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Thread: Any pre-turbo 7.3 diesel mechanics out there?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brassduck View Post
    pull the return line off the top of injection pump, remove that fitting, try starting the eng. fuel will leak out of fitting hole. if it starts, the fitting you took out is stopped up, from the drive ring in the injection pump coming apart.

    GOOD LUCK
    Why is it that I hope your diagnosis is incorrect?
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  2. #22
    Boolit Master
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    It cranked and died, now it is possible that the injector pump just happened to fail at that exact time, BUT that is the exact symptom of an air leak, 99 out of a hundred times it is in the return line system. If your rig still has the gray T's it is a rare bird and I would bet money that, that is the problem.
    It will start with the air leak and run fine till it sits for a while again, just fill the filter and bleed the system, starting at the schraeder valve, then at a couple of injector lines until a little fuel dribbles out of them. It will not shoot a lot of fuel out like a cummins. Sometimes the pump gets an air lock and this can be a pain. There is down low on the body of the pump a 1/2 inch bolt head, you can loosen this off if you cant get the pump primed and bleed it that way. If you have to do this, just loosen it half a turn or a little more.

    There is no crank or cam sensors on the idi engine to worry about, besides the glow plug ONE wire to the pump makes these babys run.

  3. #23
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
    I never weighed this load. I'd not admit it if I had. Attachment 211256

    That's a 22' trailer. Red oak and Locust.

    Yep. That's a bumper hitch. If you don't load it right, you're gonna have a BAD day.
    You don't have to worry about overloading them old fords, if the tires aren't mashed flat you are good to go. lol

  4. #24
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starmac View Post
    It cranked and died, now it is possible that the injector pump just happened to fail at that exact time, BUT that is the exact symptom of an air leak, 99 out of a hundred times it is in the return line system. If your rig still has the gray T's it is a rare bird and I would bet money that, that is the problem.
    It will start with the air leak and run fine till it sits for a while again, just fill the filter and bleed the system, starting at the schraeder valve, then at a couple of injector lines until a little fuel dribbles out of them. It will not shoot a lot of fuel out like a cummins. Sometimes the pump gets an air lock and this can be a pain. There is down low on the body of the pump a 1/2 inch bolt head, you can loosen this off if you cant get the pump primed and bleed it that way. If you have to do this, just loosen it half a turn or a little more.

    There is no crank or cam sensors on the idi engine to worry about, besides the glow plug ONE wire to the pump makes these babys run.
    This bleed bolt you're talking about, is this on the low pressure transfer pump or . . . .?

    And it does have a cam sensor. Right on top of the cam gear cover with 2 wires coming out of it. I can post pictures if that will help. (?)
    Last edited by Hannibal; 01-07-2018 at 01:02 PM.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master
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    The bleeder bolt I am talking about is down low on the injector pump, there is actually one on each side and hard to get to. If memory serves right it is easiest accessed with a swivel socket. I do not know what it is actually for, I do know if it will start and run with it open, but dies when you close it, it is time for a new pump.
    The cam sensor you are talking about is for a tach, it can not keep the engine from running, in fact not all of them even had one.

  6. #26
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    There is a 'T' fitting on the driver's side of the engine between the left and right bank fuel returns. I presume this is the return to tank line. Is there a check valve contained within that 'T'?

    Went to the parts store and got the return line (install) kit. I've got the right side apart. The 'o' rings were surprisingly soft still. Fuel line itself is cracked and rock hard.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  7. #27
    Boolit Master
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    I'm also going to say air in the high pressure side of the system. It has been a while since I played with the International Harvester systems but the old mechanical systems are about the same. It ran until air was introduced into the high pressure side and stopped. It doesn't take much to prevent it from running.
    You've received good advice; locate the source of the air leak, fix it and bleed the air out of the high pressure side.

    The old Cummins 12 valve systems had a fuel heater that was in-line before the injector pump. That fuel heater was notorious for failing. You could take the heater section out, throw that piece away and re-assemble the unit without the heater. That would permanently eliminate that failure point. The heater was useless anyway.

    The IH systems had their own idiosyncratic behaviors.

  8. #28
    Boolit Mold
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    Petrol & Powder you are correct, there is a rubber line that runs from the fuel filter to back of the injection pump, gets old and cracks. will leak sometimes, when the eng is off it will let air into the low pressure side (fuel filter)and the fuel escapes back into the fuel tank unfortunately you have to remove the intake manifold to change this line. an air leak any where in the system will cause this. being the eng started and than died with the check valve fitting removed the injection pump is probably ok.

  9. #29
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Ok. I've got the 'o' rings, fittings and lines replaced on all 8 injectors. Before I button everything back up, I'd like to test any and all check valves that there are.

    I have 3 return fuel lines. one goes to the fuel filter assembly. I'm pretty sure there is a check valve in the housing where that line connects. (?)

    A second return line goes to the injector pump. Is there a check valve here?

