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Thread: Cast Boolits and my CZ 527 V in 17 Hornet

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    Cast Boolits and my CZ 527 V in 17 Hornet

    SITREP: I have begun testing with the 32gr NOE .172 PB bullet in my CZ 527 17H Hornet.

    I have to admit that I am cheating here.

    I was looking for aftermarket .17 custom bullet resources and found Reed's Ammunition & Research, LLC. I do not work for them and am not associated with them, so here is the link: http://shop.reedsammo.com/17-Cal-Bullets_c278.htm. They are selling .172 32gr PB and 27gr GC boolits by the 100.

    I called them and confirmed that Reed's is selling bullets cast with NOE's .172 molds. These are the same molds I ordered last week and just got in. I admit to ordering 100 of each bullet from Reed's. I am claiming it is to serve as a benchmark for when I begin with my molds.

    Back to test plan. I am going begin with Trail Boss and my magneto speed chronograph. I used the .173" .17 cal push-through die from NOE to "clean up" the edges on my purchased bullets (they came fully lubed). I have settled on a COAL of 1.631 using the Hornady comparator .17 cal insert (1.715 raw caliper measurement).

    This morning I will take my first 32gr test loads to the range and chronograph them as well as grouping assessment. The JBM calculator says they should be stable down to 600 fps, so, I am hoping for a "no keyhole" test.

    I will shoot TB at 1.0gr and 1.7gr (starting at the low end). I have already test fired the 1.0gr in the backyard. Noise is about like a high powered air rifle, but with a 32gr bullet. I picked the 1.7gr as a second point because of a reported success in a 527 with this bullet at this load and frankly, why not. I have a 4.0gr top limit per computing the case to bullet limit, so, I feel I am facing nothing dangerous.

    Once I get these over a chronograph and onto paper, I will see where I should be going. I am looking for a non-explosive "dinner round" to add to my pile of 20gr VMAX j-words at 3700 fps. Don't blow up your dinner is a good saying for old guys.

    With the long round nose 32gr boolits, they remind me of the MIL SURP 6.5x55 with the 156gr boolits on top. Now if they will just shoot.

    thanks to all that make this forum great.

    v/r rch

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    Been there done that with the exact same setup.
    My luck ran out around 1900fps and it started to scatter bad.

    Sent a couple of hundred to a friend in Texas and he uses them over 1grain of 700X for armadillos.

  3. #3
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    Armadillos...in Denmark...seen as far north as Emporia, KS but the didnít have to swim much����

    OOPS, didnít see that you sent to TX, my bad😔

  4. #4
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    This should be interesting. I have been pondering the same thing. May PC some?
    Steve,

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  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    Back from the range with some interesting results.

    1gr TB with the 32gr PB was 2 inches at 50 yards but my Magneto speed errored every shot when set on 11 for sensitivity. On normal, it didn't see a thing. I got an errored reading of 740 fps at one point.

    1.6gr TB with the 32gr PB key-holed every bullet at 50 yards (5 rounds). Why would 1gr hit straight and 1.6 key-hole? I haven't got a clue.

    Now for the fun part. At 25 yards with 1gr of TB I put 7 shots (all that I had left) into an honest to God dime sized group. it is 3" low using my 100 yard zero but dead on the vertical. I will load a bunch of these and just use my MOA hashmarks to correct for the holdover.

    17nut, did your Texas contact say that he was getting effective kills (through and through) on an armadillo? Armadillos would be like shooting a varmint with body armor. Second question, what powder and loads were you using to get up to 1900 fps? I have only used the TB so far, and only the two loads. I do have a supply of SR-4759 which I use in a bunch of my bigger boolit loads.

    Minerat, I agree with the PC idea. I see these in "lipstick" red (Harbor Freight Red). It adds a touch of color to your ammo box and also makes it clear as a powder designation. Separate colors for different loads.

    thanks to all who responded.

    v/r rch

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    If you guys are casting and loading.17 boolits my hat is off to you! I thought casting.224’s were tough.
    There are only to kinds of men:

    1. Those who know Jesus Christ is both Creator and Sovereign Lord.

    2. Those fixin' to know...

  7. #7
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    Paper patches maybe?


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  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmitty View Post
    If you guys are casting and loading.17 boolits my hat is off to you! I thought casting.224’s were tough.
    Yup, not much meat on that bone
    Have to heat the mould constantly or it gets to cold.

    Here with a 45 ACP

    Click image for larger version. 

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  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhouser View Post
    17nut, did your Texas contact say that he was getting effective kills (through and through) on an armadillo? Armadillos would be like shooting a varmint with body armor. Second question, what powder and loads were you using to get up to 1900 fps? I have only used the TB so far, and only the two loads. I do have a supply of SR-4759 which I use in a bunch of my bigger boolit loads.
    v/r rch

    He shoots a 17VHA (4.6x30 necked down from .18 caliber) and uses 1grain of 700X for a good subsonic load. No through-thtough so they wont scatter into the neighbours garden. Kills them quite dead he told me, leprosy spreaders. Cast 94/3/3

    I used Vihtavuori N105 (@ 4grains) to get to 1900fps (150000+ rpm)
    Similar: Blue Dot, Longshot, WAP

  10. #10
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    17nut,

    I'm on the fence right now about casting for the 17 but have a questions. It seems that most factory loads are limited to 20-25 gr for the HH. How is that 32 gr NOE shooting? Is it considered "Heavy for Caliber"?
    Steve,

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  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    Noooo it's a no check bullet and you have to push it carefully or it will strip the rifling.
    My loads was in 22LR territory and under 16kpsi

    Trailboss is a very fast and agressive powder suited for light loads, not for finding max. speed.

