbook) to guide me on RE-7, I had no worries at all as to load levels. My stair-step series ended five grains below Lyman's max load with 311466. 4227 needed considerably more thought, and where I was comfy with 2-grain steps with RE-7, I took the precaution of using one-grain increments with 4227 in deference to its rather more "sudden" personality.

    I seem to be having considerable success forecasting starting and ending points for my loads in this rifle. Today's powders were just at the ragged edge of functioning the rifle with the starting loads, and at the upper end of the series they were right at the point I'd say "enough". I'm no hot-rodder, and the pressures were certainly getting brisk in the CHAMBER...not at the gasport.

    Note that when chamber pressures are up into normal working ranges for the cartridge, but gasport pressures are still low, we have a pretty neat combination. This is because the powder is burning well in its normal range, and yet the action is NOT being "over-driven", with such things as bent rims from extraction or burred rims from hard ejections, or excessively-hard bolt impacts with the back of the receiver, etc.

    Nothing much jumped out in the accuracy department, but it does seem that 311466 is happier in this application than SAECO 305. With the quicker powders, 466 also continued to group (sort of) at higher speeds than it has with slower fuels.

    So: LC88 brass, CCI #34 primers.

    311466, water-dropped ww alloy, .311", Felix lube:


    Reloder-7:

    24.0 grains: 1856 average, 22 extreme spread, 9 std deviation, 1.8"/10 rds/50yds
    The rifle functioned well with this load and all other RE-7 loads

    26.0 grains: 2083 av, 38 es, 12 sd, 2.0"/10/50.....six rounds in a very tight cluster

    28.0 grains: 2174 av, 60 es, 18 sd, 2.5"/10/50...some boolits showing some tipping

    30.0 grains: 2288 av, 60 es, 17 sd, 3.2"/10/50...clearly past 466's "happy zone" and pressures were getting up there. Primers still weren't as flat as in my Matchking loads, though.


    311466, IMR 4227

    22.0 grains: 1934 av, 26 es, 7 sd, 1.9"/10/50. Rifle ejecting but NOT feeding.

    23.0 grains: 1983 av, 48 es, 14 sd, 2.0"/10/50, rifle feeding most rounds but short-stroking about 3 times. Locked open on last round.

    24.0 grains: 2052 av, 45 es, 14 sd, 1.5"/10/50, perfect function.

    25.0 grains: 2100 av, 46 es, 11 sd, 1.4"/10/50

    26.0 grains: 2176 av, 35 es, 10 sd, 3.2"/10/50, 1st-round flyer. Again, 466 moves out of the preferred speed range.


    SAECO #305, same specs as 311466 above.

    RE-7 LOADS:

    24.0 grains: 1949 av, 27 es, 8 sd, 1.8:/10/50. Rifle functioning slowly but reliably.

    26.0 grains: 2031 av, 82 es, 28 sd, 1.9"/10/50

    28.0 grains: 2143 av, 43 es, 14 sd, 2.5"/10/50

    30.0 grains: 2222 av, 26 es, 9 sd, very poor group, scattered to 3.5" and the first round 3" above anything else.

    There were some interesting clusters in a few groups, which warrant some attention and re-trying..

    Also, it so happens that when testing some RE-7 loads in my .303 #4, the mere addition of a tiny bit of dacron took the group from FOUR INCHES at 50 yards to barely an inch, with no other changes. I think I'll re-fire the RE-7 series using dacron the next time. Might's well do the same with 4227, too, as long as I'm at it.
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  9. #49
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537

    "Dacron Day"

    Hied meself forth in the early sunlight this morning, armed with 150 rounds of 7.62 which ALL contained a bit of dacron.

    Not much appeared to result from the inclusion of the fuzzy stuff. One puzzling thing was that the same 4227 loads which functioned the rifle just fine a day or so back, now refused to feed reliably with loads which were identical except for the dacron. By this, I mean that on many rounds, the bolt closed on the empty chamber, having failed to come back far enough to pick up the next round. It was sorta like "ball and dummy" training, and I was happy to see that my trigger control was pretty good and the sights did not move when the big "click" happened...

