Best bear defense for a woman

[MUSTANG]

Key to the issue as some have cited is acknowledgement of the hazards in the environment and willingness to equip and train with available/selected tools to overcome the hazard.

If the woman wants to live in a beautiful but hazardous environment:

1. and does not want to train with a heavy caliber firearm, then select a lesser desirable caliber that she will train for (AR platforms, .38's/357's, 9mmm etc.. Classic example would be the small calibers popular with the ladies in cities from the 1880' to 1930's. These are not optimum, but if they fit the constraints of the Lady, better than nothing.

2. and does not want to train with firearms, then Bear Spray is an option. In my opinion it is a much lesser option for reasons others have cited plus more. Once again a better option than nothing, but she needs to train to use it. The Bear Spray industry does very well at $30 to $50 per canister - with strong advocacy/requirement by our Environmentally Centrist (Tree Huggers) Park Service, Forest Service, etc...


3. Many packers, campers, etc.. have Bear Spray and assume in a crisis they can use it. If they have not trained with it, in all probability they will freeze up and not use the Bear Spray, or be ineffective in it's use. To translate the same human reaction to a City Condition, a variety of organizations (Red Cross for one ,as I just heard one of their ads on radio) advocate for training family members for reaction to fire alarms and fires and have recurring family drills on how to respond to a fire. In a fire one normally would have a minute to several minutes to react. In the case of a Bear Attack it's going to be a couple of seconds based on most reports (by the survivors, not the arm chair critiques over the non-survivors). Practice and drills result in a reaction based on "Muscle Memory/Habit", not a thoughtful deliberate reaction.

Key to the answer is acknowledgment and acceptance of the environment, selecting a tool/s to address the danger within the constraints, and having the training/practice necessary to use the tool/s should the need arise.

Personally I prefer to carry either my Kimber or Springfield 1911 when out and about in the Woods and feel confident with them should an animal attack (4 or 2 footed); yet I mostly carry a Beretta 32 Tomcat when in the Town/City - not because it's the best caliber for dealing with a problem (2 footed?) , rather because it's small enough to always fit into a jeans/shirt/coat pocket and I have a tool with me all the time, not back in the vehicle or house. I leave the Tomcat at the house when I leave "Civilization" because I have and am willing to use better tools for the environment.

[MT Gianni]

I would advise her to put her money into bear spray and a trained companion dog. It must be large enough and aggressive enough to keep animals away and she cannot be attached enough to value her life over her dogs.

[ReloaderFred]

We live in black bear country, and can't even put the trash out the night before pickup, or they'll get into it and make a big mess. My wife walks the dogs daily, small little yapper critters (Shelties). She carries her Colt Detective Special and one of those cans of compressed air that power an air horn, like small boaters and crazy football fans use. She's encountered several bears on her walks (my knees preclude me going with her on the hills around our house anymore) and the air horn has worked to scare all of them away when they don't run naturally.

The only incident we had when I was still able to go on the dog walks several years ago was one ornery old boar that claimed the ridge we were on as his own. He laid in the brush until we got about 20 yards from him and then proceeded to "posture" back and forth in front of us. "Posturing" is when a bear walks slowly back and forth in front of you, looking over his shoulder at you. He's letting you know you're trespassing on his land. I had a 9mm in my hand, and the more that bear slowly walked back and forth, the smaller that pistol got. He finally went off into the brush after a few minutes and we waited for about 10 minutes more to make sure he was gone, but he wasn't. He waited for us to get within about the same distance as before and started his little routine all over again.

Both times we had slowly backed up to put some distance between us and him, which ended up being about 40-50 yards, and those little yapper critters we were walking stayed behind us and never let out a peep. Anyway, the second time the old boar "postured" for about another 5 minutes or so and then he went off over the side of the ridge and we were able to get back home, which is only about 1/4 mile from where this happened. I started carrying my 10mm after that, but we didn't encounter this particular old boar again. The game troopers suggested going after him with a 12 ga. with slugs, and I would have if he'd continued to be a problem, but like I said, we never encountered him again.

