My feelings also. Remember, we can't out give God! He always give us much more!Originally Posted by Preacher Jim
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My feelings also. Remember, we can't out give God! He always give us much more!
Maker of Silver Boolits for Werewolf hunting
I believe religion is a persons own relationship with God and should be private. What you give at church is based on what you feel you want to give. You give what you can and go home with an unburdened heart.
we tithe but like some, do not like what the stewards of that tithe do with it so our tithe is not the 10%, we make up for it by giving to organizations that we feel use the money wisely, all are charities that help children directly.
Jesus is free. Any church that says you HAVE to give so much is not preaching from the Bible. I've read it through and there are clear examples of 10% being suggested, but I am not even convinced it was a law in the Mosaic law. (Biblical scholars can point me to a chapter and verse.)
I think the principle we miss is that God has no need of your money. He wants a relationship with us. He is perfect and can't have that relationship with us due to our shortcomings. Jesus is that filter between us and God. If we accept Jesus, God looks at us and sees Jesus.
We should give because we have been given something we could not hope to pay for.
I'm a Happy Clinger.
I dont tithe to my church most of the time. Sometimes I'll give a couple bucks at the dinner we have once a month, but not a specific amount. If im not mistaken, you're supposed to tithe 10% of your increase. That is after bills, food, tax, gas if you ask me. So if you have 100 dollars left at the end of your financial month, you should tithe 10 dollars. I dont do that normally. But what I do is follow what I feel God wants me to do. If I feel lead to give of money or time or items, Then I try to do that. Sometimes its hard to follow what you think you feel God is leading you to do.
Personally I see that giving of time and talents is a greater gift than to give money, and should count MORE than any monetary gifts.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...=Mark+12:41-44
Perhaps I should not be commenting here as I got a bit soured on organized religion many decades ago.
Just as I don't believe giving more to the church buys your way into Heaven, giving less does not keep you out. I do not believe in ratios nor do I believe you should be telling the church how much you gross each month.
Giving of your time and knowledge is a great way to give, as it means your donation is helping your own parish or community. Giving cash means the church can now use your donation anywhere they want for any purpose they want.
I very much like the idea that my charity dollars help those in my local community.
I think it's very admirable to help the church bring the word of God to those sorely in need of it, much of my charitable giving has been to Salvation Army, Good Will, local missions and help centers.
When I was a working stiff and my employment was fairly predictable, I used to give a set dollar amount each month to a charity program set up by my employer, which distributed to a group of charities. You could specify how much went to each individual charity.
By giving to charities not directly governed by organized religion, I felt my money had a better chance of not being used for supporting open borders or amnesty for illegal/criminal aliens.
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms *shall not be infringed*.
"The greatest danger to American freedom is a government that ignores the Constitution."
- Thomas Jefferson
"While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny."
- Rev. Nicholas Collin, Fayetteville Gazette (N.C.), October 12, 1789
if you are looked down on for not giving 10%, you arent in the house of god!
On a side note. When cashiers in stores ask me if I want to donate a dollar to "such and such charity" I say No, Would such and such charity like to donate a dollar to me?. In the book of Acts they shared with everyone as they had need.I have challenged leaders of Congregations with this concept only to be branded as "divisive". I believe that if Jesus were in the flesh today many if not most churches would disparage him and even brand him as someone to stay away from. Such is the deceived state of the supposed "Church". So many people who believe that "they are the ones who are correct" are going to have quite an awakening on judgment day. This is my opinion. And everyone is entitled to my own opinion.
1.Agree/disagree: In most cases, not giving more than 10 percent reflects a lukewarm heart toward God?
2.What is the biggest hindrance to generous giving among Christians? In your own life?
3.Should we give out of obedience even if we don’t feel like it? Isn’t that legalism?
4.If 10 percent isn’t the standard for giving, how do we know when our giving pleases God?
In trying to look up tithe in the bible I have seen some instances for and against. So, at this point I am more confused than before. I have also seen where acts such as donation of time are considered. So, for about everything saying yes 10% I have found others saying no to give what you can afford.
One reference says yes and another says no. Should I flip a coin?
There are multiple chapters and verses. If you look at the whole list of tithes and offerings in the Old Testament you will account for about 30% of income. That is to support: local support for the poor, to support the Levites, (who were given no land for self support) to support the Temple, and to support the Kingdom. This latter tax varied by situation. This would be roughly equivalent to our property taxes (local) sales taxes (local and state) and income taxes plus tithe.
Yes, I have studied it, but my wife did the numbers.
