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Thread: Open Up Lee Bullet Size Die....Troubles

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by n.h.schmidt View Post
    If you have the means to hold the die .You can open the die up to .348 in a single pass with a Letter S drill. They are .348 dia. The Lee dies are not supposed to be very hard and should drill easily.
    Lee dies are case hardened, the case hardened layer is about .020" and it is VERY hard. Doubtful a HSS drill will yield anything other than a trashed drill bit. I modify Lee dies from time to time in my lathe and sunnen hone, so I know how much work it is to hone out one just a couple of thousandths because I am honing in the case hardened layer. I have machined off the lettering with carbide cutters in the lathe and it is HARD as woodpecker lips until it breaks through the case hardened layer then it is soft as butter.
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  2. #22
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    I'm surprised it is so tough, I've done many Lee dies, and many Star, Lyman, and RCBS dies using this method. I do have the advantage of having a lathe. The Lee dies are the softest of the bunch. Last week I did one using a .348" drill, then honed it to .359". It took about an hour, but that included many stops to measure progress.
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  3. #23
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    At this point, spending the extra $ to finish this project along with the trouble and being a novice, I will be better off ordering one custom made. I posted my thoughts about ordering a Lee die in the beginning post. Monday morning, I will give Bryan at Ch4d a phone call and see if he can make me one. If not, I will forgo the long wait for one through Lee. /Chris

  4. #24
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    I have opened up Lee push through bullet sizing dies by annealing the die first then as previously mentioned, running a drill through .003 undersize and finishing with a split dowel and abrasive wet and dry paper.

    If you are careful, it is perfectly possible to hone out and achieve a good finish.

    The only problem I have found when doing this, is that the bottom punch is then undersized and care must be taken to centre the punch on the base of the bullet to ensure gas checks are seated correctly.

    ukrifleman.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master dikman's Avatar
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    I have modified a couple of Lee dies, and yes, they are hardened! Without a lathe you're asking for trouble as it will be almost impossible to keep it from going out-of-round.

  6. #26
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    You can get Diamond Dust different grit size in suspension in a injector syringe at Rio Grande Jewelers in Albuquerque. You could get it elsewhere but this is the only source I know of. Then charge the surface of thin copper for about 3/4 inch that is cut to fit your dowel. Also use thin rubber fitted under the copper to give it some flex. Fit the dowel to your die hole first with oil getting it to fit the bore snugly. To charge the copper, squeeze a small amount ( size of BB) on your index finger and rub it on the copper in a circular motion. Roll the dust into the copper with a small bearing with a round rod fit through the hole with pressure applied evenly and roll back an forth across the primed area a few times. I would submerge the die under water/Dawn and run the dowel in slowly back and forth twice and pull out and measure. That will let you know how fast to go. I have two fine grit tubes of DD on hand that has been used for more than one purpose. Plan to rig one for myself and see for sure. Will reply.

  7. #27
    Boolit Master OldBearHair's Avatar
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    The only problem I have found when doing this, is that the bottom punch is then undersized and care must be taken to centre the punch on the base of the bullet to ensure gas checks are seated correctly.

    ukrifleman. Mike the bottom punch and make mental notes of how the finish is. the radius on the end ,etc. Heat it to red and upset it with a hammer carefully . Mike it now so it can be machined to fit the newly sized die.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10gaOkie
    I have a Lee size die .339 that I am trying to open up to .351. Using a dowel rod plus both wet/dry paper & emery cloth, it is taking forever!
    I suggest you stop. Most all dies are "through hardened". When I hone a precision 1/2" dia carbide bore I typically add about .001" (that's .0005" per side). We finish hone using a diamond coated honing bar and it takes about 5 min with a precision Sunnen hone machine. Trying to remove .012 with a drill and sandpaper simply can't be done (at least not in your lifetime ). You might be able to buy a cobalt or carbide "S" (.348) drill and sand the rest, but still removing about .002-.003" will take forever and you will probably end up with a bore that's not straight. You can get custom sized dies right from LEE for $38.

  9. #29
    Boolit Man tomon's Avatar
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    Would this pertain to the Lee Neck Collet dies? I shoot 30-30, .308, and 30-06 Cast. The factory mandrels are .3055, which swages .309 or .310 boolits way too far. I bought their 303British Mandrel, which is .3085 with hopes of switching them out. Alas, I need the matching guide! The mandrel starts in, but then is too tight. I searched the Lee Website, but cannot come up with the Mandrel Guide part number. The 30-30 one is marked 30-30 D7. Could someone pick the number off their 303B guide, or come up with the part number, please?
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomon View Post
    Would this pertain to the Lee Neck Collet dies? I shoot 30-30, .308, and 30-06 Cast. The factory mandrels are .3055, which swages .309 or .310 boolits way too far. I bought their 303British Mandrel, which is .3085 with hopes of switching them out. Alas, I need the matching guide! The mandrel starts in, but then is too tight. I searched the Lee Website, but cannot come up with the Mandrel Guide part number. The 30-30 one is marked 30-30 D7. Could someone pick the number off their 303B guide, or come up with the part number, please?
    You really ought to start a new thread. This is a completely different subject. Meaningful, but will be lost here.
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  11. #31
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    Actually that guide is a simple little collet that when tightened locks on the shaft. You probably only need to remove .002-.003 from the shank on the mandrel for it to work, or open the collet back up a little with it loose in the die. In reality I doubt lee makes different guides for 30 cals 8mm and possibly even 32 cals. all the same guide and hole size, then the mandrels are all the same shank size and just different working dias. Measure your old mandrells dtem and the new one woth calipers or mics ( mics are better for this) and see what the difference is.

