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Thread: 445 SuperMag rifle load needed for deer and hogs

  1. #1
    Boolit Bub
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    445 SuperMag rifle load needed for deer and hogs

    This is my first post on the fourm so I hope Im in the right place. I have been loading 38 special and 44mag for about 3 years now with cast boolits and realy love the hobby. I am a huge fan of Elmer Keith and his 250 grain SWC. I have been loading 44 mag loads for my rifle but have always used xtp bullets. Well just recently had my CVA 44 mag reamed out to 445 SuperMagnum. I have been experimenting with HornadyÂ’s 265gr flat point jsp but I realy want to start shooting cast in it.

    My goal is to find a load suitable for killing deer out to 200 yards though shots inside of 150 yards will be the norm. I also plan to hunt hogs inside of 75 yards. Ideally I would like to find one load suitable for both senarios as either one could happen on any weekend durring hunting season. I know that shot placement is key but I need a load capable of putting the animal down fast as I hunt in the swamp and finding a deer that runs more than 50-60 yards after being hit is challenging if not impossible. I rather blow up both front shoulders or let it walk than lose the whole deer.

    I am using Starline brass reamed out to accommodate large rifle primers and the only powder i have on my shelf suitable is IMR 4227. Im thinking about loading some 250 grain Keith SWC boolits with gas check from montana bullet works and im hoping for 2000fps -2200fps. Im hoping this will give me a hard hitting load for hogs up close yet shoot flat enough to reach out to 200 yards if the oportunity comes.

    Will the Keith bullet work for my intended purpose at that range or should I be looking at a differnt style boolit? Can the cast boolit handle that velocity? I plan to practice a lot but am I looking for too much to make this caliber effective at 200 yards? Any feedback and all suggestions are appreciated.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master


    richhodg66's Avatar
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    I'm no expert on such things, but I'm pretty sure a conventional Kieth bullet will cleanly kill deer out that far and beyond if the accuracy is there for proper shot placement.

    I've hunted with a Lyman bullet I cast which is a 300 grain gas checked SWC, can't remember the mold number, in sabots in an inline muzzle loader with 100 grains of Hogdon 777. No doubt in my mind that load would do it on deer or even elk way, way past what I'd feel comfortable shooting based on the accuracy level of the rifle.

    There are quite a few guys on here who hunt with .44s, one will answer up with better info shortly.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    I suggest Lyman's 429640HP cast of 16-1 alloy. Mine weight just over 270 gr fully dressed.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  4. #4
    Boolit Bub
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    That is a good looking bullet Larry. Unfortunately I am not set up to cast my own and I am stuck with bullets I can buy. Is that bullet something I can buy from a caster? Will the hollow point hold together at 2000fps when hitting bones? Thanks for the replies.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master Oklahoma Rebel's Avatar
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    do you think 16-1 with a gas check would work at up to 2000fps? not doubting, just curios, because if it can, it would be super-devastating, even at around 1700fps It would do everything asked of it I would think.... but I am wrong sometimes.....lol
    An armed man in a citizen.
    An unarmed man is a subject.
    A disarmed man is a slave.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beanhead View Post
    That is a good looking bullet Larry. Unfortunately I am not set up to cast my own and I am stuck with bullets I can buy. Is that bullet something I can buy from a caster? Will the hollow point hold together at 2000fps when hitting bones? Thanks for the replies.
    Did not mean to infer loading the 429640HPs to 2000 fps. I thought you expected that from the 250 gr cast bullet. The Lyman 429640HPs run 270+ gr as I mentioned and I have shot them quite accurately cast of 16-1 at 1800 fps. That velocity would do the job ("I need a load capable of putting the animal down fast as I hunt in the swamp and finding a deer that runs more than 50-60 yards after being hit is challenging if not impossible. I rather blow up both front shoulders or let it walk than lose the whole deer") you mention quite nicely. They weren't named "Devastator" for nothing. If you want to push above that velocity an alloy of COWWs + 2% tin then mixed 50/50 with lead would do what you want nicely.

    Since you don't cast I suggest giving the 250 gr GC'd Keith's a try.

    Larry Gibson
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  7. #7
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    Oklahoma Rebel

    I do not know if a 16-1 Devastator would hold up to 2000 fps as I've only pushed them to right at 1800 fps (444 Marlin). I have pushed the 457483 cast of 16-1 to right at 1900 fps with success out of my 450-400-70 Mauser.

    I'd bet the farm that the 429640HP cast of 16-1 alloy would indeed be quite "devastating" to say the least if it held up to that velocity.

    Larry Gibson
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  8. #8
    Boolit Bub
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    I just spoke with Montana bullet works and they recomended a 250 grain LFN. I ordered 100 to try out. If i start to cast I do belive that will be the first mold I buy. It is one awsome looking bullet and is exactly what im looking for. The “devastator” I like it.

    Do you think it would work well in a 44 mag revolver as well?
    Last edited by Beanhead; 02-03-2018 at 01:03 AM.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beanhead View Post
    I just spoke with Montana bullet works and they recomended a 250 grain LFN. I ordered 100 to try out. If i start to cast I do belive that will be the first mold I buy. It is one awsome looking bullet and is exactly what im looking for. The “devastator” I like it.