Bottom line is, at least for the black bears we have around here, the air horn has worked several times. I can't guarantee it will work every time, but it has for at least a half dozen casual encounters when they didn't run off.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[atr]

I would recommend her staying out of the woods, or the pepper spray option. It does not sound like she wants to invest the time it takes to become comfortable or proficient with a side arm.
I have encountered lots of bears in my hikes/hunts; blacks, big browns and one grizzly and even with a loaded .357 or .44M on my hip I know that a pissed-off bear will usually come out the winner. It is a whole different ball game when you are standing out in the middle of nowhere eyeballing a bear 50 yds away, not to mention the one that suddenly comes out of the bushes.

[MUSTANG]

In case some reading the thread are unaware of the reality of the topic, a couple of articles below.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/grizzly...acebook-video/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.d5f420323d4d

http://www.spokesman.com/blogs/outdo...-bear-attacks/

Wikipedia is always an interesting place to look for data on topics, but not necessarily comprehensive. Note the their report does not list some of the attacks as posted above.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._North_America

[Texas by God]

I have no experience with bears but I would recommend a Trapper 30-30 with a recoil pad.
If she can't hande that then use a 9mm and or bear spray and yell a lot.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[reddog81]

Start her off with shooting .38 special or maybe even a 22. You can move up from there. There's no need to start with a 44 Magnum even if that is the desired end result.

[9.3X62AL]

Monday mornings were (and are) trash days at the big mobile home park my Mom now lives in north of Beaumont. About 2 A.M. every Monday morning, the calls would start coming in to our dispatch center about "Bears making a mess" or "Bears chasing my pets" during the time I worked as a patrol deputy in that area (mid-1980s). Spotlight, light bars, or car horns didn't faze them much. What DID run them off was opening & closing the mic button on the PA system a few times. THAT bugged them, for some reason. John Muir's description of bears as being "Shaggy freebooters" has always seemed apt to me.

[Kosh75287]

12ga Binelli M3, 20ga quality auto. Bear spray is restricted to the distance it sprays out to, kinda like letting a guy wielding a knife get within 20 paces. The gas system on the M3 really takes the romp outta slug and buckshot loads.

This.

If she insists on a sidearm, find the most powerful caliber that she can empty into a gallon milk-jug at 7-10 yards. Load it with cast SWCs, as close to 950 f/s as she can tolerate. The S&W .41 Magnum you mention that she shot, so loaded, might be tolerable for her. If she gets one into an agitated bear's skull from underneath, the bear's time on earth is limited.

[Thumbcocker]

Spray or a SXS shotgun with a sling. Simple to load and unload, safe, many options on ammo, much easier to learn than a handgun, potent at short range.

[texasnative46]

To All,

IF she can handle it, I recommend a SxS double-barrel shotgun loaded with 0/#1/#4 buckshot for bears, puma & other 2-footed or 4-footed predators.
(The DB is EASY for a neophyte shooter to master & is really versatile as a firearm for many purposes. = MOST new shooters will be fully competent with a DB with 2 or less hours of professional training/range time.)

just my OPINION, tex

[44MAG#1]

A GlockM20 10MM would be good. Even with the enhanced FL's the recoil is not bad. 16 rounds. Easily packable. Loaded with Buffalo Bore or Underwood 220 gr hardcast would be good.

[Kestrel4k]

[...] Her handgun shooting at 15 yards was all over the target.

Quoted above is what I feel is the most significant issue. My initial thought was a .357 revolver w/ the Buffalo Bore 158gr HC .38Spl 'Outdoorsman' loading as a lower choice coming down from their 180gr HC .357, i.e. obtaining the absolute minimum in recoil.

But if she's not absolutely committed to a comprehensive, extensive regimen to work on handgun proficiency, I really think that a .357 or .44Mag lever action rifle is the only viable firearm alternative.

If she won't obtain a substantial improvement in shot placement from a handgun, all the handgun commentary is unfortunately moot.

[Kosh75287]

BTW, ANYone who thinks humans are incapable of natural chemical defense have never smelled me after being chased by a feral animal, nor after I've almost stepped on a rattlesnake!

[Whiterabbit]

I know the key is proper training but she's determined to buy a handgun.

