Anyone using salt bath annealing? The guru on youtube shows 800*C for his set up. I dont think my small Lee pot will go to that high temperature. Curious what temp others are using?
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Anyone using salt bath annealing? The guru on youtube shows 800*C for his set up. I dont think my small Lee pot will go to that high temperature. Curious what temp others are using?
800⁰C is 1475⁰F which is waaaay to hot for annealing brass case. "IF" (big if) I remember correctly, brass cartridge cases are usually annealed around 700⁰F to 760⁰F range. 1475⁰F is about right for quench temperature for high carbon steels.
Are you sure it wasn't 800⁰F rather than ⁰C?
Ken H>
I think this is the same guy that made the videos. I found several posts of a few forums like this.
http://www.65creedmoor.com/index.php?topic=6019.0
Apparently Celsius is correct. From what I imagine it is about time and heat transfer to the brass. Just because the salt is 500C as he mentions in the post does not mean the brass will be immediately upon insertion. I am thinking that is why there is about a 6 second time to fully annealed. Somewhere else I saw a higher temperature and a 4 second time so that may have been the 800C example.
I am set up for it just need some time to get to it and some empty cases to try it out on.
On every question of construction let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed.
Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823
In the link you provide, he does say 500⁰C, but the salt he's using has a max working temperature of 540⁰C, seems to be pushing it pretty hard. Not sure that Lee pot he's showing will handle 932⁰F very long - waaaay hotter than the pot is designed for as lead isn't near that hot for casting. BUT - he does insist it's ⁰C he's using rather than ⁰F, but do take note of all the comments after the article.
The OP was talking about 800⁰C - which would require the high temperature salts.
Ken H>
Hummmm, think I'll stay with the flame!
Jim
Looks like a heck of a lot of trouble. You can accomplish the same job with much less.
P.S. I wonder what happens to a pair of jeans when they get dripped on by a molten oxidizer considering that 1475 is way over the ignition temperature of most fabrics?
Last edited by Skipper; 10-06-2017 at 03:22 PM.
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To me it seems a lot less finicky and finer grained control. With a flame it seems it would be easier to get hot spots an less even heating.
On every question of construction let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed.
Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823
thankfully, i never have to anneal again these dayze. when i did anneal, it's not rocket science and just a rotating case in a propane flame is all that's needed ... and dropped into a bucket of water to cool.
The thinks one can think! How does he "know" this is better than the prppane torch old school low tech method?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
thanks everyone for your input.
I just processed my first batch using a small Lee pot, PID controlled to 500° C (932° F). I'm happy with the results visually, but of course the proof will be performance on target.Originally Posted by kokomokid
I dropped the hot cartridges in water to cool, it washed all the salt off. Here's a sample from my first batch; the cartridges had already been tumbled with stainless pins.
Looks to be a bit inconsistent from case to case. How did you time the insertion time?
On every question of construction let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed.
Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823
It's ironic that I used a PID to control pot temperature, and just counted to 6 to time soak time - not very repeatable at all.
I think the inconsistency is more from the varying depth of the salt bath than soak time. This was a random sample from a batch of 400 cartridges. Next time, I'll know to top up the salt bath every 5 dozen cartridges or so...
In my defense, I was only going to do a batch of 30, but I got carried away with the excitement of playing with a new toy.
I built a holder like this post to make the depth consistent.
http://www.65creedmoor.com/index.php?topic=6019.0
Now If I can get a new top for my bench made I can give it a spin. Spent a couple of hours driving round trying to get two sheets of MDF but things are being bought as fast as possible still after the storms around here.
On every question of construction let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed.
Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823
I went down this route before. I wish you luck w/ it. I found the salts did not dissolve completely from the brass. And that there are real safety concerns w/ liquid salts at close to 1000 degrees Fahrenheit. Stay safe as molten salts hurt a lot when they land on you.
annealing, or more correctly partial annealing, of brass cases is not rocket science.
all you have to know is that you need to get the necks up to 700 - 750 degrees f.
and you have to keep the bottom 1/2 to 2/3 of the case less than 400 degrees f.
to do this you use tempilaq in such a way that the heat source cannot directly contact the tempilaq and give false readings.
quenching in water is irrelevent to the process.
keep safe,
bruce.
This is the way it is done, anything else is a waste of time and energy
Quenching is irrelevant to the process. But in the case of the salt bath it's required to dissolve the salts that stick to the cases. And w/ flame annealing it allows you to handle the cases immediately. It does nothing to the grain structure but there are reasons to do it.
I see no reason for salt annealing of cartridges. It is appropiately used to temperature blue steel - you can see the color change in the steel through the molten salts, you cannot see them in other molten materials.
Cartridges can be immersion annealed in your lead pot - no color change involved.
Wayne the Shrink
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