CCW pocket gun accuracy.

[35remington]

I think what was meant was that the best course of action may be to run away first. Shooting after moving may be the next best option. If problems arise everyone starts moving first. If they are smart.

You should be moving too. Nothing like making yourself easy to hit.

Realistically, defending against a mall shooter is unlikely. Most likely usage is to dissuade assault or robbery attempts. We can all dream up scenarios where great accuracy is required but shouldn't you then be carrying a 1911 instead of a pocket pistol with a spongy trigger?

[Idaho45guy]

What gun was used for the second target?

Also what are the pictures illustrating? I see some barrel wear on the outside of the barrel around the compensator ports but other than cosmetic I do not see anything that should result in such poor accuracy.

Not sure about S&W Shields, but I believe their lock up is similar to Glocks. Both my Glock 19 and 26 have developed bluing wear in similar areas from use.


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Second gun is my Springfield Armory XDS 40...

Attachment 207059

Attachment 207060

And as for the barrel; you seriously don't see the "lump" on top of the barrel?

Attachment 207062

[Idaho45guy]

Realistically, defending against a mall shooter is unlikely. Most likely usage is to dissuade assault or robbery attempts. We can all dream up scenarios where great accuracy is required but shouldn't you then be carrying a 1911 instead of a pocket pistol with a spongy trigger?

I recall a couple of shootings in malls in the news where the shooter was either shot by or detained by a CCW holder. The likelihood that any of us are going to be in a self-defense shooting is extremely low. Hence my point on just how much you are willing to compromise in what you choose for CCW.

I've been on gun forums for 20 years with hundreds of thousands of gun owners and I can only remember two that ever actually were involved in a self defense shooting, and one of them was found later to be a liar, so...

[35remington]

Seems like it comes down to this for some:

"My preferences in self defense weaponry and accuracy are well thought out and rational. Yours, unfortunately, are not."

Somewhere out there is a guy who carries a full sized accurized high capacity pistol because he views the whole idea of an "accurate" low capacity pocket pistol as nonsensical. As was said before, a lot of platforms lend themselves to better usable accuracy than a small pistol does. Most of us carry a second or third best option in that regard.

[tazman]

I have never been involved in a shooting. I have, however, had an instance when having a pistol with me saved me from some trouble.
I was stopped along an interstate loop around a large city due to a flat tire. I put my handgun inside my belt under my jacket just on general principles.
While I was getting things together to change the tire, 3 enterprising young men hopped the fence and came down to the road a few yards from me and asked if I needed help. I told them no, that I had it covered and they could go on their way.
They told me I didn't understand. They were going to help me change the tire.
I lifted the jacket and showed them the handgun and told them to they needed to go on down the road.
Suddenly they all agreed with me and left.

[35remington]

Taz, was the pistol accurate?

Tongue firmly in cheek.

[tazman]

Taz, was the pistol accurate?

Tongue firmly in cheek.

Also tongue in cheek,, Yes, it was very accurate.
Fortunately for all involved, it didn't get demonstrated that day.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Dear Idaho45guy, I am amazed at the hostility you have displayed throughout the thread -- which you started! Reading back through it, I don't see anyone spoiling for a disagreement like you seem to be. Like most folks caught with their pants down, you wish to change the subject and circumstances slightly to back your point of view, and have added your wife and children into the mix with the man pointing a gun at you from 25 yards away in a shopping mall. Why don't you just duck into one of the doorways of the many shops or seek shelter behind one of the benches, the fountain, or the hallway to the restrooms until you know precisely what's going on? You'd better invest in the NRA's new after shooting insurance,
'cause you're going to need it if it turns out the guy was an undercover narcotics officer and wasn't actually aiming at you but some other guy about to shoot him. The scenarios could go on and on. Don't throw your background at us, because some of us have credentials at least as experienced as yours. Whether true or not, you present the impression that you are just dying to grease someone. Lighten up.

[Outpost75]

Were both targets shot side by side in same day, with same ammo?

Factory ammo? Reloads? Rested? Standing?
Pointing at the target and jerking with your eyes closed while urinating in your pants under range simulated combat conditions with tear gas in your eyes?

What?????

It could be that the shooter might be simply a troll... Not enough info to answer.

Read entire thread and learned nothing. I'm gone, you guys continue...

You have a choice between two pistols for concealed carry. Both are the same size, same capacity, same sights, same price, etc. Both are considered pocket guns and are semi-autos with 7rd capacity.

