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Thread: Sighting in

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

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    Sighting in

    How many rounds does it typically take to sight in a new rifle?

    I've noticed a trend lately at the range. First, about 9 out of ten people at the rifle range are carrying an AR of some variety. Young, old, male, female; everyone has an AR.

    Second, it seems to take some people hundreds of rounds to sight in. I sat next to a guy recently shooting an AR carbine with a big brake- huge fireball and concussion at each trigger pull. He'd empty a 30 round magazine over a couple minutes time, then fiddle with his sights. Another magazine then fiddle with the sights more. Finally he triumphantly proclaimed it was sighted in to his satisfaction. When he left I picked up 400 pieces of 5.56 brass off the ground.

    Another time I went shooting with a friend. I was shooting my rifle and he was shooting his. He went through several boxes of ammo and I could see he was getting frustrated. I asked what was wrong and he said he just couldn't get it sighted in. I helped him and we had it done within a few rounds. It wasn't hard; he just didn't know how to do it. I would have helped the guy the other day too, but he seemed pretty self confident and enjoying himself, so I just minded my own business.

    Nothing against ARs, really. I have a couple myself, even though they're not really my thing. It just seems funny that EVERYONE has one nowadays. When I started shooting 30+ years ago, a box of 30-06 ammo had to last me a while, now most people I see go through a 30 round magazine faster than I used to go through a single round.

  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master



    M-Tecs's Avatar
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    3 to 5 rounds

  3. #3
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    Pretty easy with 3 round for a scoped rifle. From good rest fire 1 shot at center of targe.

    Move rifle so scope cross hairs cover hole from fist shot and secure the rifle so it can not be easily moved. Adjust cross hairs to where you want the next round to impact as if you were shooting at center of target again.

    Aim rifle at center of target and fire second shot. If you were careful to not move the rifle when adjusting the cross hairs then you should be on target. Third shot is to confirm second shot. If you did it right then the following shots should be for fun or fine tuning.
    Steve,

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  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Something to consider. In a NRA High power rifle match you get 2 sighters at each stage to zero the rifle. Granted most competitors have very close zeros for each stage but still its 2 sighters. Most use one to adjust fine tune and the second as a prover.

    With a solid set up knowing your sight and graduations on a grid lined target 1 shot and a full correction should be very close. A good spotting scope is a big help zeroing the rifle as it makes the corrections needed easy to see from the firing line. Some get confused by the moa graduations and think 1/8 moa or 1/4 moa is inches and range dosnt matter. Some just like "playing" and others may still be in the learning curve.

    Its interesting to watch shooter zero a fire arm. Ive given club member the simple formula for figuring sight corrections for iron sights and they were amazed it worked. error" X sight radious" / range in inches.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    If I can see through the bbl, such as an ar15, bolt action, etc., I look through the bbl at a point 20 or so yards away and adjust the cross hairs to that point. A couple shots after doing that at 100, I just correct the cross hairs to finish sighting in, then a few more shots to confirm the zero.
    Last edited by tommag; 01-20-2018 at 12:25 AM. Reason: Auto kurekt
    When the Cambrian measures were forming, They promised perpetual peace.
    They swore, if we gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would cease.
    But when we disarmed They sold us and delivered us bound to our foe,
    And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "Stick to the Devil you know."

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

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    Yep, you guys know how to do it. It's really not hard to do if you know what you're doing.

    More than once I've had people give me real funny looks when I've got a rifle sitting on sand bags with the bolt out, eyeballing through the bore and adjusting the scope. They ask me what I'm doing and seem confused when I tell them I'm bore-sighting because I mounted a scope.

    Invariably it's "You can do that without a bore-sighting tool?" Then people seem surprised when the first shot is a couple inches from the bullseye. I've never owned a bore sighting tool, never needed one.

  7. #7
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    Yup, I usually bore sight from the kitchen table on a knot hole on the back fence before going to the range. Sure saves ammo.
    Steve,

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  8. #8
    Boolit Grand Master Artful's Avatar
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    je suis charlie

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    "The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

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    takes 2 rnds, but dont complain. just pickup the brass they leave behind.

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy tigweldit's Avatar
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    3 to 5 rounds to get sighted in. Then another 150 to 200 rounds to make sure I'm right, and for some fun trigger time.

