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Thread: Garand Load Performance

  1. #21
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Lincoln, Nebraska
    Posts
    5,036
    If a fellow is honest about the groups he shoots, he has to acknowledge there is a difference between “demonstrating” a particular group size and actually averaging a particular group size.

    If one says he fired 10 ten shot groups at 100 yards under good conditions and gave me the statistical average, I may well agree that is a decent representation of average group size.

    But, if that same fella picked the best couple of groups out of the ten, ten shot groups fired, one may well ask if that was a “demonstration” of how it actually shot by showing the best it could shoot on occasion but not as an average?

    This post is making no point other than to be realistic about what the rifle can actually do by shooting it enough for the statistical tabulation of its accuracy to be valid, and avoiding cherry picking our groups.

    Not saying anyone here is necessarily doing that, but it is all too common in the forums I frequent.

  2. #22
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Greenville, NC
    Posts
    495
    Not sure about the post below. But I am not shooting any groups that I want to brag about. I am still looking to tighten them and eliminate the flyers that tend to spoil what may be a respectable group. So far, I have only been able to prove what I have been told in the past. "The best you can routinely expect, with cast boolits in a Garand is about 3 inches." I have not achieved that yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by 35remington View Post
    If a fellow is honest about the groups he shoots, he has to acknowledge there is a difference between “demonstrating” a particular group size and actually averaging a particular group size.

    If one says he fired 10 ten shot groups at 100 yards under good conditions and gave me the statistical average, I may well agree that is a decent representation of average group size.

    But, if that same fella picked the best couple of groups out of the ten, ten shot groups fired, one may well ask if that was a “demonstration” of how it actually shot by showing the best it could shoot on occasion but not as an average?

    This post is making no point other than to be realistic about what the rifle can actually do by shooting it enough for the statistical tabulation of its accuracy to be valid, and avoiding cherry picking our groups.

    Not saying anyone here is necessarily doing that, but it is all too common in the forums I frequenit.

  3. #23
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    331
    Now I remember why my Dad wouldn't shot cast in the Garands. Okay for 1903&A3's, ok for M1917 and any sporting rifle. Too much inconsistency in the Garands. And back 50-60yrs ago there was no way to regulate gas pressure, as with the accessories today.
    Happiness is a Warm GUN & more ammo to shoot in it.

  4. #24
    Boolit Master


    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    1,085
    35Remington makes a good point. I'm not trying to bash anyone, but shooting one good group means nothing. If the next time you shoot the exact same combination and get a 5 inch group, then there's still more work to do. I usually test things that I think work multiple times, over a period of months sometimes, until I see a pattern of success.

    A few other observations; the Bob S load is indeed excellent, and I have obtained good results consistently over a several year run of shooting that load.

    Something that DIDN'T work out consistently were loads using 4895. I shot some initially promising groups, but subsequent range trips using the identical load shot patterns, not groups. Just my rifle's little ideosincracies I guess.

    Also, long term testing can show other things. A load that I once worked up in May, and shot all summer, turned out NOT to do so well in the cold temps. It was a somewhat reduced load that functioned well and shot well all summer. The M1 is not my usual Highpower gun, so I decided to shoot the last match of the season with it, just for fun. Good thing it was just for fun. The temp was in the upper 30s, and that Garand that shot that load so well all summer turned into a very accurate single shot straight pull rifle. Rapid fire was interesting, and even the slowfire stages were challenging due to the "click BANG"effect. Well, I got to fine tune my follow through.

    So, I'm just saying, time will tell you a lot about a load.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check