The first one shoots this group at 25 yards:

Attachment 207000


The second one shoots this group at 25yds:

Attachment 207001

Which one would you choose?

If you reply that it doesn't matter, then please explain why you would consider such a disparity of accuracy a trivial matter.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

In light of all the wisdom in this thread I have decided swap out my J-frame to something more accurate.

Really just need an IWB holster now and I’ll be set.

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[Idaho45guy]

Now I'm hostile and a troll...

So much for reasonable discussion...

[Bazoo]

Choice between a 12" group and a 3" group at 25 yards all else being equal I would choose the 3" gun. If all else wasnt equal, and I liked the 12" gun better for reasons that may include, but not limited to, it was a lot cheaper, maybe it had some perks with it like a holster, maybe it was a 45 auto and the 3" was a 9mm, different model I liked better, i'd go with the 12" gun.

I dont practice groups much for concealed carry, a 2/3 size ipsc falls to my carry gun at 50 yards or more. Not great accuracy. But enough.

[Mr_Sheesh]

IDK about you Minuteshaver, but if some weirdo tries raping me I'm aiming, uhm, a few inches lower. LOL "Powder burns of certain parts that'll HURT" as in.

(And I'm 6'5" and male, COULD theoretically happen, likelihood not very high...)

The schools that train handgun self defense though, CAN and WILL show you what'll work for you. A good one will loan you various tools till you find one that WORKS for you (Also usually the guys there will. Most good guys are VERY happy to help a gal get armed, as they realize that if she needs an SD gun she needs it BADLY.)

And sometimes the least expected gun turns out to be THE answer (Nurse I knew back then was shooting cloverleafs from the start with a Ruger Stainless Blackhawk in 357, bought because it was pretty. It turned out to also be a gun she shot pretty dang well! We usually liked to push folks to a 1911 for reasons we could discuss, but with her, "That will do it!" was about all we could say.

So we got her shooting a steady diet of WCs and Keith bullets and let her figure out what she liked and shot best. Only possible problem being that if you put bullet #2 exactly through the same hole as #1, it won't do much damage - But I suspect she'd pick a new point of aim. She may be smaller than some guys, she's still smart tho

IMO reliability accuracy and stopping power DO all count, they also are all attainable.

[9.3X62AL]

Now I'm hostile and a troll...

So much for reasonable discussion...

The antagonism commenced with Post #2 in this thread, and continued. Not my circus and not my monkeys, but moderator oversight might assist a bit.

[mnewcomb59]

My PC Shield sucks for accuracy also. My buddy's normal shield shot under 3" for me at 25 and this one shoots like 8-10".

Look close at the barrel hood. Instead of having a lighter recoil spring because of the porting, it has a normal recoil spring and one corner of the barrel hood is rounded off so it unlocks easier.

Mine is currently on armslist. Hopefully I get a normal shield with some extra cash on top.

With the porting and the Lee 95-rf bullet, I can shoot it just as fast and accurate at 7 yards as my full size m&p. But it is FAR more likely that I use my ccw for edible game than anything else. If the world ends and that is the only pistol I have on me, I need it to be squirrel accurate at 25 yards.

[ShooterAZ]

We all have our own criteria for choosing a defensive pistol. Lets keep the discussion civil and on topic.

[KCSO]

You want to carry as accurate a gun as you can for any self defence purpose. You may not get a whole standing front facing human to shoot at. What if you have to stop a coyote before he bites your dog, of a target behind some type of cover. If a gun wont shoot into 3 inches or so at 20 yards with its preferred ammo it is no gun to carry IMHO. I have yet to point a gun at a standing still full on bad guy so I want to be able to put a hit on what I can see first.

[Groo]

Groo here
1# The gun MUST function. [gun and ammo] The ammo you like is unimportant , what the gun likes is.........
2# Can you HIT when and where you want? SD targets are large, SD ranges are short [ unless you are LE] so few guns are not "accurate" enough...
3# You must have it WITH you..... In the car is worthless if you aren't.
Last , when in doubt, defer to No. 1#

[Lloyd Smale]

Please share with everyone how you are able to determine just what kind of self-defense situation you know you're going to or not going to be in that day. Must be some amazing psychic powers you have there...

nope I cant but I don't buy a 200 mph corvette with 500 hp on the off chance I might need to pass a bit quicker once in a lifetime either. If I walked out of my house today I wouldn't arm myself to be ready for the Russians to attack either. If so I wouldn't bother with ANY handgun. I use a bit of reality instead of some walter middy grand illusion of taking on a Columbian hit squad.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

This is starting to look like a better option.


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