    I took along loads with 311466 ( the 150 Loverin), 311467 (170 Loverin), SAECO #305 (170 RN flat-tip), a couple recipes with 311672 and 4227, and even five rounds with 311299 loaded over 4227, and sized at .314".

    Within this 150 rounds was a trial run using .3095" sizing instead of the .311+ I've used since Day One. Compared with two otherwise-identical .311" loads with RE-7, the .3095 boolits did not display any difference in performance or grouping. All the RE-7 loads did function normally, incidentally, unlike the 4227 loads.

    Today I was seeing the sights VERY well, in comparison to some other sessions lately. I just wish I knew why, so I could duplicate the condition! This eagle-eyeball did not help most of the groups, but I did isolate a couple of loads for further work. The addition of two grains of powder (26.0 RE-7 vs 28.0 grains) turned the target results from a one-inch group of ten 311467s into a four-inch sprawl.

    Naturally, I'll be going back to try more loads with this combo, around the 23-to-27-grain levels.

    The rifle has now fired about 3000 rounds, and apart from about 400 168 Matchkings (for break-in, although I do NOT follow the shoot-one-clean-shoot-one-clean etc etc rigamarole) all have been cast boolits. The bore has been cleaned exactly once, after the jacketed loads were fired. I've cleaned the chamber a few times but left the bore untouched, as it was brilliantly shiny every time I checked. It may be time to clean it and re-visit the jacketed (Matchking) loads again, just to see how current results compare to the early trials. Since the first-round flyers were evident a few times today, I'll be interested to see if the service-level 168 Matchkings (around 2600 fps) also display this phenomenon.

    I'm instructing at work tomorrow, but Tuesday should find me looking for more answers at the range. My 8-day "weekend" got neatly bisected by this one day as teacher!
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  10. #50
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537
    As mentioned in the last installment, I loaded fifty rounds with the 170-grain 311467 and RE-7, in loads running through 22.0 grains (with and without dacron), 23.0 (with and without dacron) and 24.0 grains without dacron.

    Not much in the way of accuracy was achieved, and the 24.0 load sans dacron was AWFUL.

    Intending to do a jacketed-bullet test, I'd loaded a couple of hundred Matchkings the night before, as well. Being both (a) lazy and (b) curious, I decided to just go ahead and fire the condom loads without cleaning the rifle's bore. Turns out that it didn't matter. Three consecutive 10-round groups all went just under 0.80 inches from 50 yards. The only possible indication that cast-boolit fouling MIGHT have had some limited effect was that the first string showed a slightly higher extreme spread in speed than did the second and third strings:

    Sierra 168 Matchking, 41.0 H4895:

    String #1: 2630 average, 72 extreme spread, 19 std deviation

    #2: 2650 av, 64 es, 19 sd

    #3: 2644 av, 22 es, 6 sd.

    311467:

    22.0 RE-7, NO dacron: 1718 av, 91 es, 32 sd...1st round 4" high, 2nd round 2" low from center of the loose "group" of eight.

    22.0 RE-7 WITH dacron: 1783 av, 51 es, 17 sd

    23.0 RE-7, NO dacron: 1786 av, 43 es, 16 sd.

    23.0 RE-7 WITH dacron: 1852 av, 31 es, 9 sd. This grouped worse than the no-dacron 23.0 load.

    24.0 RE-7, NO dacron: 1848 av, 33 es, 10 sd, and this one was the worst of all.

    All in all, not much of a red-letter day for my cast loads.

    This day's shooting pretty well rules out any flaw in the rifle itself, as far as those first-round flyers are concerned. The first two jacketed bullets literally cut the same hole, and the following eight rounds just enlarged it. Chambering of the first round was accomplished exactly the same way as I do with the cast loads. I had a refreshing change from all the 50-yard shooting I've been doing, and gave myself and the rifle a workout on rocks and bunchgrass out to around 300 yards or so. This served both of us well, reminding us that a good rifle can reach waaaaay out there with considerable confidence. Fun!

