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Thread: 22 drop @300yds

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
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    22 drop @300yds

    22 long rifle average high speed bullets thru a rifle barrel how much drop happens in 300yds??

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  3. #3
    Boolit Grand Master

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    With 22 long rifle standard velocity ammo I come up 22-24 mins from my 50 yds zero. would put 300 yds around 34-36 mins. Its a lot of fun shooting them that far and a real challenge due to wind and drop. I did better with the styandard velocity ammo than high velocity as there was no transition to subsonic with it and it just seems more accurate group wise.

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy
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    good point about the sv bullet just figured the faster the better but have both to try

  5. #5
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    Here is another Calculator.

    BC turns red when ya change from what is there , but is seems to work.

    I hope to compare it to real world results this winter.

    http://www.handloads.com/calc/index.html

    Take Jackpines suggest to heart.
    guess at velocity/BC and then sight in distance make for a great variation in the "answer"
    Last edited by TCLouis; 11-02-2017 at 04:40 PM.
    Nothing is impossible for the person that does not have to do it.

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy
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    The answer of how much drop will vary by many feet, depending on what you are assuming the zeroed distance to be.

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy OldBearHair's Avatar
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    I would like to see info on the CCI Velocitor 40 RN at 1435 fps and the Browning BPR (performance rimfire) 40 gr. RN at 1435 fps. against the slower standard velocity rounds.

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    I would like to see info on the CCI Velocitor 40 RN at 1435 fps and the Browning BPR (performance rimfire) 40 gr. RN at 1435 fps. against the slower standard velocity rounds.
    If those cartridges were sighted at 100 yds and assuming a BC of .150, drop would be 90"@300 yds. Using a standard velocity of 1050 fps with same BC and sighting, drop is 130"@300. However, with a 90 deg. crosswind of 10 MPH, wind drift will be HIGHER with the HV round(40") vs (28") with the std vel @1050 fps.
    "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
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  9. #9
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    fecmec
    Please help me understand. The faster bullet will have less travel time, but greater wind deflection than the slower bullet which takes longer to reach the target? There is something here that I am missing.
    Respectfully,
    Bill
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  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    i feel your confusion also ??

  11. #11
    Boolit Master tazman's Avatar
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    I suspect it may have something to do with crossing the sound barrier as it slows down but I don't know enough to be certain. I may well be quite wrong about that.

  12. #12
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    Please help me understand. The faster bullet will have less travel time, but greater wind deflection than the slower bullet which takes longer to reach the target? There is something here that I am missing.
    Respectfully,
    I don't fully understand it but it has to do with the sound barrier. You will see it in any ballistic calculator. You will see that until you approach mach 2 from just sub sonic wind drift will increase until you get to mach 2. Rimfire HV .22's always have more wind drift than SV .22's.

    From NRA:
    Here's an explanation from the NRA Firearms Fact book. The same info was published in an article in Precision Shooting or one of their specials or annuals years ago.

    "Those unfamiliar with smallbore rifle competition are often surprised to learn that target shooters almost universally use standard velocity ammunition in preference to the many varieties of high and hyper-velocity rounds available. The reason given is the low-velocity ammunitions resistance to wind deflection.

    Despite what might seem at first to be the case, wind deflection is not proportional to the time of flight. Instead, it is proportional to the amount of delay in the flight caused by air resistance. The 1145 f.p.s. standard velocity .22 long rifle round takes .287 seconds to go 100 yds., but would take only .262 seconds to cover the same distance in a vacuum. The latter figure is easily found by dividing 300 ft. by the speed of the bullet (1145 f.p.s.), which would remain the same throughout its flight if it were in a vacuum. Thus the delay caused by air resistance is .025 second with the standard velocity ammunition.

    The 1335 f.p.s. high velocity ammunition, which will take .259 second to cover 100 yds., would take only .225 second in a vacuum. Thus, the delay for this bullet is .035 second or 37% greater than that of the standard velocity round .22.

    The high speed round, then, suffers about 37% more wind deflection than the standard velocity.

    And this:
    As was explained Chuck Yeager; ''The bullets at subsonic are like being in a boat moving along with the throttle just cracked open a little, the boat moves along displacing the water and is very controllable. The supersonic stage is the same as the boat wide open up on plane, controllable. The trans-sonic range is the stage were the throttle is partialy open and the boat is trying to get up on plane, there is water built up in front of the bow trying to get around and the boat is uncontrollable"" Most of us ave been in a boat so we can understand this example.
    Last edited by fecmech; 11-06-2017 at 04:40 PM.
    "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
    - C. S. Lewis

