7.62x51 NATO (.308 WCF) in the Springfield M1A

[10mmShooter]

fixit156 to seat my lead NOE 155g FN-GC bullets, I use a standard RCBS seating die...but swapped out the regular seater plug for the RCBS 165-SIL seat plug(which has a flat nose profile very close to the NOE FN I cast...back a few post prior to this one)

[fixit156]

Thanks 10mmShooter

[LowPE]

Greetings,
I was hoping somebody had a good recipe for 311291 using Varget, IMR4895, Unique and #2400 for the SA M1A. I've read through the entire thread and althought some of these powders were used to different degrees of results, none of these were used with the 311291 (170 gr round nose). Thanks

I have used 22.5 grains of 2400 with that weight boolit with quite good results. My go to boolit is however Saeco 315 for the M1a.

[HABCAN]

I'll pass on the tip some kind person on this site gave me: fill your seater stem with hot-glue and press your boolit nose into it. Voila! And you can always easily remove the glue plug if.........!

[gvanzeggelaar]

Well I have had some luck with IMR 4198 with a Lino 311299 @ 50 yards

24gr - Cycled, did not lock back on last round. 1" group
25gr - Full function 3/4" group
26gr - Full function 1/2" group

I waited about 30 seconds between each shot. I used regular commercial brass and no filler.

[deces]

Hey Guys,

Well here as some of my mock up rounds I used these for function testing in my M1A cartridges are 2.600-2.605 in overall length as I mentioned in my previous post they weigh in at 160-161. I loaded them up in a mag and cycled them through the weapon to confirm they are dimensionally sound I was a little concerned that with LC brass my loaded rounds are .340 at the neck with the .311 size bullet which is correct for brass thats .0145 thick, I also ran them though my taper crimp die just to make sure the necks were uniform and make sure there was no bell left in brass from expanding the neck with my Lyman M die. I verified that the bullets are still snug in the neck no set back at all after chambering from a magizne(honestly they appear snugger than my 168SMK when I seat them, I think the lead my actually grab a bit tighter, than the copper jacketed 168SMKs. Im going to load up about 12 grains of Green Dot and fire them at roughly 1500fps and cycle the bolt manually just to confirm everything is good, want to make sure I have no leading at the lower velocity.

If everything checks out, I'll move up to the a real load of IMR 4895 at 28 grains and see if she cycles, otherwise I'll go to 29 grain. I really hope to I dont have to go to 30grs to get it to cycle because I'll be likely at nearly 1900 fps at that point. Oh yeah I plan to use no filler at this point. Im only going to be shooting at 150 yrds.

any pointers would be helpful...I would like know what charge weight of IMR4895 you guys are using for lead rounds??? to get proper cycling(currently I need stick with IMR 4895)

I laid them on the scanner to scan thats why the look a little funny.

Attachment 62021

The http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product...roducts_id=255 sounds good by your description, but have you tested this boolit for results? I still can not decide what would be a good moulds to get for plinking 150ish gr. and another for hunting 175ish gr. with a 1-10 twist barrel?

[avball]

What is the maximum accurate range for these boolits? Is it conceivable to shoot NRA highpower across the course with cast, or would shooting reduced 200 yards be a more realistic goal? Even a bit more off topic, what about an AR-15?

[BruceB]

It would be more practical to expect decent results on the reduced-range matches, I think.

The longest range I tried was just over 400 yards on a 12"x 16" steel plate, with 100% hits at that range.

It would be a worthwhile project for someone, having found a good load for closer-range, to see how well that load stands up at long range. It would be foolish in the extreme to use a cast load which is inferior in accuracy to the jacketed match loads. That would amount to giving the match away.

There is a HUGE amount of information here on using cast bullets in the AR-15. Do a search.

[iwottopq]

Hello to all.
Someone have used the Lovex S-060-02 in the M1A or M14 with 160 or 200 grs cast boolits???
Thanks in advance.
Ciao
Nino

[filthygovmploye]

not really sure what you are asking nino, but my buddy at work turned me onto this site: castpics.net type 308 win inot the search box. it goes up to 195 gr on some lyman, but not up to 200 like lee does

[iwottopq]

Hello to all.
Thanks filthygovmploye for your help and sorry for my bad english, it isnt my language.
Ciao
Nino

[ammohead]

I finally took the plunge and loaded up ten NOE 311466 boolits this weekend. It was not a very scientific effort, but came out rewarding for a first effort. I used 23.5 gr of reloader 7,WLR primers and LC brass. I seated to 2.780" with the slightest of crimp so as not to crush the shoulder. I got no stuck boolits that I am aware of, but didn't go looking for them either.

I put eight on paper at 50 yds with 6 ending up in a nice round 1.6ish" group with two just high and left close to each other but not the rest. Opened the group up to just under 3". The other two I shot at a couple of 200 yard 8" swinging plates. I missed on the first shot and knocked the plate free on the second. Off the bench, Springfield issue sights and my rapidly aging eyes. I put a 4 power weaver on the old girl last night because this shows promise and deserves a proper wringing out.

The load was stout enough to work the action to the point of ejecting the fired case. But it didn't have enough dodo to pick up the next round. All the cases ended up just in front of the bench, a little to the right.