    SOMETHING is going on here that I have yet to identify. The search continues.
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  11. #51
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    61

    Thanks

    BruceB,
    Thanks for this report. I'll be getting an M1A (finally) and am very interested in light loads and CBs. Can you comment further on the condition of the gas tube and piston. I'm curious if you're getting any lead plating in the tube or on the piston. My M1A will be used. It isn't a "loaded" one but just the standard plane jane version. However it doesn't have a GI barrel (4 groove 1-12 twist, chrome lined) but has a regular non chromed CM barrel, but at 1-11.25" twist. Any thoughts?
    Have you considered trying either the Lee C312-155-2R or the RCBS 30-165-SIL in the 308? I'd like to find a CB load that does several things besides group well.
    a. function the action reliably but softly.
    b. when seated to load in magazine and not jam into lands, has bullet base wholly in neck (though at the bottom I'd guess) and yet doesn't have exposed lube grooves to pick up lint, dirt, etc.
    c. Have enough MV to make hitting at 100 to 200 yards reasonable with out major elevation changes.
    d. non leading of course.
    e. reliable magazine feeding.

    So thanks for the data so far. It'll be a couple of weeks before I can get mine. In the meantime if you find a miracle load, please let me know.
    Thanks,
    Brian
    Arizona.

  12. #52
    Boolit Master robertbank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Terrace, B.C. Canada
    Posts
    4,730
    I have died and gone to heaven - damn I love this site!

    Take Care

    Bob
    [SIZE=3][COLOR=#ff0000]Je suis Charlie

    "If the human population held hands around the equator, a significant portion of them would drown"

  13. #53
    Boolit Master robertbank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Terrace, B.C. Canada
    Posts
    4,730
    BruceB - been working on my loads for my M 14. Trying to get WC735 to work. (About 10% faster than H335). Been getting high ES with SD in the low 20's. What has been you rexperience with H335 beyond what you have reported here. I am kind of stuck with 311291 and 311041 boolits for this gun and have yet to try the 311041 boolits. I may be wrong but this surplus powder seems to do better in the 30-30 and smaller cases. Thoughts?

    Take Care

    Bob

    ps We have had temperatures in th elow 30's at the range this past week. Kind of one week of Nevada year round. Gotta find a place down there in the low rent district to sit out the winters.
    [SIZE=3][COLOR=#ff0000]Je suis Charlie

    "If the human population held hands around the equator, a significant portion of them would drown"

  14. #54
    Boolit Bub rigmarol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    57
    Bruce,
    Thanks for pointing me here from the handloaders forum this morning. I've read your "Journal of Discovery" and it reads quite nicely. You've done a fine job of documentation. I've had my M1A for over 2 weeks now and it's driving me nuts not to shoot it! The heat here in California has been way up there so the range even early in the morning is just too hot.

    Thanks again for the info.
    There is no problem too big that more time and more money can't solve.

  15. #55
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Alberta Canada
    Posts
    1,126
    BruceB, thankyou for all of this research, it is very valuble. I believe you are using Lake City brass. Can you make a few comments on your case life, resizing methods (ie; full length, partial, neck, small base ) , loading methods etc.

    It is nice to see you using 10 shot groups.

  16. #56
    On Heaven's Range

    BruceB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    3,537

    Case Sizing In The M1a (and Garand)

    Qasi, you raise a very important point, and one which I don't believe was really addressed in the course of this trek with the M1A.

    I believe it is CRITICALLY important in M1/M1A rifles from the safety standpoint, that all cases are full-length sized. All other concerns (such as accuracy) are decidedly secondary to the proper sizing of brass for these rifles.

    The reason lies in the design of the firing mechanisms. The firing pins in both rifles are of free-floating design, meaning they are unrestrained by springs or any other mechanical means. A glance at a round which has been chambered semi-automatically, but NOT fired, will show a dimple in the unfired primer. The dimple is caused by the firing pin exerting its inertia on the primer after forward motion of the bolt has ended.

    Failure of partly-resized cases to chamber FREELY can lead to firing pin impacts with the case partly OUTSIDE the chamber and with the bolt unlocked. There have been enough partly-open-bolt slamfires in the rifle type to warrant serious concern in this matter. They are generally disastrous.

