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Thread: Mauser Bolt Cut/Weld?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master davidheart's Avatar
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    Does anybody have any opinion on this idea? Thank you! (And Lags those are some great looking MN bolts!)

    Quote Originally Posted by davidheart View Post
    .......Using a cuttoff wheel and silver solder seems like a safe way to attached a universal bolt handle without fear of warping the bolt by welding...... I can actually do this sort of job with tools I have readily available in my home. Correct me if I'm wrong but would this just require me:

    1) Cutting the bolt off at the base. (Not flush to the bolt but measured with a small amount of base showing)
    2) Cutting the universal bolt to the shape and size I'd like to attach the remaining base.
    3) Clamp and Silver Solder the bolt and Universal together.
    4) File and smooth to finish.
    5) Profit?
    He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High Will abide in the shadow of the Almighty. -Psalm 91:1

  2. #22
    Boolit Master
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    I have silver soldered bolt handles on a couple of rifles.
    I was never very comfortable with them unless it had a base that actually soldered to the bolt body and not just a piece attached to the bolt handle.
    And as far as heat.
    You still should use a heat countersink and heat stop paste.
    It doesnt go as fast as you would think.
    And the high temperature solders take time to melt.
    They are not like doing soft solder.
    The two MN bolt handles that are bolted on are made out of 1/4" plate steel that was originally just silver soldered in place.
    But the dog legged one came off on a heavy extraction . ( common to the MN )
    So I resoldered them both , then drilled and tapped thru into the bolt body and installed a threadded bolt , that I then ground the head off.
    The Spoon Style is the favorite of many.
    Tht the dog leggeded pne uses the original bolt Knob, brilled and soldered on.
    The other two are aftermarket handles that I welded to the bolt body lug.
    Last edited by LAGS; 12-04-2017 at 07:26 PM.

  3. #23
    Boolit Master
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    This bolt handle was welded on.
    But I bet you could cut off the old bolt handke square then silver solder ith replacement handle in place, Then Drill and Tap the bolt handle and countersink the screw head into the new bolt handle.
    It would sort of be like the AT bolt handle.
    But the solder would keep it from unthreading, and the screw would take a lot of stress off the solder joint.
    Hay, " Where there is a will, there is a Way" (Anna Nichole Smith)
    The other two pictures are of the MN bolt handles on the rifles.
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    Last edited by LAGS; 12-04-2017 at 07:46 PM.

  4. #24
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    No matter how you heat, you need to deal with the cocking cam with cock on opening. I choose prevention, make an aluminum heat sink with a hole in the middle, get a small bike inner tube to put over the lugs and gas vents in the bolt. Clamp, hook up a water hose, place in jig and turn on water weld away. You need to get the water away using a hose on the heat sink, ask me how I know about cocking cams.
    mr

  5. #25
    Boolit Master
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    Have cut off and TIG welded on a lot of Mauser bolt handles. An aluminum bar internal to the bolt was used as a heat sink. The bolt was cooled after each welding pass. Not hard to do, made an alignment jig to hold the handle in place while making the first tack welds.

  6. #26
    Boolit Master
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    I never had one warp. I you are mig or stick welding you are in and out too fast or much heat to build up. you don't need the receiver if you have a jig. Remington bolts are silver soldered. but that puts a lot of heat in the bolt.

  7. #27
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    @ bob208
    You should have the receiver to set up the jig and get the angle correct.
    Ones with a few bolts under their belt, dont always need the receiver because they are experienced on what to look for.
    But I would want the receiver to check out the fit before and after ,and make sure the bolt was headspaced correctly Before you start, and when you are done.
    I would have no way of knowing if someone had switched bolts, and wants it modified, then assumes it should be headspaced for their rifle when it comes back.
    Changing a bolt handle will not effect the headspacing.
    But you dont want to buy into an existing problen and be held responsable.

  8. #28
    Boolit Master
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    Lags I like the stock redo on the MN, looks like you added wood to original stock to form a pistol grip, what stain did you use?
    Hell, I was there!

  9. #29
    Boolit Master
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    I wouldn't be alarmed about a FIRED SHELL in a rifle chamber. BUT I sure would if a LIVE one was in there and no easy way to get it out...

  10. #30
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    @ swheeler
    You are correct about how I modified the Finn 28-30 stock ,
    But that was done about 35 years ago, so I can not remember off the top of my head what stain it was.
    Those pieces that are laminated to the original stock are Maple boards I bought at Home Depot, and I bet the stain was one of the off the shelf Min Wax colors.
    The other MN is a stock I made out if 1x6 Poplar boards thaat I laminated together, then they were sprayed with Black Wrinkle Paint from a rattle can.
    They were both meant to be Patterns to be used on a Stock Duplicator.
    But , Hay. They shot so well , I just used them on these rifles

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by bob208 View Post
    I never had one warp. I you are mig or stick welding you are in and out too fast or much heat to build up. you don't need the receiver if you have a jig. Remington bolts are silver soldered. but that puts a lot of heat in the bolt.
    That is true about MIG or stick welding, especially MIG I think, and probably TIG as well.

