WidenersGraf & SonsLee PrecisionMidSouth Shooters Supply
Titan ReloadingInline FabricationRotoMetals2StainLess Steel Media

Page 1 of 8 12345678 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 159

Thread: Long shots are for bad hunters, article

  1. #1
    Boolit Master


    blikseme300's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Deep South Texas, RGV
    Posts
    1,532

    Long shots are for bad hunters, article

    I was digging around looking for an article I recalled and found it here: http://gunsmagazine.com/1962issues/G0262.pdf

    IMO the points made are too true and still applicable today. The well-used language is to the point and will only hurt the feelings of those to which it applies. I really like the unit of measurement the author calls the "Hunters Yard".

    "This unit has no precise linear dimension. Unlike the old English, which is pretty well pegged to a prosaic longitudinal of 36 inches, the Hunter's is remarkably resilient. It contracts and expands, depending upon the telling. This makes it an exceedingly versatile unit for the tall-tale teller."
    Liberalism is the triumph of emotion over intellect, but masquerading as the reverse.

    I don't know how we ever shot maximum loads before P/C come along and saved us all. R5R

    "No mosque in the United States flies an American flag."

  2. #2
    Vendor Sponsor

    Smoke4320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Right here ..at least I was a minute ago
    Posts
    3,810
    Not near as good as "MY" fish measurer though .. Hold out ONLY your right hand ..real wide now . fish was this long
    I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!

    http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH

    Selling Hi Quality Powdercoating Powder

    PULSAR night vision and thermal dealer !!!
    PM me for a good deal

    I am not crazy my mom had me tested

    Theres a fine line between genius and crazy .. I'm that line
    and depending on the day I might just step over that line !!!

  3. #3
    Boolit Master



    M-Tecs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    4,837
    "DON'T LET TALL TALES OF LONG RANGE KILLS BY EXPERTS MISLEAD YOU INTO ATTEMPTING SHOTS BEYOND YOUR SKILL"

    The opening statement sums it up perfectly. For some their skill level allows for what would be considered very long shots by most yet for other their skill levels means the shots have to be very close. A hunter shooting beyond their abilities is a bad hunter period.

    Today laser range finders eliminate "Hunters Yards".

  4. #4
    Boolit Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    4,398
    ^...'ding-ding'...well spoken! Nuff said!
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

    2018 is going to be a 'Jaw-Dropping Year' . . . 'The Year', the World was born to live . . .
    just, "watch your 6" .

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
    dragon813gt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Somewhere in SE PA
    Posts
    8,941
    Quote Originally Posted by M-Tecs View Post
    DON'T LET TALL TALES OF LONG RANGE KILLS BY EXPERTS MISLEAD YOU INTO ATTEMPTING SHOTS BEYOND YOUR SKILL

    The opening statement sums it up perfectly. For some their skill level allows for what would be considered very long shots by most yet for other their skill levels means the shots have to be very close. A hunter shooting beyond their abilities is a bad hunter period.
    Pretty much sums up my thoughts exactly. Shots here are almost always under 100 yards. The terrain doesn't allow for longer shots. Yet somehow you will hear multiple shots in quick succession. 100 yards is not a long shot and should be well w/in every hunters capabilities. But it definitely isn't. The progression goes: one shot; got it, two shots; maybe, three shots; see you next year.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northwest Ohio
    Posts
    8,891
    Dirty Harry summed it up well. A man has to know "his" limitations. Not the neighbors or the writers or the experts but His.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Lake Havasu City, Arizona
    Posts
    16,522
    Goes along with those "bughole....dime size" groups we read about.....

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG952017122395005814.jpg 
Views:	49 
Size:	44.6 KB 
ID:	211153

    ......
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
    CastingFool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Climax, Michigan
    Posts
    1,593
    When I am deerhunting, and hear 3 or more shots, I know the first shot missed, and then the "hunter" is shooting at a running deer.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Southwest MO.
    Posts
    1,686
    I can nearly always cover my first shot with a dime.
    Some people live and learn but I mostly just live

  10. #10
    Boolit Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    4,398
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfer View Post
    I can nearly always cover my first shot with a dime.
    That's funny...never thought of it that way...I guess that finding where it went so you can cover it with a dime is the real trick!
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

    2018 is going to be a 'Jaw-Dropping Year' . . . 'The Year', the World was born to live . . .
    just, "watch your 6" .

