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Thread: Reduced .375 H&H loads

  1. #1
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    Reduced .375 H&H loads

    I'm going to load some reduced recoil rounds using the 300 gr btsp Hornady bullet. I'm wanting to use H4895, IMR 4198, or should I go with Unique or Red Dot? I'm looking for about 1500 to 1700 fps. Anyone with experience here?
    Thanks!

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  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Very satisfactory is #375449 cast of COWW, air cooled, no GC, tumbled in Lee Liquid Alox, sized .379", loaded with 12-13 grains of either Bullseye, Red Dot, 700X, TiteGroup or Clays. No filler is needed. Either standard or magnum primers fine. Approximates .38-55 Winchester velocity, good woods deer load, also effective on African plains game such as Impala. light recoil, accurate, fun to shoot. My friends and I have shot thousands of rounds of this load in a variety of rifles over at least 20 years with great results. PH friend in SA has killed literal truckloads of game with it for biltong.
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    Thanks, Outpost75! Is it ok to substitute the jacketed bullet? I'm not casting for it yet.

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    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texas by God View Post
    Thanks, Outpost75! Is it ok to substitute the jacketed bullet? I'm not casting for it yet.

    Would not use the 300-grain jacketed, but the 235 Speer or 270-grain SPs, velocity will be lower with jacketed bullet, probably below 1200 fps, due to increased bore drag. Don't go below 13 grains with jacketed, as you might stick a bullet in the barrel!

    OK to increase charge with 235 Speer up to 16 grains of the fast-burners, as needed for best grouping or 14 grains with 270-grain SP, or with #375449 if gaschecked.

    You can use commercial cast .38-55 Laser-cast or Meister 250-255 grain bullets with the 12-13 grain load for about 1350 fps. Bullet diameter IS important, especially with the commercial hard-cast, or they will lead! Use the largest bullet which chambers and extracts without telescoping into the case or debulleting a loaded round upon extraction...Seat cast bullets so the bullet base does NOT protrude below the neck. For best results do a pound-cast of chamber and buy or size your bullets to FIT BALL SEAT!

    IGNORE groove diameter of the barrel! Meaningless poppycock!

    Everyone please drive a wooden stake through the heart of THAT corrupted lot of misinformation!

    ONLY THROAT SIZE MATTERS in rifles or revolvers!

    Of the dozen or so .375 rifles we've shot these loads in ONLY ONE required .377" cast bullets.

    That one was a custom job with [in my opinion] a "too tight" chamber which was VERY finicky on loads.

    You don't want a tight "target" chamber on a heavy caliber rifle which might potentially be used on dangerous game, such as the North American great bears.

    Normal cast bullet diameter for the .38-55 is .379-.380" and we have found that SOFT 10-12 BHN bullets of .379" diameter work in the great majority of factory .375 H&H rifles with common sporting chambers. If you have a rifle which has been shot a great deal, enough that it shows throat erosion, then YOU WILL need .380"!

    I know only two people who have actually worn out .375 barrels actually by game shooting with them. One was the late Col. Gregory Kalnitzky and the other was the late Arvid Benson. Both of those rifles ended up in Texas after these great hunters and members of Safari Club International passed. I know that one rifle still kills deer and hogs regularly with these cast loads. That wise inheritor set up a Dillon machine to crank out .375 cast loads by the multiple hundreds and bought both his boys .375s upon high school graduation, because they "needed no other big game rifle." They have since worked their way up to the "75% load" of 4895, 4064, RL15 or Varget with the 235 Speer as their deer and elk load. Recoil is manageable and both rifles are stone killers.
    Last edited by Outpost75; 01-15-2018 at 12:31 PM.
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  5. #5
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    I have zero experience with the 375, BUT.... with the 4895, anything below about 80% case fill i'd use a dacron filler.
    I had hangfires in both winter and summer with that powder when working up reduced cast loads in the 35 whelen.

    When i put the filler in those same loads, the hangfires went away, and accuracy was greatly improved
    (Thanks Larry Gibson).
    I was down around the "suggested" 60% reduction area with h4895 when the hangfires began.
    80% casefill and up was no problem without fillers with that powder.

    I totally agree with no need for the filler with bullseye, reddot, unique, and like powders.

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    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 35 shooter View Post
    I have zero experience with the 375, BUT.... with the 4895, anything below about 80% case fill i'd use a dacron filler.
    I had hangfires in both winter and summer with that powder when working up reduced cast loads in the 35 whelen.

    When i put the filler in those same loads, the hangfires went away, and accuracy was greatly improved
    (Thanks Larry Gibson).
    I was down around the "suggested" 60% reduction area with h4895 when the hangfires began.
    80% casefill and up was no problem without fillers with that powder.

    I totally agree with no need for the filler with bullseye, reddot, unique, and like powders.
    35 Shooter is Correct! Use Dacron filler with the 75% loads in the .375 or in any case of .30-'06 size or larger.
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    Thanks guys for the great info. However I'm going to use the 300 gr jacketed bullets because that's what I have. That's what I asked about in tbe op. Maybe 75% of the listed starting load for H4895 with filler? Magnum primer?