  12. #32
    Boolit Man tomon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by country gent View Post
    Actually that guide is a simple little collet that when tightened locks on the shaft. You probably only need to remove .002-.003 from the shank on the mandrel for it to work, or open the collet back up a little with it loose in the die. In reality I doubt lee makes different guides for 30 cals 8mm and possibly even 32 cals. all the same guide and hole size, then the mandrels are all the same shank size and just different working dias. Measure your old mandrells dtem and the new one woth calipers or mics ( mics are better for this) and see what the difference is.
    Actually, I am talking about the anvil(?) that the collet pushes up against when the tube pushes against the shellholder. They seem to be diameter specific, so while they use the same mandrel and collet within the caliber of, say, .308, the anvil it hits would be cartridge specific. The anvil, which is the guide I was talking about, Has a hole that is just large enough for the .3055 mandrel to operate. The next larger production size is the 303British, which is .3085. the .3085 won't fit into the 30 caliber anvils.
    Last edited by tomon; 04-03-2018 at 12:45 PM.
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  13. #33
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    Looong ago GONRA tooka Harbor Freight (or was it Wholesale Tool?)
    "Die Grinder", turned OD to a convenient diameter, made a holder to clamp it into
    usual Aloris type quick change lathe bit holder.
    Can install on my SB10 lathe at will and do small "internal grinding" jobs like this.
    Verks Great!

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by mdi View Post
    Getting that much equipment/tools together would cost the same as 3 custom sizing dies...
    This is what makes it worthwhile for most of us to BUY tools like this... the cost of making one or two bullet sizers does not justify the cost of all the machinery and tooling to “do it yourself.” A well equipped machinist can do it for you, and do it more precisely and quickly than you can go through the steps to do it “at home cheaply.” Ignore the forgoing if you want to go into home shop machining as a separate (expensive) hobby.

    Froggie
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  15. #35
    Boolit Master OldBearHair's Avatar
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    You are correct Froggie, But, as for me I am extremely lucky I suppose. My Neighbor, two doors West came down the street to my house pushing a Southbend Lathe on a furniture dolly that was in the way at their storage building. Didn't have a motor. Another friend wanted to know if he could put his 3600 lb Bridgeport Milling machine in my shop as he did not have a place to put it. Already there were knife making machines and belt sanders, etc. Now my shop is a little crowded to say the least and I can drill holes in rods that will spin true. Am happy indeed making just about any tool or part that is necessary at the time. It is indeed gratifying to go to my shop every day and do just exactly what I want to and not what someone else expects (like at work) I am retired for the second time. Enjoy my hobbies making boolits, hunting pigs, bowhunting pigs with my 44 mag in a pouch (concealed carry) under my left arm in case of a charging boar with a mislocated arrow in him. lots of my retired friends tell me they get bored. I can't remember a time when I was bored except when I get roped into going to a social event where some goof is making it miserable for everyone. LOL

  16. #36
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    I have one old mold that's casting .008 oversized, I suspect sometime in its past it was a little small and some heavy hands lapped it. I made a lee style push thru sizer with 2 sizer rings in it one is the first takes the bullet down to with in .002 the last finishes it to desired size. bullets don't show any deformation and are very round and a nice burnished finish. Sizing force is reduced a lot as the 2 rings are removing the same amount its done in 2 steps. the leadin to the first ring and ring are close to the end the second lead in is just short of the bullets length then the final size ring. It wasn't bad machining it but grinding was touchy. I wonder if for bigger bullets or some pc coating if this style wouldn't be better.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master BigEyeBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Frog View Post
    This is what makes it worthwhile for most of us to BUY tools like this... the cost of making one or two bullet sizers does not justify the cost of all the machinery and tooling to “do it yourself.” A well equipped machinist can do it for you, and do it more precisely and quickly than you can go through the steps to do it “at home cheaply.” Ignore the forgoing if you want to go into home shop machining as a separate (expensive) hobby.

    Froggie
    Well as it so happens I do have a well equipped workshop , three lathes a milling machine ,and numerous other machines for metal working and woodworking . Im a fully qualified Fitter and Turner ,have been working in metal since I was indentured at 16 ,Im now 63 and still doing metal work . I have modified many loading dies and bullet sizing dies over the years ,from all manufacturers .Lee dies are the least trouble some to modify .

  18. #38
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    Dear BigEyeBob,

    I apologize if I offended, but I was addressing the OP’s question about what to do if trying to open the die by hand wasn’t working. I would maintain however that the average member here who is “machine challenged” should look up someone like you who has the wherewithal to get the job done easily and efficiently. I own a small (11” swing) lathe and benchtop mill and have some minimal competence with using them, but they are even less actively used than my presses... it’s just something I don’t do that much. That does make me more appreciative of folks like you!

    Regards,
    Froggie
    "It aint easy being green!"

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