RepackboxReloading EverythingWidenersLee Precision
Titan ReloadingRotoMetals2Load DataMidSouth Shooters Supply
Inline Fabrication
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 24

Thread: .30-30 with Lee 113gr

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Pa
    Posts
    137

    .30-30 with Lee 113gr

    I could swear I saw a post about this combo, but I can't find it again. I just got the 113gr Lee .30 cal mold for plinkers in a couple of model 94 winchesters. My problem is that I am a Hodgdon powder fan and almost all the loads I find are for Unique or other powders that I don't normally use. I broke in the mold yesterday with WW+1% tin alloy water dropped but can run another batch air cooled if necessary. TL with 45/45/10. Was hoping to use them as cast without GC.

    Powders on hand are clays, Universal clays, International clays, 2400, H110, 4227, IMR4759, H335, VARGET, IMR4831.

    I am thinking 5gr Clays or 8gr Universal as a starting point.

    What do YOU think?

  2. #2
    Boolit Master

    Hickory's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    The Great Black Swamp of Northwest Ohio
    Posts
    4,434
    I think your on the right path.
    Political correctness is a national suicide pact.

    I am a sovereign individual, accountable
    only to God and my own conscience.

  3. #3
    Boolit Grand Master
    Ben's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cleveland, AL
    Posts
    9,255
    I never have any luck with a gas checked design bullet when I leave the g/c off.

    Hopefully your luck will beat my past experiences.

    Ben

  4. #4
    Super Moderator


    ShooterAZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Flagstaff, AZ
    Posts
    12,070
    My experience is the same as Ben's. The gas checked designs will shoot, but I've found they are more accurate with the check installed. If you want to try a light non-gas check plinker boolit, Take a look at this one. I size to .311, lube with LLA and load over 2.7 gr of Bullseye. It feeds perfectly through my M94 and is tack driving accurate. Another good combo with this one is 7 gr of Trail Boss. Fun to shoot and accurate enough for head shots on bunnies and squirrels out to 50 yds+.

    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/10...semi-wadcutter

  5. #5
    Moderator Emeritus


    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    SW Montana
    Posts
    12,452
    If you know a talented metal smith you can remove the gc portion of the bullet shank. Mine shoots well without it out of 32 H&R and low velocity 30-30 contender loads.
    [The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Pa
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterAZ View Post
    My experience is the same as Ben's. The gas checked designs will shoot, but I've found they are more accurate with the check installed. If you want to try a light non-gas check plinker boolit, Take a look at this one. I size to .311, lube with LLA and load over 2.7 gr of Bullseye. It feeds perfectly through my M94 and is tack driving accurate. Another good combo with this one is 7 gr of Trail Boss. Fun to shoot and accurate enough for head shots on bunnies and squirrels out to 50 yds+.

    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/10...semi-wadcutter
    I had a .40 cal TL design once and when I tried to size them it ironed out the lube grooves, I exchanged it for the regular design. You get away with sizing it down .003"?

    We have machinists and a machine shop at work. It would probably be childs play for one of them to remove the GC shank.

  7. #7
    Super Moderator


    ShooterAZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Flagstaff, AZ
    Posts
    12,070
    .003 on that boolit does not iron out the lube grooves, it works fine.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Center Point, Texas
    Posts
    605
    I have used it with GC in a number of different cases. Posted about using it with 10g of red dot in a 30-06 recently. Accuracy was a pleasant surprise!

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Prineville, Oregon
    Posts
    521
    You are on the right track. And as far as I can tell, Universal is identical to Unique but throws better from a powder measure. You find a promising sounding load using Unique, I'll bet it works just the same with Universal. And clays, though I haven't used it, would likely be a direct replacement for Red Dot or Bullseye.

    I have had generally good luck using a gc design w/o the gc, so long as I stayed in plain-base bullet velocity levels. As soon as the bullet starts going much over the 1400 fps level then the gc starts being an advantage. I would expect you to do ok without the gc with the modest velocity levels of the loads you are planning on starting with.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master gpidaho's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Beautiful Idaho
    Posts
    2,644
    I think the powders you mention will work just fine. In my plinking rifle rounds I prefer TiteGroup but most fast pistol powders work well. Gp

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

    skeet1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Enid, OK
    Posts
    1,214
    seetrout
    You may be thinking of an article written by Junior Doughty (a member of this forum that has since past away) on shooting this bullet in the 30-30 with WC 820 surplus powder. Here is part of his article.

    Ken

    The shocker of all my testing was the Lee C309-113-F "soup can"bullet, it is called. I had previously wasted several days trying to get it to shoot using several different powders. Groups at 50 yards ran 6"to 12"and even more. All that little bullet needed to cure its ills was a dose of WC820 (n).
    I used a .7cc Lee dipper for ~10.1 gr WC820 (n). The photo on the right speaks for itself.
    The data:
    AV = 1480 fps; SD = 23; Group size = 5 in 1 1/4"
    That was with the target flapping in the breeze, too!
    [/I]
    Last edited by skeet1; 10-14-2017 at 08:16 PM.