I rather think this is the most significant issue. Motivation is everything.

I think my suggestion would be to regularly visit a rental range and try a series of firearms. Starting with 38 special and moving up until she finds a large diameter caliber she can shoot comfortably. Going with the largest she's comfy with. Not sure if I would advise a speeding smaller cal over a large diameter slower bullet. For example, 357 mag over 45 acp? I'd probably take the 45 acp if shooting comfort were the same.

Anyways, once she has identified the "biggest" she is comfortable shooting, both in caliber and in cartridge, I would advise she buy a gun she likes in it. Wouldn;t matter to me if she liked a single action revolver best, DA, or a semi-auto. Again, she's gotta pick what she is comfortable with.

If you or anyone else harrangue her into getting some 44 mag or whatever semi-auto when she wants X-Y-Z DA revolver (for example), then she's not gonna shoot it, not gonna carry it, and your (not you personally) attitude will turn off her motivation, and that can't be allowed to happen.

After she picks her gun of choice, it's practice practice practice. Sooner or later her own motivation will guide her to get training. But if that doesn't happen for years, at least in the mean time she will have a gun she wants, in a cartridge she is comfy shooting, that she knows is the biggest she can handle, and has been shooting it for awhile developing a nice muscle memory for when she needs to fall back on that experience in a panic.

That's my true advice.

[jetinteriorguy]

I think Kestrel4K is on to something. A Lever in 44 mag or even 454 Casull would probably work for her with an extra recoil pad for comfort. I have a Henry BBS in .41 mag and even with full house loads it's very pleasant and accurate, so even though the bigger magnums would be more recoil, I would guess they would be manageable.

[dbosman]

Ruger .44 carbine. Yes, hard to find.
Elmer Keith's classic .44 mag load, adjusted for todays, Alliant 2400.
Minimal recoil for a .44 mag. Extreme accuracy for such a light, low recoil rifle. With no lever to get in the way of things. The only comment I'll add is for those concerned with lead in the mechanism, clean your guns.

[bob208]

first she has to get her mind around a gun and using it.

I would say try a 20 ga. semi-auto with a rubber recoil pad. also remind her when she has to use it she will not feel the recoil. If she insists on a hand gun then the only way is a .357. heavy loads for real shooting. .38 spl. for training. mainly for price I don't think she sounds like a hand loader so she will be using bought ammo only. the .38-357 can be bought anywhere.

[Multigunner]

If a shoulder injury prevents firing a shotgun try the other shoulder. If that doesn't work try firing from the hip.
At close range one can keep their rounds pretty well centered, especially on a large target.
I'd use rifled slugs only.

I was test firing a lightweight Remington autoloader once and just cut loose five rounds at a nearby tree point shooting from the hip. The strikes were all close to the centerline, each a few inches about the other. That many 12 ga slugs hitting that close together in a couple of seconds would be devasting to anything that breathes air and walks on land.

[Mr_Sheesh]

Why 4" barrel on wheelguns instead of 6"? Just wondering because of more moment of inertia (so more accuracy if she's aiming, instead of flinch-yanking the trigger, which could WELL be going on here) and more sight radius; Also the "Bang!" is 2" further away from her which could help.

When I was up around Chicken / Tok AK I was carrying the old Ithaca M37 with BRI saboted slugs and 00 buck, the sow we had by us knew we were there (and left the occasional calling card in our camp while we were out), but never messed with us; The white-footed assassins (killer micro gnats) and camp robber Jays were the real pains / threats. But around this state I'd at least carry a Commander or Ruger SBH, something in case a black bear has a BAD ATTITUDE day and decides to pick a fight. Happened to someone I know, they were "treed" up a rock wall for an hour or so...

Autoloader shotgun could also work well, but if she wants a handgun (which IS nice because you can always carry it holstered, no sling, no "It's in the way so I'll just set it down for a minute here") help her test drive a bunch and see what she likes and keep searching for a good answer for her? 44 Mag can be downloaded (handloaded softer), definitely, if she finds one she wants; Same for other calibers. Start her out easier, get her practicing and used to it, go from there?