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Thread: Hunting accuracy from fast twist (1-10) barrel at full jacketed velocity?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterAZ View Post
    Hi outdoorfan,

    I use this boolit from accurate http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_...=30-190P-D.png It is designed for paper patching, and Iv'e been shooting it in a stock M700 30-06 with more than just acceptable results. I size to .301 and double wrap with green bar printer paper. I then lightly lube the patch with White Label BAC, and size again to .310. Iv'e been using just range scrap alloy for this which is dead soft. My powder of choice is Winchester 760. Other slow powders worked well too, but I settled on 760 for my loads. I started with the minimum jacketed charge for the weight, and worked up. I pretty much followed P-Dawgs instructions in the stickies here and it worked out well for me. The boolit does not blow up on game, and is very, very accurate. And yes, it gives velocities "close" to jacketed full velocity loads. Obviously there are more than a few ways to skin this cat, but this has worked well for me in my rifle. Sounds like you were on the right track before, so you will realize that some experimentation (boolit diameter and patch thickness) will be necessary to achieve what your'e looking for.
    Paper patching giving you a really good bullet and accuracy if you do it all correctly. Thing is I hatepatching patching because for me it's too gawd awful slow. LOL

  2. #22
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterAZ View Post
    Hi outdoorfan,

    I use this boolit from accurate http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_...=30-190P-D.png It is designed for paper patching, and Iv'e been shooting it in a stock M700 30-06 with more than just acceptable results. I size to .301 and double wrap with green bar printer paper. I then lightly lube the patch with White Label BAC, and size again to .310. Iv'e been using just range scrap alloy for this which is dead soft. My powder of choice is Winchester 760. Other slow powders worked well too, but I settled on 760 for my loads. I started with the minimum jacketed charge for the weight, and worked up. I pretty much followed P-Dawgs instructions in the stickies here and it worked out well for me. The boolit does not blow up on game, and is very, very accurate. And yes, it gives velocities "close" to jacketed full velocity loads. Obviously there are more than a few ways to skin this cat, but this has worked well for me in my rifle. Sounds like you were on the right track before, so you will realize that some experimentation (boolit diameter and patch thickness) will be necessary to achieve what your'e looking for.

    Thanks for sharing!

  3. #23
    Boolit Master
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    Aug 2007
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    363
    Outdoorfan, there are different alloys of cerrosafe, those which shrink, expand, or are neutral. You might want to find out which your 'smith is using. Their website will have info on percentage of shrinkage or expansion for each alloy so you can figure actual size.

    As for full-steam velocities, I experimented with an 8x57mm, shooting a PP'd H&G .312 cast version of the 173gr spritzer service boolit. As a bare boolit, accuracy went south beyond 1500fps or so in various .30's, which is typical of long-ogive cast, but PP'ing it decreases its unsupported ogive length and increases its bearing surface. It gives me 2" at 100 yards over 48gr of Rel 19 in the 8x57. Other .30 molds exhibit the same effect when patched to the 8mm throat. I vote for PP because it increases the range of usable (soft) alloys and the velocities they can be driven to. For your purposes, might I suggest the Lyman 311407, a 180gr Loverin design amenable to easy sizing to finished diameter after patching and having the advantage of a meplat of .08 or .10, from the look of it. Another candidate is 311041, allegedly 173gr, but mine cast of WW are 180gr. The bore dia. nose handily patches up to groove diameter in a .30, thus increasing engagement length to approx. 80% of physical length, but which also means adjustments in OAL. These are not heavy-for-caliber, but they do work well.

    The paper I use is 100% cotton drafting vellum available in art supply places or online, usually .0025", two wraps for .30, three for 8mm. Strips are cut from the narrow edge (the end) of the sheet to provide stretch when wet and shrinkage on drying. I no longer use a twisted tail, instead patching from the heel on a GC design to half way up the ogive and wiping the last 1/2" end of patch with wood glue (gluing paper to paper) to keep it in place. Shrinkage below the bottom driving band prevents the patch from slipping when seating. Gas checks can be applied, but do not seem to improve accuracy. With a worn throat, they will allow the boolit to be seated a touch farther out and still have good retention in the case.
    Last edited by yeahbub; 01-10-2018 at 06:17 PM.

  4. #24
    Boolit Master
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    I didn't know that there are variations with cerrosafe.

    Thanks for your suggestions and tips!

  5. #25
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by outdoorfan View Post
    Who has successfully gotten usable hunting accuracy (especially past 100 yards) at full jacketed velocity? I want to hear about it: cartridge, boolit, velocity, accuracy.

    I tried a little paper patching several years ago. I gave up on it, but looking at my load notes, it appears that I may have been close to what I was looking for. Anyway, I just obtained a new 30-06, and my interest in finding a high velocity pp load for it (for hunting purposes) has been renewed. But I'm kinda wondering how many people have actually found a stable load with usable accuracy.

    If I can't reasonably obtain what I want at full jacketed velocity then I might as well go the regular cast method.

    Thanks for your input!
    Gas check and powder coating should give you what you are after. I know it can in 308W. You will probably need to add some copper to keep bullet together due to spin rate but accuracy does drop off the higher velocity you go past the optimum speed. People all over the world have used cast bullets for every animal out there so with the proper fit to barrel and chamber you should be able to do the same thing. Get the fit, its a key.

  6. #26
    Boolit Master
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    Full jacketed in my mind is ~2700 fps from a 180 grainer in 30-06. Maybe 2500-2550 from a 200 grainer.
    Outdoorfan - Always go to a vendors loading data website instead of posts guessing what you want.
    To this end - Hodgdon/IMR loading data website rifles - put your bullet weights in and you'll get a lot of TESTED information ... http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle
    For teasers, the fastest velocity of a 180gr bullet is:
    180 GR. SIE SPBT
    Hodgdon
    Suprform
    .308"
    3.300"
    54.0
    2,628
    46,200 PSI
    59.7
    2,840
    57,600 PSI
    Regards
    John

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check