Wayne the Shrink
There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!
What is the Gospel (that Jesus freely died for your sins while you were His enemy) worth to you and what is it worth for that Gospel to be publicly proclaimed so that your neighbor hears it as well so that they too might be saved? That's the criteria for giving. The woman with the mites thought it was worth everything she had.
Supporting the church isn't primarily about providing worldly needs to fellow humans, although that is good and we are commanded to do so. Church is about proclaiming the mercy of God, forgiveness of sins in Christ and eternal life for those who receive that message in faith.
So let's go to the beginning.
1) Cain didn't give what God wanted, then ended up killing the one who did. You decide 'why'.
2) We are first commanded to spread/teach the Word. If we don't support the churches, they will disappear and then who spreads the word? Yes, counties where Christianity is suppressed still have underground churches but WE have the opportunity to flourish without the extreme persecution.
3) Yes, the church leaders can go 'astray' about $$. Aka, temple leaders. Note Jesus's response to that problem.
4) Paul and others worked for a living, yet he did ask for a 'gift' for the Jerusalem church as they had little $$ support.
Your choice.
Edit: some added info for your perusing - https://www.prageru.com/videos/fascism-right-or-left
Last edited by popper; 12-12-2017 at 11:45 AM.
Whatever!
When I run into situations where I am unable to discern from scripture or wise counsel, I tend to spend more time in prayer and seeking what God would have me do. He has called us to a life of peace, so the question to me is what amount and type of giving would allow you to be at peace with God?
You are not giving 10% to your church, you are giving 10% to God. It is his anyway. And I can tell you from experience if you give God the 10% he ask you to give back to him, he will make your finances work out when you don't think they will. This is the only thing God ever tells you to test him with you. He will out give you. It is a hard concept to understand until you try it and find out yourself.
Rosewood
Evangelical, deplorable redneck and proud of it.
One other thing, if you are going to a church, and you are not giving any, how do you expect it to keep it's doors open. It is funded strictly by donations. If you are not giving anything, that means others are having to pick up your slack.
Rosewood
Evangelical, deplorable redneck and proud of it.
Where did the notion of giving a tenth to ‘the church’ come from?
If there’s a scripture to support it I’d like to read it. Personally I think that ones cooked up and perpetuated by ‘the church’.
If you wanna tithe then give it to someone that actually needs it. Most churches have more money than I’ll ever have. Giving my money to someone who has more than I have doesn’t seem like helping the needy to me.
It’s not hard to find a hungry person. It’s not hard to find a little one that really needs some new shoes.
You give to get something in return. Don’t deny it. It’s true.
If you give properly, hiding your left hand from your right then you still get something in return. Blessings from God and a good feeling. Giving to get those things ain’t selfish.
I’ve give to ‘the church’ and I got squat in return. Thinner wallet.
I’ve done things directly, cutting out the middle man, and received a massive return on my investment.
God ain’t a number cruncher when it comes to this. He’s really really good figuring whether you did the best you could with what you have.
He gave you a conscience for a reason. If you haven’t seared it, you don’t need specific guidelines for charity. You just know. A clean heart and clear conscience has no room for greed.
When dealing with islam one should always ask themselves: "What would Leonidas do?"
God issued the challenge to Israel to tithe saying he would in turn bless them with material items. This does not carry over to the Church. The Church does not have the same promises of material prosperity and safety from enemies that Israel was given if she followed the Law.
There are many, many Christians in the world who are dirt poor and severely persecuted. It is not because they don't tithe.
It came from peoples' inability to understand the differences between the Old Covenant and the New and the differences between Israel and the Church.
Maybe the idea of the tithe came from the Old Testament but the gathering as Church and the supporting of the church and the preaching office are all through the New Testament.
Starting in Acts 2 and following you see the believers assembling (churching). The writer of Hebrews exhorts us not to stop gathering together, Hebrews 10:24-25. And the idea of supporting preachers/pastors with material goods is given in Romans 15:27, 1 Corinthians 9:11, and Galatians 6:6 and following to name but a few.
The reason people are miserly when it comes to supporting the church is they don't truly appreciate all the mercy God has shown them nor do they really desire it for their neighbor. In the end we love our worldly goods more than God and our fellow man. We also tend to think faith is a "I heard it one time and now I'm saved and have it all" kind of thing while it is patently obvious in the Scriptures from Israel to the New Testament Church that we have to hear the Word of God over and over and over again or we fall away as we are tempted continually. The devil and our own sinful nature never let up. They fight us all the way to the grave.
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