    Do you think it would work well in a 44 mag revolver as well?
    Yes it would work very well but honestly the scenario you described and performance you asked for would push me the to the boolit Larry suggested they are very effective and work great in a 44 revolver I have shot some mature does they drop on the spot kick a little and its lights out. No need to drive much more than the 1800 FPS from your rifle.

  10. #10
    Boolit Bub
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    I have been look at the mold and other needed items on MidwayUSA. It is definitly something I will try to purchase this year.

    My appologies for not being clear. I was meaning that the lyman 429640hp is the mold I am interested in.

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

    Moonie's Avatar
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    Years ago when I had my DW 7445 I liked the heavy weights. I don't remember the mold maker or number but I had a mold that cast a boolit that weight about 340gr.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    Personally that would not be my choice for 200 yard shots. If that is all, or the best I had I would certainly use it, but would likely shorten my shots up a little, and I too like boolits a little heavier.

  13. #13
    Boolit Bub
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    I have a 270 Win that I primarally hunt with that is fully capable of 200 yard shots. It would just be nice to make 200 yards shots with this rifle as well if it is possible. An opportunity at a shot that far is somewhat rare anyway. If it is not possible then it will be no big deal. The rifle is what it is and I can not make it into something it is not. I am just looking for advice on what bullet style would be best for trying to achive a load that might work out to 200 yards with this rifle.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    With a 445, and anything with some form of meplat, I would expect most any well placed shot to get the job done well beyond you target range.

    The question about best boolit at longer ranges come up frequently.

    With cast we still want a meplat, but the next biggest "need" really is the ability make a well placed shot in the first place.

    This boils down to minimizing wind drift and the ability deal with bullet drop. A RNFP, LFN and Truncated Cone are all hard hitting with big meplats. However, when you start talking longer ranges, a little less meplat and better balistics really can help with getting good shot placement.

    As far a weight, I would be looking anywhere from 240 to probably around 320. Again, plugging postualted choices to one of the on-line tool that calculates wind drift might be informative.

  15. #15
    I'm A Honcho! bluejay75's Avatar
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    I would look heavier and gas checked. I have a couple 445 SM Handi Rifles. You can get the 300-350 grain WFNGC, WLNGC, Truncated Cone Plain Base and as much H110 and a good enough crimp to reliably ignite without flash.

    Mine shoot cast ok, But they shoot jacketed 240 grain XTPs like magic. 32 Grains H110 is my load. Trim your brass and crimp well. If you cant get the flash to go away, play with the OAL. Mine shoots 1.5 inches at 100 yards reliably.

    Please work up to this load. Large Rifle Primers will be flat by the time you get good ignition.
    You never know how you rank amongst men 'til you have seen what will break another man.
    The original "Bluejay" US Army/ US Navy 1945-1970.

  16. #16
    Boolit Bub
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    Bluejay75, I was shooting the 240 xtp in the rifle when it was still a 44mag before the ream job. I was easily getting 1.5” groups at 100 yards with 23 grains of IMR 4227. I havnt tried it in the 445 supermag because I figured the bullet would expand violently at the velocitys the supermag produces and not stay together for good penetration. Thats why I am looking to load cast bullets. Have you used your load to kill a deer or hog? How did it preform?

  17. #17
    I'm A Honcho! bluejay75's Avatar
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    I have fired that XTP load at 20 feet into a box of sand and it held together. .75 expansion. No deer kills, but I almost turned a raccoon inside out with a 445 XTP load.
    You never know how you rank amongst men 'til you have seen what will break another man.
    The original "Bluejay" US Army/ US Navy 1945-1970.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluejay75 View Post
    I have fired that XTP load at 20 feet into a box of sand and it held together. .75 expansion. No deer kills, but I almost turned a raccoon inside out with a 445 XTP load.
    Alloy and speed applied correctly gives great expansion.

    I remember I had built a 475 Linebaugh rifle in a Ruger #1 John loaned us one of his reamers. Well I loaned the gun to my brother for deer season one year and had load worked up with a Hawk 325 grain HP. He shot a nice little spike horn through the front shoulders. YIKES you could have put your first through and through that hole it literally removed a large portion of the lungs bone and flesh. Moral of the story misapplication of the projectile. Fine at revolver velocities not so much at rifle velocities.

  19. #19
    I'm A Honcho! bluejay75's Avatar
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    I acknowledge that the violent nature of expansion of a 2000 FPS 240 XTP is on the top end of what the bullet can handle but I have never seen an XTP blow apart. I also use the Sierra .4295 250 FPJ with great results for the considerations you list.
    You never know how you rank amongst men 'til you have seen what will break another man.
    The original "Bluejay" US Army/ US Navy 1945-1970.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master

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    If you have to go jacketed, then I would recommend the Hornady 265 or IIRC Speer makes a 270 gold dot. Cast, why not the Lee 310gr boolit

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check