Mr B, thank you for the headstart as well as some of the other posters info. I hope Reno is suiting you well and hope to find an excuse to run into you soon.

ammohead

[BruceB]

These are very promising results for the first "go". Far better to have a load that's a tad too light, as opposed to some hellbinder that leads everything or wrecks brass. My smallest group came with the 180-grain 311467 and H4831, of all things... 0.60" for TEN rounds at 50 yards.

So... you mounted a scope? It is to wince.... I've tried several M1As with scopes, and I just CAN'T get comfortable with the idea. It certainly helps with the accuracy and load development, but all my shooting in this campaign was with the issue iron sights..."like God and Springfield intended". Nice rifles, aren't they?

I won't be living in Reno for some time yet, but after the financial side gets organized and a suitable apartment is located, I'll be ensconced in my new digs and happy to have company.

It's going to be a major lifestyle change, for sure, especially having to cook for myself. Visitors will be encouraged to stop by KFC or In-And-Out en route to my "house".

I'm glad to see you wringing-out that rifle with cast loads.

[ammohead]

Dug out my scribble sheet from the load above. I only chronoed 6 of the 10 shots ( I told you it wasn't very scientific). They averaged 1869.3333 with an extreme spread of 11. Tonight I sat at the bench and loaded 10 each of 24.0, 24.5, 25.0, and 25.5 gr of RL-7. Going to Ely this weekend to photograph the aspens turning color so probably won't happen real soon.

[Mark-II]

I should have checked here before loading with 2400, as I stopped at 19 grains. The groups were opening up, though, and the action didn't cycle completely, so I wrote it off as being, perhaps, too fast a powder.

I had encouraging results with RL7. I'm working with the RCBS 165-sil, sized to .311 (the sizer barely touches it, though, so it's probably more like .310) cast of No2 alloy, seated clear of the lands. 26 grains gave me about an inch group at 60m with one shot out of 5 nowhere to be found. 27 grains was rubbish, or maybe it was just me. 28 grains was magic with all 5 shots under 2 inches, which is better than I do with the Matchking-and-4895 load.

This is the Norinco M-305 full length rifle.

I'm going to play with H335 next, since I have a few pounds of it, and maybe some 5744 and 4895. Don't really want to like 5744, however, since its a marginally available, bloody expensive powder where I'm at.

[Wayne S]

The http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product...roducts_id=255 sounds good by your description, but have you tested this boolit for results? I still can not decide what would be a good moulds to get for plinking 150ish gr. and another for hunting 175ish gr. with a 1-10 twist barrel?

Deces, My results with the NOE 30-155 weren't nearly as good as with the NOE 311299. My M1A is the same "loaded"model as Bruce B used, SAI lists the twist as 1-11. Mine is equipped with a 6 x 24 Vortex scope to element some of the problems with very old eyes.
As to having two molds, my results show the heavier [200 gn.] use less powder to fully function even on plinking loads, and would probably prove to be a better hunting bullet, I said probably because I no longer hunt.

[Slow Elk 45/70]

Great subject with lots of info and field testing. I say sticky also. Thanks to all who have taken time to contribute

[Mark-II]

I did a bit of work on my rifle. I replaced the rubbish Chinese flash hider and front sight with an SA part and match front blade. I also added another shim to the gas system, making it hammer tight. Cleaned and greased - plenty of carbon removed with the 15 and P drills but no hint of lead anywhere (despite a gunsmith telling me I'd blow up the gun shooting cast in it).

Anyway. The usual RCBS 165-sil, crimped in front of the first driving band, loaded into IVI brass, #34 primers and bullets only visually inspected for obvious minor casting defects - I'm not going for scientific. I just want an accurate plinker.

Retested 26-28 grains RL7. Shooting at 65m, -6 Celsius, no wind. 26 grains held to about an inch and a half for 4, vertical string, with the 5th an inch and a half to the left. 27 grains gave me 4 holes strung in an inch, almost touching, and a 5th an inch to the side. Groups began to open with 28grains.

I'm going to load up a bunch at 26.5 next and check for consistency.

[splotch]

I have been thinking about the shooters who think that cast could ruin a M1 or M14 - While I personally don't believe that cast bullets wont hurt the rifles - It got me to thinking about impulse - I know that the port pressures and such are not as great with cast but could the impulse force be greater - Impulse being = Force avg * the change of time which is also = mass * change of velocity . In other words could the average impact force be greater with cast bullets or some how different enough to cause a problem? Since I don't know the velocity of the gasses or their mass I can only speculate. Does slower burning or faster burning powders have different velocities when ignited? I know there is a lot of talk about velocities of different powders (i.e. slow burning or fast) having different affects on bullet upset and case blow by. Any body familiar with the Physics of the problem?

[samwithacolt]

Just want to express my thanks to all you guys for your input. I've been lurking on this thread and finally fired ten rounds through my Norinco M305 today.
I have a Lee .312 165 mold, which is the most versatile mold I have. It works great for my SKS and in my wife's .30-30(sized to .309)
I sized and GC'd some boolits at .311 and sat them on 25 gr of Rel 7 in Rem .308 cases. All shots went into about 4" at 50 yds with enough oomph to cycle the bolt and cock the hammer, but not pick up the next round. I am excited to get out over the holidays and try working up 1/2 gr at a time till I get the sweet spot.
I just did'nt like spending the money on J bullets and 45 grains of Rel 15, so this gun hardly ever saw daylight. My thanks again for you efforts.