Working ladder loads in the winter

[adam_mac84]

It is the time of year here in the great north where outdoor shooting is less desirable.

My range is outdoors. I have no problem bundling up to shoot, but my concern is for working up new loads for next shooting season.

Avg outdoor daily temp for Dec/Jan is probably 20-35*. I will usually try to shoot 32* and above. I would like to work up a couple of loads for my 9mm and my 223. Do you take precautions for ammo? I had thought about packaging in an igloo cooler with some heat packs until right before I shoot my 10 sho strings.

Previously had good loads that I just loaded to minor for competition. I would like to spend some time this winter working something up with accuracy in mind over PF.

Have not found a local range happy with handloads yet... Most local range to me actually checks ammo boxes

Overthinking it?

Powders:
Titegroup
W321/HP38
WSF
H335

[JBinMN]

For "me", an "Average Joe", but living in a similar climate to you. "My" answer. is,"No. Not gonna do it".


Are ya, "Overthinking it?"

Up to you.. YMMV they say...

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I do not do ladder test loads for either accuracy, chronograph data, or both, after the temps go below 32F/0C.. I put the chronograph away after it got that temp. ( freezing) or below. I still record some of the accuracy, but not during "ladder tests", but just shooting and recording when I see a pattern or a likely pattern with what was already loaded.

I do not consider it to be worth my time, nor am I willing to accept the data, without more than one test to verify such data. { IOW, I would feel as though I would have to repeat the test too many times before I would accept the data as having merit, due to the variables that can be associated with colder temps.} Meaning, the firearm(s) may not behave the same when cold as it would when warmer, neither may the powder or any other components we use involved, like primers/ case/etc.. Materials usually contract with cold & expand with heat. So, I do not think that in my "Average Joe" usage, it is important enough to document & keep track of specifics too much under those sort of conditions.

If you are in a climate where the "normal" is cold or within a certain temperature range, then perhaps you may be interested in doing it. Or, perhaps you are in competition with others where it might be important.
Other than that, "I" just go shoot & wait for times where the temps are more "average" than any extremes...

Let me counter with a question back...

Would you go ladder test where you live if the temps were around 90-100F and then keep the data to fire loads you make in the colder temps?


G'Luck! & very interesting question. I am interested in what others say, who are likely more educated on such things. Although , I do not intend to change my own thinking. It is gonna have to be some special info to make me change my mind on testing in temps that are at extremes for an "Average Joe" shooter/reloader/etc. to get me to change my mind anyway...
LOL



ETA: I forgot to mention "Hunting loads". If one is going to be using your own reloads in the sort of climate that you would be hunting in, that would make me consider doing some accuracy testing for those types of temperatures. That would be the only case in which I would likely "ladder test" for accuracy, most likely just for accuracy & not for speed/etc. with a chronograph. Same as altitude. If I were at 1000 ft & was going to hunt at 7500 ft., I would likely want to do some accuracy testing of the firearm & loads I was using once I was at that higher altitude. Other than that, back to what I said before. No testing in what is not "normal or usual" climate for my own "Ave. Joe" shooting.

[tazman]

Just last fall I developed a load for my 308 that gave great groups when the temperature was around 30-40 degrees. I fired some of them this summer at 80-90 degrees. Not only did they fail to group, they showed severe pressure signs. I had to tear down about 30 rounds I had left over.
Your heat pack idea may work but you will need to get your gun up to temperature as well. Even then the results will be suspect and will need to be checked in warmer days for safety and consistency.
Accurate loads in cold weather will undoubtedly be different than accurate loads in warm weather.
Having a range that restricts your ammo stinks. I guess I am fortunate not to have that problem.

[country gent]

A lot also depends on what powders your loading some are more temp sensitive than others. A lot of the newer powders have coatings that help to stop temp changes in pressures. A lot of ball powders are worse for temp changes. The vitavori 500 series was advertised as temp insensitive, Varget is also less sensitive to temps.

[runfiverun]

the only thing I change is my lube.
I don't really do a lot of accuracy testing when it's cold, but I will go shooting quite a bit.
I have the place to myself most of the time and I enjoy the solitude.
I don't enjoy wading through the snow to the targets or looking for brass so much.

[leeggen]

Adam Mc84 come to Tn. and we will set you up out to 425 yd. You never nead to leave the driveway. We might even find a board watcher that can radio the hits back to us from that far out. Welcome anytime, 300 from house to first target then a short walk on to the 425. If I will cut a few trees down we could get 600 plus. Temp here is bettter than up there by several degrees. We are to have mid 40's to mid 50's tomorrow. We could setup at the goat field and get a little more distance by using the neighbors field we could probably hit 1000yd. Mostly flat out there. The wife says she won't even charge you for the use of the range.HAHA
CD
CD

[WRideout]

When my cannon battalion from Santa Barbara (CA Army National Guard) went to Minnesota for winter training, we borrowed 8" M110 howitzers from the training site at Camp Ripley. One of the requirements for computing firing data is to check the propellant temperature, which is seldom done out West, because it doesn't change much. In Minnesota in February, it was a lot different. The first round of HE fell waaay short, almost out of the buffer zone. Then they checked the prop temp. Once that was figured in they had safe rounds in the impact area the rest of the time.

In shooting for accuracy, consistency is king. I wouldn't use the heat packs because the temperature can be all over the place by the time you get your rounds down range.

Wayne

[brewer12345]

So what is a reasonable temp to test at? In the summer it might be 90 when I go to the range. Fri it was 9 degrees when I arrived at my hunting spot. Split the difference and test on 50 degree days?

[tazman]

Unfortunately there is no temperature that gives good results for all the extremes. Do your testing during the temps you are going to be shooting the most.
For safety, do some testing during hot weather. If your powder is temp sensitive, safe loads in hot weather will still be safe in cold weather. You may get a different impact point in cold weather is all.
If you are going to use the loads hunting in cold weather, do some testing in cold weather to make sure they are still accurate enough for your purposes.