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  8. #8
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texas by God View Post
    Thanks guys for the great info. However I'm going to use the 300 gr jacketed bullets because that's what I have. That's what I asked about in tbe op. Maybe 75% of the listed starting load for H4895 with filler? Magnum primer? Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
    Magnum primer and filler is good to ensure full ignition with the 75% load.
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    Can I send you some cast bullets? Maybe a lot of them? We can trade for the jacketed ones at some rate you think is fair?
    I have a number of really great designs made by LBT and others. One PP spitzer bullet too I load 60 grs of IMR 3031 behind. Great bullet.

    I will push the jacketed ones at safe full loads and hunt with them.
    Chill Wills

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    Thanks for the offer Chill Wills (I remember him!) But this project is happening tomorrow. I might like to barter for boolits in the future, though.
    Thomas

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    Texas by God

    I'm only going to make a suggestion and highly recommend you exercise due caution because I have not down loaded three six bit cartridges with jacketed bullets, especially 300 gr ones. Were I to try for a load in the velocity range you want that I would load 36 - 40 gr 4895 and use a dense Dacron filler that is compressed......not tightly packed.

    Again, just a suggestion here as it appears you're going to want to do this. Be careful and be especially watchful for any sign, no matter how small, of a hang fire.....a click.....bang. If you get that at all stop, don't shoot any more. Be careful.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
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    Thank you. I have exerienced hangfires with .358 Norma before and pulled down the ammo. I reprimed with magnum primers and used quilt batting to hold the powder down. Just 2-300 fps less than buffalo loads is probably where I'll end up. I have many loading manuals to cross check everything with.

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  13. #13
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    I found this in an old DuPont guide.

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  14. #14
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    I just dug out my copy of that same IMR powder guide from 1990. If you have SR4759 starting somewhat below what they show as a maximum charge would probably get you where you want. I was lucky and discovered SR4759 just before it was discontinued, but barely. I do have a small stash, and it's lots of fun in the '06. I have also had good luck with IMR4227 but it won't give nearly the case fill the 4759 does.
    Good Luck,
    Rick

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    I have 4198 so I'll go that route. I've loaded one round with a slightly reduced charge, magnum primer and filler. I'll try this one and see what's what. This is my brother's elk rifle and we want a lower recoiling practice load. I got 44 of these 300gr Hornady btsp for $10. That is why we are using them. Might use them on hogs......

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  16. #16
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    We are talking 44 bullets?

    Whoooh! I miss-judged the scope of your bullet stash. I thought we were talking about the plinking away of many hundreds of good jacketed 300gr 375's!

    Carry on. Have fun.
    BTW- I have that same IMR - data flyer. Very useful and insightful. It shows data on all the old cartridges for the full range of powders; powders you would use and powder pairings you would never think of using, but the data is there and pressure tested. If nothing else, it is very interesting to see how the pressure and velocity progress using the faster to slower powders in a cartridge. Good stuff.

    Okay Texas by God, you and your brother have fun and I hope you do get to shoot some hogs with those big jacketed bullets. Just make sure there is nothing behind the hog for a few miles Take care.
    Chill Wills

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    Once you're done burning thru the stash of the 300 grain bullets and you're still looking for a moderate velocity "fun" load to shoot, the Speer 235's are just the ticket! I've shot nearly 200 or so, thru my H&H, using the same 25 nickle plated cases. I don't have the load info handy, but it was a "book" load from a newer Speer manual and was not a max load either. Easy on the shooter, the rifle and the brass and makes the same 375 cal hole in paper as factory ammo. I wound up with those once fired cases as part of a deal and have kept them separate just for those loads. Even at the moderate speeds, they should be plenty for deer or hogs - Bill in MA

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chill Wills View Post
    We are talking 44 bullets?

    Whoooh! I miss-judged the scope of your bullet stash. I thought we were talking about the plinking away of many hundreds of good jacketed 300gr 375's!

    Carry on. Have fun.
    BTW- I have that same IMR - data flyer. Very useful and insightful. It shows data on all the old cartridges for the full range of powders; powders you would use and powder pairings you would never think of using, but the data is there and pressure tested. If nothing else, it is very interesting to see how the pressure and velocity progress using the faster to slower powders in a cartridge. Good stuff.

    Okay Texas by God, you and your brother have fun and I hope you do get to shoot some hogs with those big jacketed bullets. Just make sure there is nothing behind the hog for a few miles Take care.
    What started this was last summer he got excited when his wife spotted pigs; he grabbed his Ruger .375 with factory 300 gr rn and killed two with three shots after a pell mell run across the field on a side by side. He didn't have the butt tucked into his shoulder correctly and got bruised and a "Zeiss eye". Between my talk of casting boolets and the cost of factory ammo- I think he's seeing the light. After these loads, if he doesn't want to cast- I'll look into light j-words.
    Thomas

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Try the Meister or Laser-cast 250-255-grain plainbased .38-55 bullets, they are much cheaper than jacketed, and if you get them in the larger .379-.380" diameter they will stand 1450 fps without leading. It helps to give them an overcoat of Lee Liquid Alox over top of the blue hard lube that comes on them.
    Last edited by Outpost75; 01-16-2018 at 12:17 PM.
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  20. #20
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    Thanks Outpost!

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BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
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GC Gas Check