    And the last line runs from a 'T' fitting which is located within the fuel return line that connects the left and right bank. I have removed this 'T' and that is all there is, a simple 'T' fitting, no check valve. I presume this is the return to tank line. Is there a check valve within this line somewhere, and if so, does anybody know it's precise location?

    Thanks to all who have replied. I appreciate your help.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  10. #30
    Boolit Master
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    As far as I know there is no check valve on the return line to the tank, if there is, I have never run across nor heard of any issue with one.

  11. #31
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starmac View Post
    As far as I know there is no check valve on the return line to the tank, if there is, I have never run across nor heard of any issue with one.
    Ok! That's good to know. SO. Did a YouTube search and it seems that the line from the injector pump flows into the return lines, so no check valve there. Seems like all I need to worry about is the filter block. Perhaps I'll just cap it and see if it'll run. Can always hook it back up later.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  12. #32
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  13. #33
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    I would top the filter off, It will eventually self bleed, but it takes a lot of cranking and sometimes the starters don't take it.

    As far as checking the high pressure side, that can be done at the schraeder valve, if it clears up and pumps solid fuel out it should not be sucking air. High pressure is actually low pressure, if you use a gage on the shrader valve, it should have 4 to 6 pounds of pressure, and going from memory to check the flow, you take out the valve core and hook a hose, it should pump a half pint in 20 seconds if I remember right,you better check on the volume, before taking my word.

  14. #34
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starmac View Post
    I would top the filter off, It will eventually self bleed, but it takes a lot of cranking and sometimes the starters don't take it.

    As far as checking the high pressure side, that can be done at the schraeder valve, if it clears up and pumps solid fuel out it should not be sucking air. High pressure is actually low pressure, if you use a gage on the shrader valve, it should have 4 to 6 pounds of pressure, and going from memory to check the flow, you take out the valve core and hook a hose, it should pump a half pint in 20 seconds if I remember right,you better check on the volume, before taking my word.
    Well, I got everything back together. Made sure I have fuel and no air at the filter housing schrader valve. Still only cranks and won't fire. I have fuel at the return liine on the injector pump. Tried 5x for 20 seconds or so, then let sit 10 min to give the starter time to cool. Cracked the #1 injector line and it gets damp, but doesn't seem to have any pressure. I'll try again tomorrow, but I'm beginning to wonder if the injector pump has failed.

    The thing that bothered me about this to begin with is when it started, it ran perfectly for 2 seconds. Never sounded better. And when it died, it died just like I'd shut the key off. No rough running or anything. Just door nail dead instantly. I have checked the fuel shut-off solenoid, and I can hear it click when I disconnect and reconnect it with the key on.
    Last edited by Hannibal; 01-08-2018 at 01:45 PM.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  15. #35
    Boolit Master
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    You have air in the injector lines. Loosen ALL of them, crank the engine to bleed the air out and then tighten them. Once you get it running, go back and loosen/retighten them one at a time while the engine is running.

  16. #36
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petrol & Powder View Post
    You have air in the injector lines. Loosen ALL of them, crank the engine to bleed the air out and then tighten them. Once you get it running, go back and loosen/retighten them one at a time while the engine is running.
    Allright, I'll try this tomorrow. Off to work this afternoon.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master
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    I agree you still have air in the lines and injectors, sometimes they can be a royal pain, but once you do get it running, there is no reason to go back and re bleed the lines, it is self bleeding with the return line setup it has and should clear up in seconds by itself.
    It is possible that your injector pump has called it quits, but I wouldn't give up on it yet. And you will never see anything like the pressure you would expect from cracking a line.
    Are you getting white smoke out of your exhaust, while cranking?

  18. #38
    Boolit Mold
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    let me start over :does it have an electrical or mechanical lift pump? you need to determine if it's working. on top of the fuel filter is bleed valve. open this valve and crank the eng until ya get a stream of fuel to come out, not bubbles but a solid stream of fuel these can be a bear to get the air out of injection pump and lines if ya don't get solid fuel into the injection pump
    GOOD LUCK

  19. #39
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starmac View Post
    I agree you still have air in the lines and injectors, sometimes they can be a royal pain, but once you do get it running, there is no reason to go back and re bleed the lines, it is self bleeding with the return line setup it has and should clear up in seconds by itself.
    It is possible that your injector pump has called it quits, but I wouldn't give up on it yet. And you will never see anything like the pressure you would expect from cracking a line.
    Are you getting white smoke out of your exhaust, while cranking?
    No white smoke. Nothing visable from the exhaust at all.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

  20. #40
    Boolit Master Hannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brassduck View Post
    let me start over :does it have an electrical or mechanical lift pump? you need to determine if it's working. on top of the fuel filter is bleed valve. open this valve and crank the eng until ya get a stream of fuel to come out, not bubbles but a solid stream of fuel these can be a bear to get the air out of injection pump and lines if ya don't get solid fuel into the injection pump
    GOOD LUCK
    It has a machanical lift pump, and I have established it is working by removing a line at the filter housing and observing fuel squirt a foot or so out the line in pulses while cranking. I also vented the air from the filter housing using the schrader valve. Only took a few seconds to vent.
    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.

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