  13. #13
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    An exception to that rule is a .22 long rifle bullet. The airflow at Mach 1.0 is the reason. Air resistance is increased in this velocity range and a lot of air turbulence and pressure changes occur.
    The delay time is affected out of proportion. The effect is in the velocity range 1,000 to 1,350 f.p.s. but the .22 rim fire is almost the only cartridge in this range.
    Wind deflection is not controlled by time of flight but by the loss of velocity during the time of flight. During the transition velocity range above the speed of sound, the drag increases disproportionately higher then the velocity increases. In other words, if the velocity is increased by a small amount, the drag increases by a large amount. This situation is unique to this velocity range. At all other velocities, an increase in velocity will bring about a decrease in wind deflection. Not in the upper transition range. This is the reason for the special .22 match ammunition that is loaded so it will not go fast enough to get into this velocity range. The higher velocity .22 ammo has a flatter trajectory but is deflected more by a cross wind.
    Many people incorrectly believe that an increase in velocity has no benefit for cross-wind problems. This idea is due in part to when the 40 grain .22 long rifle bullet was introduced in the late 1920’s. It’s approximate 1,330 f.p.s. performed worse than the standard bullet at 1,150. No one in those days knew of the problems with velocities near the speed of sound

  14. #14
    Boolit Grand Master popper's Avatar
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    I don't fully understand it but it has to do with the sound barrier You want to be either sub or super all the way to the target. It also has to do with the very light bullet which has very little 'stabilizing' energy. That is why the 223 works.
    Whatever!

  15. #15
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    This situation is unique to this velocity range. At all other velocities, an increase in velocity will bring about a decrease in wind deflection. Not in the upper transition range.
    You are correct to a point BUT the devil is in the details, cast shooters are more affected by this in general. ALL cartridges pass through the 0-1100 fps range and All are affected as far as wind drift to a certain extent. Take a typical cast .30 cal 311290 with a bc of .305 and put in a 10 mph 90 deg. crosswind and track to 300 yds. With a launch velocity of 1075 fps wind drift @300 yds is 15.5". With a launch velocity of 1600 fps wind drift is 21.5". You have to launch that 311290 at 2200 fps before your wind drift equals the wind drift at 1075 fps. Obviously we load to different velocities for many different reasons but once you leave subsonic your wind drift increases over the subsonic drift until you approximately double your launch velocity.
    "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
    - C. S. Lewis

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    What I'm about to post here is not my theory, it's from a friend I know. Here's what he thinks.

    Picture the shockwave bowed over the bullet nose. It's cross section folding in tight with speed, but unfolding/increasing as velocity drops off(deceleration). A bullet's BC follows this cross section. Effective BC changes in flight(with velocity) as drag goes up. The bullet cross section itself unchanging and insignificant.
    Picture wind pushing against the shockwave rather than the bullet sides. And rain never actually touching a bullet in flight.

  17. #17
    Boolit Buddy Throckmorton's Avatar
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    I understand very little of what y'all have said, lol, I just know it's 4 full turns on the scope knob to get close.Clays on a sand berm let me walk it in,but the coastal winds at my range do not make it easy. It's good cheap fun, nonetheless.

  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Put a couple wind flags down range to help with reading the wind. A light wire stand and at the height of the bullets trajectory in flight ( that's where you need to know it) with a 2'-3' length of light fuzzy yarn shows small changes in wind well. Even better is a true daisy wheel flag where the daisy wheel helps show speed and direction better. For what your trying the flags are a necessity to accuracy. This shooting will help you learn to read the wind quick

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master
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    22 long rifle average high speed bullets thru a rifle barrel how much drop happens in 300yds??
    Depends ... http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...d.php?t=556282
    Regards
    John

  20. #20
    Boolit Buddy
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    UPDATE
    bought a cheep ebay no name scope
    6x24 power,adj objective lens for paralax,,target turret style knobs,,red +green lighted crosshairs,,lens covers,,ring mounts,battery,,
    with shipping fron china for $36.00 !! how they can make money on these is surprizing.
    bought 1 for a 218bee before and put 400 rds thru it with no issues
    at 300yds i can see 22cal bullet holes on white target
    the reason i went with this type of scope is below the cross hairs theres a ladder site that extends to near the bottom of the lens.
    my thought was to sight in dead on @100yds then use the ladder site for 300 yds .
    need to try diffent ammo to possibly improve accurace shot 5 shot groups with fed auto match of 2" ( gun can do better) marlin 25
    Needed to compensate for 8' of drop. at 24x the bottom of the ladder site was 4' below the cross hairs not enough .
    backed off the power to 14x then had 8' feid of view used the next to the last ladder there are 6 of them
    this put poi dead on at 300 yds . could see the dirt fly in the berm.
    8or 10" steel plate was being hit 3 or4 times out of 10 !!! happy camper
    with fresh black paint i could see the splatter on 14x setting
    other shooters must have been looking at me funny i was giggling like a school girl!!

    with this set up there is no further sight adj its on at 100 and 300 just crank up or down on the power and paralax and shoot
    could use aladder in the middle and different power settting to zero at 200 also but why shoot 200 when you can do 300?

    try it you'll like it

    turtlezx

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