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    The Pacific NorthWet
    Posts
    1,093
    Eastern Washington Varmint hunting, you can't hardly ever cover your first shot with a dime; This is because a .243 87 grain BTHP hitting a rockchuck makes a hole that is about 99% the diameter of said rockchuck. So maybe 5-6" diameter. Just a couple sinew (at a guess) strings holding the end pieces together in mutual, messy orbit. Humane as heck.

    Same basic "the middle of the 'Chuck vaporized" results for 223 or 25-06 or whatever. Or 22LR at closer ranges

    You wouldn't want to hike for miles with a heavy barreled varminting rifle, tho, it's NOT a sporter. NOT light. My current one's lighter than I like but at least I have that...

    Grew up shooting and hitting a chuck sunning on a basalt rock - your target area is just a 5" or so frontal view of the chuck at an estimated 500 yards, if you can HIT it, with a nice crosswind, holding over the amount your expertise tells you to hold over - I submit that you are doing pretty darn well on range estimation and windage estimation. Since the drop at that range for what we loaded back then is on the order of 38.2" under the crosshairs for our H414, 3170? FPS loads; About 67 inches at 600 yards and we made most of those shots too.

    You don't shoot deer at the same ranges, sure. Didn't mean we didn't shoot sometimes a fast 2nd or 3rd round (easier to nail multiple chucks during the same short time frame, the darn things get paranoid for some reason and go hide, then you have to wait for them to pop back up. Gives the rifle time to cool off LOL)

    If you practice with hard targets it does motivate you to get it right. I doubt I can shoot that well right now - Out of practice. Give me a couple months. Good teachers helped a LOT. Good gear & a good rest helped too. If you want to do something about shooting better, how about finding longer range varmints to shoot and picking on them and being an ambassador for long range shooting, instead of worrying about those who can't hit the side of a barn from inside said barn?

    Pics of that general area so you can see why I'm saying 600 yards is possible, heck, further's possible... It'd take a laser to do line of sight tho LOL

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channeled_Scablands

    http://www.sevenwondersofwashingtons...scablands.html

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvGdASocTn0 Patrick Steward narrating some TV show but shows the landscape

    Planning to move back closer to there here I think

  12. #12
    Boolit Master



    M-Tecs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    4,837
    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
    I find it interesting that the posts within threads like these mirror the pre-conceived notions of the posters and NEVER contain any factual data of any kind.

    It's like asking 'What's the best deer rifle?'

    Sheeeesh.
    What factual date did you post? Not sure what you are expecting but how do you factually quantify that as a shooter you shouldn't shoot beyond your abilities?????????? Sheeeeeesh!

    Missing the target is not the worst thing you can do.
    Not taking the shot is.
    Missing is not a problem. Wounding an animal is!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by M-Tecs; 01-06-2018 at 03:06 AM.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Wasilla, Alaska
    Posts
    195
    Quote Originally Posted by CastingFool View Post
    When I am deerhunting, and hear 3 or more shots, I know the first shot missed, and then the "hunter" is shooting at a running deer.
    One of my early deer hunting mentors used to say, "One shot, meat. Two shots, maybe meat. Three shots, no meat."
    Only left handed guns are interesting!