    As i said try: Blue Dot, Longshot, WAP from 2 to 4 grains. That will get you from slightly over supersonic to scatter.
    Mind you 1900fps in a 1:9 barrel is 150000rpm and quite fast for a cast bullet.

  12. #12
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    I think you misunderstood. I am only wondering if the 32 gr boolit shoots OK since the factory bullets are usually 8 to 12 grains lighter. Is it accurate enough to handle shooting tree rats at 22 LR ranges?
    Steve,

    Life Member NRA
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  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    It's shorter than a 25grain V-MAX and weighs more so it's plenty stable even below 1000fps.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    It's stable at 715 FPS (1gr Trailboss). In my CZ, the 32gr NOE with 1gr TB is grouping under an inch at up to 30 yards. The JBM calculator shows the 32gr NOE to be stable down to 600 fps (low as it goes).

    I had to do some fiddling to get my chronograph to read the cast lead .17's. I called MagnetoSpeed customer service. They knew what steps I needed to take. Here is what I have so far.


    1.0gr TB = 716 FPS AVG with 32gr NOE. In my CZ it is grouping sub moa at 30 yards and under.
    2.0gr TB = 1230 FPS AVG with 32gr NOE. In my CZ this looks like a shotgun pattern at 50.
    2.5gr TB = 1410 FPS AVG with 32gr NOE. In my CZ this is settling down nicely at 50 but not there yet.

    Not discussed yet. NOE 26gr GC at 27gr with the GC. I only loaded 5 and picked 2.5gr because my measure was already set.

    2.5gr TB = 1536 FPS AVG with 27gr NOE. In my CZ this grouped 1.2 inch at 35. I will need to work the loads, but, this boolit shot a nice group.

    This is it for now. I do like my 32 NOE + 1.0gr TB at 716 fps. Sounds like a strong air rifle and shoots to point at 30 yards. I am going to do some .1 gr bumps and see where the velocity vs accuracy goes. I tried a 1.5gr TB load with the 32gr NOE in my first attempts with the boolit and it was not good. 2.5gr looks like another area to explore in my gun, but, I am back supersonic.

    Thanks to all.
    rch
    Last edited by rhouser; 11-22-2017 at 08:46 AM.

  15. #15
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    Thanks guys, that's just what I wanted to know. Looks like I'll be one step closer to the $1000 club this time next week.
    Steve,

    Life Member NRA
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  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Sitrep:
    I am getting 10 shot dime groups with the 32gr NOE at 50 yards with 2.8 gr TB and a Rem 6 1/2 SRP. AVG VEL 1557 fps. SD not great at 26.3 but not terrible either. I will reshoot with a Rem 7 1/2 just to see how it effects things.

    I have not moved to the 100 yard range yet. The 1 gr loads are still working perfectly at 25 yards (.5 in) grouping. I need to do some penetration tests just to see. These are exiting the barrel with authority at 700 fps. It sounds like a high power air gun. Believe it or not, my gun likes the 32gr NOE at 1.0gr of TB better than 1.2gr.

    If the 32's will group at 100 yards with the 2.8 grains and 1550 fps, I should stop here. I have always thought that 1600 fps is a good stop point for PB boolits. I am now confident that I will be able find a working 100 yard cast boolit load using the 32gr NOE in my CZ 17 HH.

    v/r rch
    v/r rch

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    This is cool topic. Glad some one shows this is possible and practical.

  18. #18
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    rhouser,

    It's all your fault. after reading your last post, I bought both 0.172 NOE molds (3 cavity), the top punches, gas checks and sizer. Fortunately I got my wife to pay for it as a Christmas present.

    The fun begins after Christmas.
    Steve,

    Life Member NRA
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    Kilo Charlie zero Golf Papa Tango

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    Welcome to the insanity Minerat. My 17HH CZ is turning out to be a very good cast boolit shooter. At 32gr per boolit, math says I can get is 218 boolits to the pound.

    There is something about it that is fun to me.

    Lessons learned:
    1. Remember to lightly inside chamfer the cases. Sharp edges cut lead.
    2. I am sizing the 32 gr boolits using the .173 ring in my NOE push through sizer.
    3. I am using the .173 NOE case neck expander (installed in my Lee Expander die) to size the necks.

    These boolits are a dream to seat and they are shooting really well at the 50 yard line with 2.8 gr of Trail Boss. I will load some more and shoot the 100 this weekend.

    I still have the 26gr GC to work on, but, the 32gr is a hoot.

    rch

  20. #20
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    I kinda have to wait for Christmas the wife got them and said santa had control now. I wan to try PC'n some too. I learned the hard way on the inside chamfer and expander using J words after crushing a couple of those tiny necks.

    Steve
    Steve,

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check