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Thread: 38 Special +P

  1. #41
    Boolit Buddy dddddmorgan's Avatar
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    I am in agreement with the idea of standard 38 loads being acceptable/sufficient in any situation where I have the gun with me.

    You might say "The .38 ain't enough gun in 'this' or 'that' situation." Well I stay away from those situations. In rural Idaho I can and do. I'm not using it for a house gun, I know the debate over caliber sufficiency is endless so I return to the words of a short little fellow I met once, when I was a teenager. I was at a gun show in Twin Falls Idaho and met Elmer Keith. Big hat, wrinkled like a prune and a grip of iron. Anyway, a fellow from my town here by the name of John Taffin quoted Keith when he said "I would rather face a fool with a .44 Magnum than a skilled adversary with a .22."
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  2. #42
    Boolit Grand Master
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    My two cents, but having shot and chronographed 38 Special out of short and medium length barrels quite extensively, more so than most people, I can assure you that there is more than an insignificant velocity difference between standard pressure and Plus P loads.

    Handloads especially tend to accentuate the difference, but it exists in factory ammo as well. But suitable ammo selection is not always or maybe even primarily about speed all the time.

    Whether said loads are needed by you is a personal decision to be made when all factors are considered. I am not of the opinion that when suitably and sensibly loaded a 38 snubby gives up a great deal to other defensive calibers in guns of like size and weight.

    I am not interested in comparison to arms of significant increase in size and weight. To each type are strengths and weaknesses, but I’d rather compare apples to apples.

  3. #43
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    .35 Remington is correct. But also clouding the issue is the effect of varying cylinder gap, which is every bit as important as barrel length, yet very seldom, if ever mentioned in test data you are likely to find online.

    With standard-pressure .38 Special lead ammo you can expect a Delta-V of 10 fps for each 0.001" change in cylinder gap from Mean Assembly Tolerance. This means that a 2" or 2-1/2" gun assembled at the minimum build-spec of pass 0.003/hold 0.004" may likely produce a higher velocity than a 4" gun at the maximum build-spec of pass 0.008"/hold 0.009"

    The difference is even greater when firing +P, +P+ or .357 ammunition. When I worked in the industry this data was carefully compiled during production of contract orders, firing a daily ten-board of QA audit samples over a period of several years, involving several hundred guns of various barrel lengths, produced on the same production line.
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  4. #44
    Boolit Master
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    I entered into a peeing contest with a member who insisted his .22s and .32s were at least the equal of a larger caliber gun because he could place multiple accurate shots from them. He even went so far as to claim he could make multiple eye socket or nasal cavity shots. I felt then, and do now he was a deluded soul making himself justify his firearms choices. I've never been in a gunfight, and hope I never am. If it happens, I have a sneaking suspicion you better make your first shot count. If I'm right you may, if LUCKY get one or two shots in, and I want them to be as effective as possible for the caliber involved.

  5. #45
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    Ya gotta hit it to kill it.

    If a person is confident enough in their ability to get first shot on target and that target is an eye socket. Then kudos to them! If they want to carry a 22 or 32 and feel that it is adequate then so be it. The main thing is that they are carrying SOMETHING.

    I may not share their choice of weapon/caliber but by the same token they may not agree with what I carry. I do not care!
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  6. #46
    Boolit Master Walkingwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stubshaft View Post
    Ya gotta hit it to kill it.

    If a person is confident enough in their ability to get first shot on target and that target is an eye socket. Then kudos to them! If they want to carry a 22 or 32 and feel that it is adequate then so be it. The main thing is that they are carrying SOMETHING.

    I may not share their choice of weapon/caliber but by the same token they may not agree with what I carry. I do not care!
    Thank you, that personal choice is such a problem for others. I am surprised that the do it my way is so strong in a community that is supposed to be about liberty, and freedom.

  7. #47
    Boolit Master
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    I don't care what anyone carries, I just think anyone who claims to be able to hit a tiny, likely moving target, when surprised and scared is either Ed McGivern reincarnated, or full of poo. There is a reason the big X on combat targets is in the middle. Anyways, my opinion, and worth what you paid

  8. #48
    Boolit Buddy dddddmorgan's Avatar
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    And here is where someone inserts the remark "Practice, practice, practice."

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  9. #49
    Boolit Master Walkingwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dubber123 View Post
    I don't care what anyone carries, I just think anyone who claims to be able to hit a tiny, likely moving target, when surprised and scared is either Ed McGivern reincarnated, or full of poo. There is a reason the big X on combat targets is in the middle. Anyways, my opinion, and worth what you paid
    It really is none of your business what size target they can hit. You will just have to get over it, your blood pressure will thank you.

  10. #50
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walkingwolf View Post
    It really is none of your business what size target they can hit. You will just have to get over it, your blood pressure will thank you.
    Absolutly right. Darwin tends to weed them out, none of my worries.

  11. #51
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    Effectiveness of bullets has been controversial since the gun was born.

    Plenty of incidents where folks have survived bullets fired from just about any weapon. Even head shots are not a sure thing as bullets have been known to 'skid' around the skull.

    Stopping power? All depends on the person being shot. Go look through some Congressional Medal of Honor citations. Many cases of soldiers being shot with everything from pistols to heavy machine guns and still fighting on. Or look at police reports of perps being shot and continue to inflict harm on others.

    Sure things? A shot penetrating to the brain should stop a fight. A shot to heart or aorta will eventually stop a perp, in a minute or so. A shot to a hip may at least hamper the perp's mobility but won't stop him from shooting back.

    I support the 'rule'. A mouse gun on your person is better than a bigger one left at home (or in the car).

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check