  14. #14
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    52
    Quote Originally Posted by CastingFool View Post
    When I am deerhunting, and hear 3 or more shots, I know the first shot missed, and then the "hunter" is shooting at a running deer.
    Not always the case here...The open areas I used to hunt regularly had lots of deer that traveled in herds up to a dozen or more in numbers and numerous tags available so a string of shots just meant that the butchering job was going to take a while...and there were always area "pioneers" that were up in age and unable to hunt for themselves and were very appreciative of a fresh quarter of venison every once in a while "just to help them out"

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
    white eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    565.5 miles E.of Wall Drug
    Posts
    4,706
    I remember firing 3 shots once but I had 3 deer to show for it
    the title Long shots are for bad hunters,is misleading there are folks
    that can and do make some gawd awfully long shots and are very good at
    it I am not one of those people
    my longest at a game animal was 215 yds and to some that is close
    Hit em'hard
    hit em'often

  16. #16
    Boolit Master ammohead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    McGill, NV
    Posts
    1,100
    Some factual information. The time from when a hunter commits to taking the shot till when the sear breaks is about .3 seconds. The amount of time it takes a 140gr bullet from a 6.5 Creedmoor to travel 800 yards is approx 1 full second. 1.3 seconds is enough time for a deer to take two steps forward and you just gut shot him. No amount of practice, exterior ballistics data and wind doping is going to bring that bullet back. That should be enough fact to make any hunter do some serious soul searching before taking that shot. But we now have hunting shows that promote this very thing. So much so that a 800 yard shot at a bull elk is on many hunters bucket list.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
    JSnover's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Bensalem, PA
    Posts
    3,347
    Quote Originally Posted by ammohead View Post
    1.3 seconds is enough time for a deer to take two steps forward and you just gut shot him. No amount of practice, exterior ballistics data and wind doping is going to bring that bullet back. That should be enough fact to make any hunter do some serious soul searching before taking that shot.
    ^^ That.
    I don't like long shots for the same reason I don't like head shots. Even at 150 yards if an animal turns its head as the shot breaks, the best you can hope for is a clean miss.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Lake Havasu City, Arizona
    Posts
    16,522
    As long as they end up killing the animal it seems ok these days. Watch the hunting shows (rifle and bow) on tv and a gut shot or mid section shot seems to be the norm. While I have taken a few "long" shots on big game because it was the only choice left I am well practiced at long range shooting. I also won't shoot unless I am confident of putting the bullet into the vital heart lung zone. I also don't shoot beyond the effective range my ability and the terminal performance of the bullet.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    God's country - WI.
    Posts
    917
    I agree with the premise of the article, although modern cartridges have moved the lines a bit.
    But only a bit.

    When I hear some local bar room hero bragging about the long shots he's made on game animals, I'm not impressed but rather disgusted. I'd love to take some of those people out to uneven terrain, set an 8.5 x 11 target at unknown range and differing elevation somewhere just short of their "five hunnert yard" boasting distance. Then I'd ask them to bet $100 that they could hit that target with one shot with their regular hunting rifle. No bench, no sandbags, nothing that they didn't have with them on the day of their big achievement. If I could pick a day with variable winds that would add to the education factor.

    Most of them couldn't judge range to that target within a hundred yards, or tell you within three feet what the required holdover for "old Betsy" would be at whatever range they guessed. Wind drift is even tougher, since there's no guarantee the wind out there is the same as the wind at the shooting point, especially in mountainous terrain. Hitting that target, even for an expert, would be a tough challenge for the first shot at ranges much over 300 yards.

    I doubt that many who boast of their long-range hunting prowess would commit to betting a C-note on one shot under the conditions I've described, but by their own words they're willing to risk inflicting a long-suffering agonizing death on a fine game animal under similar circumstances. That pretty much tells you everything you need to know about them.

    Disgust might be not quite the right word. Contempt fits better.

    Uncle R.

  20. #20
    Vendor Sponsor

    Smoke4320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Right here ..at least I was a minute ago
    Posts
    3,810
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfer View Post
    I can nearly always cover my first shot with a dime.
    I can cover every group I have ever shot with a dime ..
    Just hold the dime up to the back of the scope .. works every time
    I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!

    http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH

    Selling Hi Quality Powdercoating Powder

    PULSAR night vision and thermal dealer !!!
    PM me for a good deal

    I am not crazy my mom had me tested

    Theres a fine line between genius and crazy .. I'm that line
    and depending on the day I might just step over that line !!!

Page 1 of 8 12345678 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check