45-70 load workable?

[murf205]

It MIGHT not hurt so much if the butt plate on my 1895 CB Marlin was replaced with a super soft pad but I want to keep it original except for the Skinner sight. The stock lever hurts my hand as well but I can put a DRC glove loop lever on it and still have the stock one too. The heavy load is a handful in my sons Ruger #1 a well. Yeah, I guess I'm a bit wimpy in my old age but so be it! I don't care who you are, you can shoot the lighter loads more accurately.
armednfree, you are right to build muscle memory with the rifle and there is a lot to be said for fast, but remember, fast is good but fast and accurate is golden. Good luck brother.

[rhouser]

If PAST is still making it's should recoil pads, they are an answer. So are the slip on or lace on recoil pads. The leather lace on's look good with the lever guns. All will extend the pull length, so there is that issue.

As above in my post (and the others), I prefer to just load to my comfort and the need based by situation.

v/r rch

[W.R.Buchanan]

Limbsaver has a Slip on Recoil Pad that works really well and I have several mounted on guns that I don't want to put a permanent Pad on.

My .45-70 has a Pachmayer Decelerator on it and it along with a Mercury Recoil Reducer plus it's extra 1 lb of weight the recoil has cut down the recoil of that 325 gr load I talked about above. Like I said that one is running about 1550-1600 fps so it is nothing to sneeze at, but I can still shoot 40 of them in a silhouette match with no after effects.

When I installed the pad I set up the disc sander so as to generate about a 5 degree angle on the sides of the pad This increased the area that contacts my shoulder so as to spread out the force over a larger area. Not a big deal but every little bit helps.

The other pic is the Limbsaver Slip on Pad mounted on my Enfield #4Mk1 which I didn't want to alter. These slip on pads work really well and they are available at Walmart for $20

Randy

[Edward]

I've fired 55 grains of H322 behind a Remington 400. No, it is not something you want to spend a great deal of time behind. But I didn't buy the rifle for powder puff loads.

Now, will I shoot lower loads just practicing, exactly. But pump it up for hunting.

That boolit don"t need pumping @ 1300 FPS nothin walks that it will not kill in this USA ,and I mean Thumping to 200yds !Try it with whatever stuff you think is boolit proof you will get educated , 24-26 grain of 2400 and thats all takes . By the way my 534 grain pure lead in my C Sharps does that @ 800 yds all day long@ 1250FPS /Just sayin Ed

[richhodg66]

I have considered that but research seems to say that reduced loads don't work real well. Plus the fact that the rifles are very expensive and heavy.


Now tell me about these button bullets and Trailboss. Could save some lead and still do the practice I want.

I've actually been playing with a .458 doing just that. Dad gave me a big can of Lyman 330 grain bullets, tumble lubed and shot in front of about 16 grains of Unique is pretty accurate and are a hoot to shoot.

Always wondered about wanting to turn the .45-70 into something it's not. Trapdoor loads will flatten a T Rex. The only thing you gain by increased velocity might be a bit of effective range, but if that's a concern, get a .30-06 and be done with it.

[W.R.Buchanan]

All you really gain by increasing the velocity is a Flatter Trajectory.

When I developed my Standard load of 33 gr of 5744 with the RCBS .45-300FNGC (325gr) I started at 25 gr and the trajectory was like a rainbow. So I increased the powder charges 2 gr at a time until I got to 33 gr which gave me a Reasonably Flat trajectory I could use for Short Range Silhouette. The recoil increased in noticeable increments as I increased the charge weights. I tried 35 gr but it was just a little too much with no real gain in flatness. Velocity on this load is between 1550-1600 fps which is nothing to sneeze at.

As it sits with the gun sighted at 150 yards it is about 1" high at 50, 2" high at 100 and 12" low at 200. This means I can shoot the Chickens, Pigs and Turkeys with the Mechanical Zero and then come up 6 MOA (two revolutions of the knob) for the Rams. then back to Mechanical Zero when done. The Lyman 66LA sight allows this to repeat everytime as it has a zero stop so the slide can be released and simply moved back to the original position without having to actually turn the elevation knob.

As you can see this load and setup yields everything you need from a .45-70 until you hunt really big animals. then a .45-405 FNGC mould would be the answer. Obviously similar boolits to these would act the same as large .45 cal boolits all tend to be pretty much the same thing with little differences.

The OP was looking for 1700+ fps and where as this is entirely possible it is just not necessary, and virtually everyone who has chimed in has made that same statement, however the beauty of the free world is you can do whatever you want.

In the shotgun forum there are numerous slugs being made that can be pushed up to 16-1700 fps easily. They are the same kind of Butt Kickers the 400 gr boolits are. (1oz.= 437 gr) You can even buy them already loaded. They hurt me badly! and I only shot 2!

