Mold question.

[marlinman93]

We had our monthly collector gun show today, and browsing around I found a couple things I couldn't pass up. First is this .45-70 mold.







It is in like new shape, and still in the original cardboard box, but no name on mold or box? Only markings were on one side and they are "11 B" and an "S" above that, but a lazy "S" as it's on it's side above the B? If anybody has any ideas whose mold it is, I'd appreciate the info! It was $20, so regardless of maker I felt I couldn't go wrong.



The other tool is a very rare Ideal #6 tool, which is the largest size tool Ideal made! Compared to the normal Ideal #1 or #2 tools that are about 8" long, the big #6 is 10.5" long. Seller told me it was a .40-65, and I didn't have my glasses handy, so took his word for it. Thought that was strange caliber for such an early Ideal tool, so I checked with a magnifier glass at my table and saw the true caliber! ".40-60 M & Colt" Which is the .40-60 Marlin used in the 1881 Marlins! That took it from a pretty neat tool to a very rare and unusual tool! I was tickled with the caliber surprise!







The mold is in perfect shape, and I'll cast some bullets from it to see what weight they drop at, and diameter.

[Don McDowell]

Sounds like a Brooks mould. You'll need Saeco handles for it.

[marlinman93]

Thanks Don! I have a few Saeco molds and handles, so good to go there. Guessing it's around a 400-425 gr. mold, but need to weight the bullet that came with it.

[Don McDowell]

Yeh looks like something 400ish gr , for using in a lever gun. Most all of those Brooks moulds I have cast the best when the alloy is running right at 775 temp.
I like those old Ideal tools with the moulds built in, I just got one for the 32-40 but haven't had a chance to use it yet.

[Chill Wills]

You made a great deal on both the tools. The Brooks mold is in the running with Paul Jones for tops. Paul might have the edge but we are splitting hairs.
That ideal #6 is just plain cool. I have a few, very few really. One adjustable in 45 GOV (457124) and two others for the 1886's.

Now and then I just have to cast and load with black powder to get the feel of what it was like, sends me back in time.

I keep telling myself, I am going to cast, load and hunt (take an animal) all in the same few days with one, before I leave this world.
I would also like to find the 45 M with the (457193) 400 flat nose cavity. .....Maybe never. We will see.

[marlinman93]

You made a great deal on both the tools. The Brooks mold is in the running with Paul Jones for tops. Paul might have the edge but we are splitting hairs.
That ideal #6 is just plain cool. I have a few, very few really. One adjustable in 45 GOV (457124) and two others for the 1886's.

Now and then I just have to cast and load with black powder to get the feel of what it was like, sends me back in time.

I keep telling myself, I am going to cast, load and hunt (take an animal) all in the same few days with one, before I leave this world.
I would also like to find the 45 M with the (457193) 400 flat nose cavity. .....Maybe never. We will see.

I have 8 or 9 Ideal molds made when Marlin owned Ideal 1910-1916. Mine are all either Marlin Firearms Co. marked, or double marked with Ideal and MFACo. markings. Have a half dozen that are just Ideal marked, but try to stay with Marlin calibers. I wanted this tool just because I didn't own a big caliber #6, and have a couple .40-65 Win. rifles. But I was much happier when I found out it was a .40-60M as I have an 1881 in this caliber also!

[Gewehr-Guy]

That is one unique and beautiful 81, do you know it's history? Looks like something a man like Teddy R. would own. Those #6 tools are fun to load with, but you better have good gloves, they get HOT when casting

[Chill Wills]

Those #6 tools are fun to load with, but you better have good gloves, they get HOT when casting

I hear you on the hot handles. I have cast about 30 to 50 45 cal bullets at a session wearing leather welding gloves. I was not too uncomfortable, nor was suffering from cold hands.
I think in the amounts of bullets expected in one session that the old tools were intended to make, that is, keep a working man in ammo around the farm or ranch, the combo tools Ideal made were great.

Boy, that 1881 sure is a fine example!! Wow! Nice.
Who was designing the early Marlin lever rifles like the 1881 before LL Hepburn left Remington?

[Chill Wills]

I just reread your post again. You are right! That rifle does look like something Teddy would have had next to him in an old picture. Except for the rear tangsight. Of course The 1876 Winchester will always be linked to him.

[marlinman93]

That is one unique and beautiful 81, do you know it's history? Looks like something a man like Teddy R. would own. Those #6 tools are fun to load with, but you better have good gloves, they get HOT when casting

The 1881 in the picture was built for a Judge in Saginaw, Mi. named John Harriman. It was built by Emil Flues of Bay City, Mi. when he was about 18-20 years old. Flues was apprenticed to a gunsmith named Wrege when he was 14 yrs. old, and was hired by Itahca around WWI as a designer for their shotguns. The Flues Model Ithaca was his design, as were many others.
Flues was secretary of the Bay City Schuetzen Club and Harriman was a fellow shooter. He had Flues rework his 1881 to make it a nice offhand rifle for casual shooting. Flues restocked the 1881 and added a Ballard buttplate. Checkered the wood at 24 LPI, and engraved all the screw heads. He also color cased the action as the 1881's were blued. The barrel and buttplate are marked "E. Flues Bay City" and under the forearm wood the barrel is marked, "#100 TESTED"
I contacted Flues' nephew who wrote his biography for the Double Gun Journal, and he gave me the data after I gave him Flues' ID number under the forearm. Found this 1881 years ago in a "junk barrel" at a gun shop that was closing locally. Saw the Ballard buttplate sticking out of the barrel and thought it was a Ballard. I was shocked to see it was an 1881 Marlin, and even more shocked to see the $400 price tag. One of the best collector gun finds of my life!