Post-Harvey Hunting Rifle Strategy

[TXGunNut]

Had the opportunity to help track a wounded deer in Bee County (TX) this past weekend, vegetation was all but impenetrable and the deer was apparently not well hit so we were not able to recover it. Finally dug out the last (I think) thorn yesterday. Harvey dumped an incredible amount of rain in this area early this year and grass is nearly 6' tall in places. Underbrush is thicker than I've ever seen it and lots of small trees are doing well also. I'm thinking I need to take this into consideration when I select a rifle to hunt with later this year, more than ever I'm wanting a DRT stop if I get the opportunity. I'm thinking a 45-70 with the RD 460-350GC but I may defect to a 30-06 and J-words. This particular 30-06 is a Winchester Super Grade that was a gift from my brother (and hunting host) so I need to take it hunting now and then. I haven't killed game with a J-word in years but haven't had much luck coming up with a CB load this rifle likes and time is running out for this year. This rifle likes my old standby Hornady 165 spire point hunting load and REALLY likes the 180 but the 165 is a better choice for the game in this area. This load has a long track record of very quick kills as well as accuracy....and I have a good supply on hand. I've been assembling this load for my brother for years, he won't use anything else.

[skeettx]

Thanks for attempting to help a friend
Be very careful in the tall grass, lots of nasties out there
Not very populated only 31,000 in the ENTIRE county
Mike

[TXGunNut]

Well, I was there to help. As you may know it was youth hunt weekend and the little guy had four helpers. We also did a ton of Harvey related repairs but the youth hunt made it fun. That and some very good camp cooks. Hope I get to cook next trip.
I don't see many snakes or other undesirables down there but they could have been almost anywhere, made it hard to enjoy the little bit of bird hunting we did.

[popper]

Did that youth hunt at Bramburger ranch last year with the G.K.s A real blast. I learned a LOT.

[TXGunNut]

This is my first. As a bonus the little gentleman went home with a nice 10-22 Ruger Sporter that hasn't been out of my safe in years. He shot it in camp a bit and shot it quite well, he may benefit from a nice target rifle someday soon. I'm probably just as tickled as he is.

[BigMagShooter]

be ready for fire season next spring/summer

get something in 35 caliber for some good DRT shots, (there's your excuse for another rifle) if not, aim for a high shoulder shot, should drop them on the spot.

[TXGunNut]

No need for another rifle in .35, seems I have a few already. One in 35 Whelen may go along if the weather looks bad.

[taco650]

My DRT load is also 30-06. 150 gr. HDY SP over a mild load of IMR 4320. I've never chrono'ed it but the book indicates its around 2700 fps and I get ~ 1" groups at 100 yards. Sighted 1.5" high at 100 its fine out past 200.

[centershot]

DRT? A .223 sporter loaded with Federal Fusion. It is AWESOME what this load does to a deer! The deer I've shot with it have wound channels that look like I shot them with my '06, I kid you not! The last deer I killed with it, the bullet broke the left leg, entered the chest and broke a rib going in, took out both lungs and broke a rib going out, and then broke the the right leg and exited. Pretty darn good performance for a 62 grain bonded core bullet!

[TXGunNut]

My DRT load is also 30-06. 150 gr. HDY SP over a mild load of IMR 4320. I've never chrono'ed it but the book indicates its around 2700 fps and I get ~ 1" groups at 100 yards. Sighted 1.5" high at 100 its fine out past 200.

Not surprised, the Hornady SP is a very good bullet. I think they discontinued the 165 (product #3040), is the 150 still available? I think they were moving to the more exotic plastic tip and boat tail designs. I bought plenty of the 165's because all my brother's rifles like it and mine does too. He shoots less than 20 hunting rounds a year so I won't need to buy any more.
I'm looking forward to more CB load development in this rifle after hunting season, it's a beautiful and accurate rifle and I refuse to believe it won't shoot CB's.

[TXGunNut]

DRT? A .223 sporter loaded with Federal Fusion. -centershot

I need to look into that, sounds like a good pig round. One hunter on the lease uses a .223 MSR for pigs and a brush gun but it doesn't anchor the bigger pigs well. Thanks!