Brian Pearce did and article on loading the .45-70 in Marlin Rifles in the August 2005 issue of Handloader magazine.(best issue ever!) I have used this article as my main source for reloading data for this round as he covered pretty much every base known to man. He had one load that he shot a Cape Buffalo with that not only went clean thru the bull he was aiming at but killed a cow behind it. That load was a 400 gr Belt Mountain Punch Solid (solid brass) running at 2200 fps! Brian is about 6'5" and weighs about 280 and he also shoots heavy recoiling rifles frequently so he could take the hit.

That load would break my shoulder, but it might be worth it just once!

Randy

[Petander]

Hello,long time no post really. Not much casting lately,I apologize.

1895 Marlin got me interested in casting almost 20 years ago. I had a great time with all kinds of loads,ranging from suppressed subsonics to unnecessarily hot (read=fun) loads.

Quick Load shows me a cast 420 grainer @ chronoed 1900 fps. My other favorite thumper was from a Robert Applegate 460 grainer mold @ 1700 fps. Both were using Vihtavuori N130 powder. I also used a Hornady 350 FN @ 2080 fps. Thousands and thousands of boolits downrange , I had a nice 1" recoil pad in the stock.

I sold my Marlin a couple of years ago and now I feel I need one again. Not so much for close range moose hunting because I don't have a moose dog anymore... but simply for casting fun. Most probably with milder loads than I used to enjoy. I hunt with mostly .30 cal and 7 mm and use cast for .30 subs. But I used to cast for a dozen calibers at least.

Is casting coming back to one's life when geezerism hits?

[cb shooter]

In my Winchester/Miroku 1886 carbine i load the Lyman#457191 (292 grains in ww air cooled)ahead of 9.5 gr. Bullseye, and it is good enough for the 200 meter rams. I don't know the velocity but it is a pleasant load to shoot and it shoots to the carbine sights.

[mehavey]

tell me about these button bullets....

See https://thefiringline.com/forums//sh...d.php?t=560894
(It's Red Dot, but what the heck...)

If loading down a 458, think heavier/longer bullet
See https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...33&postcount=3

But quite frankly, I'm with all the others here that find original 45-70/BP horse-killer loads to more than suffice.

[pmer]

In my 1895 Marlin with micro grove barrel when I feel the need I can get a little over 2000fps with a 400 grain cast boolet and if that is not enough for you I have gotten over 1800fps with a 500 grain cast boolet. All with no leading and good enough to shoot coyotes at around 200 yards. I have loaded anything from a .457 round ball up to the hot 500 grain load with IMR3031 and been happy.
Steve

Plus one using imr 3031. I'm not sure about using hollow bases at this level but I have stopped using 2400, 4198, RL 7 since Goodsteel remarked about how well 3031 was doing for him at Marlin levels of velocity. The kick from 3031 and 4064 is not the same as 2400 etc. Give your shoulder a Christmas present and try 3031. Accuracy is no problem too.
A big charge of 3031 and a 50/50 air cooled 405 grain gas checked booiit passed through my Russian Boar like it wasn't there.

[Motor]

I looked to the Lee 340gr for a mild alternative to my 300gr JHP upper end loading in my Marlin 1895 Guide Gun. I'm powder coating the Lee and using a near start load (Trapdoor data) from the Lyman cast handbook.

I'd call it a great success. The slower heavier boolit shoots the same POI at 50 yards as the hot 300gr HP and is about 3" low at 100 yards.

Motor

ETA: I'd have to check my card file to be sure but I'm pretty sure I'm actually using IMR-3031 for this cast boolit load.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I hope the OP is still watching this thread as there is a ton of good info here as well as a vast amount of hard won experience.

Oh,,, and Merry Christmas to all of you!!!!

Randy

[Strtspdlx]

I'm watching this. I'm eagerly waiting my fid casrd so I can go pick up my rifle and some 3031 powder. Lots of good info here. Very excited to give some.of it a try.

[Motor]

I apologize. I'm not using IMR-3031 with the Lee 340gr in my Marlin 1895 Guide Gun. I'm actually using IMR-4198.

I'm using 34gr which is a start load for a 330gr boolit. (There isn't data for 340gr) I do want to point out though that the start load for IMR-3031 is 43gr and is actually the load that's in bold type which means it's potentially the most accurate load.

I'm sure the reason I went with IMR-4198 is: 1) I only use it in 45-70 and .223 both of which use a limited amount, one by virtue of limited use. 2) I would need 9 more grains of the 3031 and still be 100fps slower than the 4198 load. 3) I have hungry milsurp rifles that simply love the 3031 so I save it for them.

Motor