    One more safety concern: due to the above condition of the firing pin impacting the primers, single loading can INCREASE the risk. If a single round is chambered by hand, and then the bolt is allowed to slam forward from its rear-most locked-open position, the bolt is traveling FASTER than it does in semi-auto firing. The effort expended in stripping a round from magazine or clip slows the bolt's speed considerably, and thus decreases the force of the firing pin's impact on the primer. SO, when single-loading an M1/M1A, allow the bolt to move forward under hand control to about half-way along its travel, and then release it. There will still be ample energy to lock the action closed on the round, and the possibility of a slam-fire is greatly reduced.

    My primers for M1A/M1 are CCI#34, a magnum-strength 'military' primer. I have no plans to change. However, I used standard CCI#200s in my M1s, M1As, and M-14s in Canada for years, without difficulty. I would NOT consider using any pistol primer in these rifles, preferring to remain on the safe side.

    So, to your question about my sizing routine: My "normal" routine right now calls for full-length sizing in an RCBS small-base .308 die. However, loading under some time pressure before the Nevada Cast Bullet Shoot last month, I managed to tear the rim off a case in my small-base die. Due to lack of time, I simply substituted my standard .308 sizer (non-small-base) and continued the run. No problems resulted, which was expected since I'd loaded thousands of rounds for earlier M-14s in Canada with the same die. Do I recommend the small-base die? YES, just for a bit more certainty and peace of mind.

    A change is in the works, though. I now have an RCBS X-die (available in small-base configuration), which limits case-length growth to a very large degree. (Search for Larry Gibson's wonderful discussion of this die for M1A ammo.) The use of the X-die has been delayed while I rebuild the vertical column of my Unimat, to get enough clearance for an also-new Forster drill-press-mounted case trimmer. I want NOTHING to do with hand-trimming a thousand 7.62 cases!

    Yep, my brass WAS unfired LC 7.62 NATO from GI Brass, but it sure's heck isn't "unfired" now! Cast-bullet pressures are apparently so low and so easy on the brass, that I have yet to discard even ONE case due to "wearing it out".

    I use an L.E. Wilson .308 case gauge to check every single loaded round. I view this as an essential safety check for any semi-auto ammo I load, in any caliber. If a round fails to "chamber" easily in the gauge, I FIND OUT WHY....usually it's just a burr on the case rim from ejection or extraction, and the burr is easily removed with a needle file. However, if the round still doesn't enter the gauge freely, I turf it. No messing around, just get rid of it.

    The gauge offers an easy way both to set the sizing die (size until the case seats flush with the rear face of the gauge) and also to check case length, because ANY protrusion of the case mouth beyond the front of the gauge indicates an over-length case. I have not had that problem yet, with at least three or four firings of all my brass with cast-bullet loads.

    GET THE GAUGE, AND USE IT RELIGIOUSLY!!!!! It's about the best $20 we can spend, for insurance and confidence value.

    I trust this answers your questions. Thanks for raising the subject, because it needed some airing.
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  17. #57
    Boolit Master robertbank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Terrace, B.C. Canada
    Posts
    4,730

    BruceB

    Your last post here probably saved me a "surprise" I didn't need. Someone once said "ignorance is bliss" - he wasn't a reloader!

    Thanks again for this and your earlier comments this morning.

    Take Care

    Bob
    [SIZE=3][COLOR=#ff0000]Je suis Charlie

    "If the human population held hands around the equator, a significant portion of them would drown"

  18. #58
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Alberta Canada
    Posts
    1,126
    this thread needs to be "stickyed"

  19. #59
    Cast Boolits Founder/B.O.B.

    45nut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Orygun
    Posts
    4,672
    Quote Originally Posted by quasi View Post
    this thread needs to be "stickyed"
    Agreed,,and done.
    Boolits= as God laid it into the soil,,grand old Galena,the Silver Stream graciously hand poured into molds for our consumption.

    Bullets= Machine made utilizing Full Length Gas Checks as to provide projectiles for the masses.

    http://www.cafepress.com/castboolits

    castboolits@gmail.com

  20. #60
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Alberta Canada
    Posts
    1,126
    thankyou 45 nut. This is the best shooting based forum on the internet, in my opinion. There is quality discussion, instruction, experimentation, and story-telling without the sniping and imaturity most other forums have.

Page 3 of 20 FirstFirst 12345678910111213 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check