    From the point of view of annealing the cocking cam, these methods don't depend on preheating of the workpiece. They will work with the decisive part at a safe temperature. An exception is with certain alloy steels. I once experimented with MIG on O1 tool steel, and found that it produced local hardening which meant the welds would break out quite easily. I'm told that preheating of the workpiece would have solved this problem. But such steels are unlikely to be found in a Mauser or most military rifles.

    I don't have a Remington available for detailed examination, but it may be that the cocking cam is at a shallower angle than military rifles with a long firing-pin fall, and is adequate at a lower hardness. It might also be that they silver-solder with a high-temperature silver solder and a device to hold the parts in place, which permits heat-treatment after soldering. They (or other people) might even use air hardening steels.

  12. #32
    Boolit Master
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    if you have the jig and set the bolt in it right the locking lugs are set at 45 deg. the the handle is lined up with the stub on the bolt body. most of the heat is put on the stub where the bolt handle was cut off. you don't get enough heat to soften the cocking cams.

  13. #33
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    I bought this from Brownells about 25 years ago, tack new handle then remove the jig and screw in the heat sink, weld it up. I used to use their heat control paste on the body too but ran out a dozen or so bolts ago, forget it.
    Hell, I was there!

  14. #34
    Boolit Master
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    that is the same fixture I have used since 71.

  15. #35
    Boolit Master davidheart's Avatar
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    I haven't seen that fixture on Brownells but I do see this: https://www.brownells.com/aspx/searc...=3620&pid=1019

    What do y'all think about it? Might be easier for me to do without access to TIG/MIG equipment.

    Sent from my SM-S120VL using Tapatalk
    He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High Will abide in the shadow of the Almighty. -Psalm 91:1

  16. #36
    Boolit Master davidheart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidheart View Post
    I haven't seen that fixture on Brownells but I do see this: https://www.brownells.com/aspx/searc...=3620&pid=1019

    What do y'all think about it? Might be easier for me to do without access to TIG/MIG equipment.

    Sent from my SM-S120VL using Tapatalk
    Nevermind. I just read the instructions and I wouldn't be able to do this properly....

    Sent from my SM-S120VL using Tapatalk
    He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High Will abide in the shadow of the Almighty. -Psalm 91:1

  17. #37
    Boolit Master
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    https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...g-prod378.aspx

    It's pictured with the heat sink in place
    Last edited by swheeler; 12-08-2017 at 02:34 PM.
    Hell, I was there!

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardcast416taylor View Post
    In my humble opinion I would take them to a qualified gunsmith that either does the work or sends them out to a qualified welding firm. I`ve had about 5 Mausers done by `smiths and don`t regret the cost for the nice job done.Robert
    What Robert said. I've done dozens of small ring and large rings over the years, both have their advantages. Forging on the one hand -- for me, is a piece of cake, one issue....if it's going on a scoped rifle it leaves you wanting lengthwise but does look nice -- once you know how to do it properly.

    Welding TIG is absolutely the best way to go, with a Leonard Brownell designed bolt handle it's almost identical to a Ruger 77 bolt handle. You will have to do some mods to the action -- mostly a matter of making a small notch where the bolt closes and locks. I have used MIG as I have one, but the nicest jobs always I setup in my jig and took to a qualified professional TIG welder. More than worth the cost.

    I might still be doing them if the "endless" supply of "cheap" Mauser actions had not run out. If I had only sat on the CASES of M96's I sporterized for hunting in the 80's - 90's (at a cost of $70/@ numbers matching...) I would be wealthy today.....

    Art

    P.S. -- There is NOTHING uglier than an improperly welded/finished welded on bolt handle.....don't ask me how I know.......
    ________________________________

    Pappy's Rifle Shop
    Alanson, Michigan 49706

  19. #39
    Boolit Master
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    @ Davidheart
    My dad raised me saying.
    "If you don't know how to do something then Learn
    If someone else can do it, then so can you."
    You just have to weigh out if the final product is worth your time and investment.

  20. #40
    Boolit Master davidheart's Avatar
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    I just got off the phone with the local smith. He told me he would charge $150 for bending the bolt handle or welding a new one on.

    He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High Will abide in the shadow of the Almighty. -Psalm 91:1

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