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Pa
    Posts
    137
    That's awesome Shooter! I may have to get one soon just to have it. Much thanks for the hint.

    Arlon I a probably going to try it with the GC and a higher pressure level in my M1's in the near future. Not sure if I can get that light a cast bullet to cycle the action reliably without leading but that's for another time.

    Earl, my personal experience with Universal is it has a definite pressure preference on the low end. Not dangerous like H110, but leaves a yellow unburnt powder residue until you completely seal the case, BUT, this is my first leap into cast bullets in rifles and that may change everything I know about Universal hence my starting this thread. All my "google fu" research has indicated that you can load Universal the same as Unique -10%, (DISCLAIMER - I am probably full of $%^&. Use this approximation at your own risk). I think you are right about the Clays as well, although Universal is my favorite for anything non-magnum pistol so that is where I am starting, plus I want to save my Clays for 12ga skeet loads. I don't shoot near as many 20's so the Universal for pistol thing, plus you can't double most pistol rounds with universal but you can with clays.

    Skeet - Dude you the man.
    That's the post that was stuck in my brain. I don't remember when I saw it, but it was stuck there as the "soup can" load. Thank you!

    Soooo...my results.

    I have 2 M94 Win's. a post 64 made in 1964 and a 1972. 8.1 to 8.2 gr of Universal. CCI LR primer in RP brass. Velocity - Unknown, I may take the chrono out next time. Accuracy - subjective...I put every round in a 6" black bullseye at 50 yards offhand out of both rifles. I might take the sandbags out next time as well, but I am officially happy with the plinker load as is. Neither rifle will put 3 Federal classic in that target off sandbags. Then again, nothing I own will shoot Federal classic ammo better than 12ga buckshot.

    No leading in either rifle.

    I do have another Q though. All the primers were backed out of the cases. I suppose there was not enough pressure to force the brass back and "reseat" the primers, but it does raise a concern in my mind. So...is it a cause for concern or par for the course, just ignore it?
    Last edited by seetrout; 10-15-2017 at 02:15 AM. Reason: Add "no leading in either rifle"

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Pa
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by skeet1 View Post
    seetrout
    You may be thinking of an article written by Junior Doughty (a member of this forum that has since past away) on shooting this bullet in the 30-30 with WC 820 surplus powder. Here is part of his article.

    Ken

    The shocker of all my testing was the Lee C309-113-F "soup can"bullet, it is called. I had previously wasted several days trying to get it to shoot using several different powders. Groups at 50 yards ran 6"to 12"and even more. All that little bullet needed to cure its ills was a dose of WC820 (n).
    I used a .7cc Lee dipper for ~10.1 gr WC820 (n). The photo on the right speaks for itself.
    The data:
    AV = 1480 fps; SD = 23; Group size = 5 in 1 1/4"
    That was with the target flapping in the breeze, too!
    [/I]
    Isn't WC820 basically canister grade H110?

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
    oldblinddog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    959
    USMC 6638

  15. #15
    Boolit Master

    skeet1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Enid, OK
    Posts
    1,214
    seetrout
    There are different burn rates of WC820 and some were in the H110 speed. The WC820n (new) is usually considered close to Accurate #9 and is the one that Junior Doughty was using.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Prineville, Oregon
    Posts
    521
    Quote Originally Posted by seetrout View Post

    I do have another Q though. All the primers were backed out of the cases. I suppose there was not enough pressure to force the brass back and "reseat" the primers, but it does raise a concern in my mind. So...is it a cause for concern or par for the course, just ignore it?
    Ignore it -- I also get pooched-out primers in 30/30 with those low-pressure (well below 20k psi according to QuickLoad) loads and have used them in my elderly Marlin for lotsa years.

    And I'm sure you have noticed that you could double (or even triple) charge your 30/30 with Universal. QL says you'd be OK (as in pressure below 50k psi) with the double, but don't try the triple.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master

    jcren's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    South, Central Ok
    Posts
    2,173
    The pushed primers can be cured withdrilled outflash holes.
    "In God we trust, in all others, check the manual!"

  18. #18
    Boolit Master

    TCLouis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Middle TN
    Posts
    4,404
    15.5 2400 was a winner in a friends 30-30 with the 115 grainer.

    Recently found that 7.9 Unique did well for me in the 14" Contender.
    Last edited by TCLouis; 12-30-2017 at 04:20 PM.
    Amendments
    The Second there to protect the First!

  19. #19
    Boolit Master Yodogsandman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    2,948
    I liked a load of 3.7gr Bullseye with GC'd 113gr "soup cans".
    A deplorable that votes!

  20. #20
    Boolit Master Jack Stanley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South of the north pole in the land of the falling waters
    Posts
    4,070
    After shooting a huge pile of gas checked bullets without the checks . I've learned that inspecting the bullets after sizing and rejecting any deformation in the base band works quite well . That band is the last thing to see your rifle and it has to be good .

    Jack
    Buy it cheap and stack it deep , you may need it !

    Black Rifles Matter

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check