[SSGOldfart]

Nothing wrong with using a J word my 30-06 Sako finally gave up a 0.973 group at 200 yards with a 311316 and a good dose of IMR 4227. Lots and lots of brush this year,seems like the leaves are hanging on longer this year too.
Gook luck with your deer hunting this season.

[TXGunNut]

Nothing wrong with using a J word my 30-06 Sako finally gave up a 0.973 group at 200 yards with a 311316 and a good dose of IMR 4227. Lots and lots of brush this year,seems like the leaves are hanging on longer this year too.
Gook luck with your deer hunting this season.

Thanks, may have to look at that mould if my NOE 311041 clone doesn't work out. Who makes your 311316?
Lots of healthy deer moving on the Bee County lease this morning, hope the same is true out there where you hunt.

[taco650]

My DRT load is also 30-06. 150 gr. HDY SP over a mild load of IMR 4320. I've never chrono'ed it but the book indicates its around 2700 fps and I get ~ 1" groups at 100 yards. Sighted 1.5" high at 100 its fine out past 200.

ADDENDUM: the last two deer shot with this load were broadside shots just behind front shoulder. Full penetration & when moving the front leg around, you could hear a loud sucking sound. I've had one deer run after being hit with this load which went about 30 yards but left blood stripes on the leaves-very easy to track. Had no blood in it when I started to cut it open.

[SSGOldfart]

Thanks, may have to look at that mould if my NOE 311041 clone doesn't work out. Who makes your 311316?
Lots of healthy deer moving on the Bee County lease this morning, hope the same is true out there where you hunt.

Lyman made it. it's a great gallery bullet for light loads too.

[TXGunNut]

Shot my Ruger Hawkeye in 35 Whelen today, every now and then someone has to rattle the range tin, right? I don't like shooting that rifle so was pleased when it hit just less than 2.5" high (sighted in 2" high) so I packed her in after one shot.

[SSGOldfart]

Hmmm guess it's like potato chips,I can't do just one, you don't learn anything from just one,but seeing how you have confidence in that gun,and load,your good to go.

[RPRNY]

Well, one simply cannot be wrong with a 30-06 and accurate 165 grs bullet. Period. And one could do much worse than go Whelen.

Having said that, from the sounds of the vegetation you describe, the issue is more likely visibility than anything else. What we know from field testing and science is that the "brush buster" cartridge is a myth. No projectile will not be deflected from its course if it strikes something on the way. We do know that big and slow may deflect less when striking lightweight objects than light and fast. Why anyone would suggest poodle shooting bullets for anything other than rats and small dogs in the open is beyond understanding, but the current ill-informed fandom for the 223/5.56 is sadly widespread.

Your thinking on 45-70 sounds quite well considered,
on the contrary, recognizing both the limited visibility from dense vegetation and potentially mitigating the outcome of a deflection. Another direction to consider is a very effective cartridge for short ranges, launching 150 grs j-words at 2500+ fps or accommodating chunky 170 grs cast bullets in a nice long neck, both from a handy, lightweight rifle, i.e. a lever gun in 30-30. With dense vegetation, no 200 plus yard shots are in the cards. A 5.5 lbs 20" lever gun in 30-30 sounds just right. There are still plenty of white tail killed in New England with one, and I've taken a lot of hogs in TX Hill Country with a 336 'Texan'. 170 grs of .30 cal will take care of about anything and if you're shooting short distances, that lightweight lever gun sure is a pleasant carry.

[TXGunNut]

....Another direction to consider is a very effective cartridge for short ranges, launching 150 grs j-words at 2500+ fps or accommodating chunky 170 grs cast bullets in a nice long neck, both from a handy, lightweight rifle, i.e. a lever gun in 30-30. ...RPRNY

As a Winchester collector I'd like very much to heed your sage advice! I'll be carrying a very early 1894 Winchester on a later trip but this trip is different. My latest (and earliest!) 1894 actually pre-dates the 30WCF but I could probably find a thutty-thutty to take hunting someday. This trip needs to involve a certain modern rifle and J-words and I'm not very happy about it but pretty sure I can make it work.

[SSGOldfart]

Remember the camera so we can see your "jungle"
Buster I'm backing up the 06 with a 357Maximum 10" RBH seeing how the brush is so thickened might do better with a pocket knife