  11. #11
    Boolit Grand Master

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    In theory, two. In practice, three. My "bore sighter" is a piece of painters' tape on a shed on the other side of the driveway.
    When I see someone chasing their zero around on a warm day I'll suggest they let it cool, on a hot day it's a whole 'nuther matter.
    Endowment Life Member NRA, Life Member TSRA, Member WACA, NRA Whittington Center, BBHC
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  12. #12
    Boolit Master

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    The military uses a sighting target to zero for 300yds using a 25 yd target with grid marks and adjustment instructions. You get 9 rounds; 3 for windage - adjust; 3 for elevation; and 3 to confirm. You are allowed 18 rounds so if you don't get it right the first time you can repeat. After that, I think you get to take your rifle and ruck on a 20 mile sight seeing tour to help the rifle get over having failed. Black rifles have feelings too. I think once the rifle feels better you get another 18 rounds. I didn't serve but have friends who have and that was sort of how it was explained to me!
    Common sense Gun Safety . . .

    Is taught at the Range!

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    I am a fan of old school black rifles. With that being said, it is very easy to go through a couple of mags sighting in an iron sight fixed carry handle AR. There are two sights to get straight--the front one for elevation, and the rear sight for windage. Plus, some AR's are 3-4 inch guns. I have no problem with making an adjustment and shooting a 5 shot group......make another adjustment.....shoot a 5 shot group.

    Um.....and there is also the part about being at a rifle range and loving the act of actually shooting a gun. Maybe these fellers aren't making adjustments. Maybe they are just petting their weapons and saying, "Thank you rifle......thank you for being so awesome!".

  14. #14
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Many don't know the craft. Many won't ask for help. And, ........ there are a few guns that just won't get sighted in because of mechanical issues (loose scope mounts, mixed ammo type, improper eye relief - parallax, etc). Can't tell you how many times I've been on the line and the shooter types in question can't figure out why their .30 cal, 110 gr. .30-06 doesn't shoot to the same POI with their 220 gr. ammo.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    Some can't get sighted in because they lack shooting skills, so their shots are everywhere to begin with. They keep shooting and adjusting sights and shots keep going everywhere. Sometimes they don't use any kind of rest, and other times it's something useless. Because "groups" are fired five to ten rounds rapid, by this point the rifle is so hot that it is shifting POI on its own. I'll try to help someone if they ask, but I'm not going to butt in and offer unsolicited help.

    Several years ago I watched a shooter keep turning the scope adjustment and moving shots further from the center. Never occurred to him to turn the knob in the other direction; he had convinced himself he was turning it in the correct direction despite what he was seeing on the target. Some are beyond help.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    While we are on the subject, I have got to throw this in the mix. Sighting in is no problem if you just watch how it is done in the movies. A good example is The Shooter with Mark Walberg. He portrays an expert Army sniper and is recruited to do some phony set up for some bad guys who want to kill some politician or whatever. He goes to make sure his rifle is on target and sets a soda can on a stump at about 300 yards. When he looks through the scope he does not place the cross hairs on the can but instead places them about three inches low. He then reaches for the elevation knob and gives it three clicks. You can see the cross hairs move up until they are centered on the can, he pulls the trigger and viola, the can explodes. He uses this method throughout the movie. Whenever a scope is used in a movie they always show the cross hairs move. Many years ago I had a very old scope and it would be sighted in and the cross hairs would be off center but they solved that problem many decades ago. I have seen the problem with the AR owners trying to site in there new treasure and it is indeed sad to watch. One time in particular and young man and wife came to the range and had the bench next to me. I could see right away that they had no idea what they were doing or needed to do. I asked if I could help and they were glad to agree. I sat down and looked through the peep sight. I looked like you were simply looking out a picture window. I told them, this will never work. I could see there was a smaller peep sight that flipped up into place. Once the smaller peep was in in place it was little trouble to get the rifle on target. The man who sold them the rifle never told them how the sights worked or much of anything for that matter.
    A GUN THAT'S COCKED AND UNLOADED AIN'T GOOD FOR NUTHIN'........... ROOSTER COGBURN

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    Delete this post please.
    Last edited by GOPHER SLAYER; 01-21-2018 at 03:17 PM.
    A GUN THAT'S COCKED AND UNLOADED AIN'T GOOD FOR NUTHIN'........... ROOSTER COGBURN

  18. #18
    Boolit Master & Generous Contributor

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    Usually around four rds. Just put a new scope on my 10/22 to sight in tomorrow.
    If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.
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    Sam

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    I've been a newbie before, not knowing how things work, frustrated and not understanding things that are second nature for the old timers. It's not always easy to ask for help. I feel a little bad for not trying to help the guy who burned through 400 rounds sighting in his AR. He did seem to be enjoying himself though, and I am hesitant to butt into someone else's business.

    Having tinkered with guns. shooting, and reloading for decades, it's easy to forget what it's like to be starting out clueless. One of the frustrating things I've run into is clueless newbies who think they know it all because they watched some Youtube videos.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    Watched the video Artful put up, that’s how I check mine every once in a while , works. If you can pull bolt and look thru bore hole at something further than your target you will be better off, I’ve even bore sighted on the moon before but you got to be fast cause something is movin.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check